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421  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 11, 2014, 10:37:07 PM
Is it just me or do riecoin-qt and riecoind take 5-10 minutes to start up every time?

Try the latest client if you are not already using it, I think is version 0.8.7.

+1

You can also try running with "-checkblocks=1"
422  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 09, 2014, 03:00:32 PM
We will be looking forward to using your pool server. Hopefully it is open source so that we can easily add jh00's implementation of XPT (x.pushthrough) protocol and a tamper resistant developer's fee feature to it.

Of course it'll be open source, the idea is to have as many pools open as possible in order to bring decentralization and more people interested in RIC.
This should also set us appart from XPM which, as far as I know, doesn't have an open source pool implementation.

The protocol I'm trying is stratum, only some field lengths are modified (time, nonce). I already updated the cpuminer for this (not officially released because I couldn't test it yet-  ie it probably doesn't work). I you -or anyone- could later add support for XPT it would be cool.
423  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 09, 2014, 04:10:32 AM
Wow, RIC mining would have paid off two of my research servers trading @ 0.002 BTC/RIC. I do not pay attention to the market but perhaps it is time to.

@gatra: Any estimate on when your pool server code will be ready for testing? Also, for your GPU implementation, will you be targeting AMD or Nvidia GPUs?


sorry, my latest pool server code doesn't compile, yet..

Regarding gpu, I'm using opencl so it should work on both... I have AMD so that's what I'll work with. I worked with C in embedded systems for some years, but I'm new to gpus, so don't expect a very optimized thing. Right now I'm giving priority to pool code, and the only thing I have is -based on cgminer- the modpow function using "naive" multiplication (no karatsuba, montgomery or fft)
424  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 09, 2014, 03:40:53 AM
Apparently setting up a pool for Rie is extremely difficult.

It's not that hard, after all jh00 from ypool did it in a couple of days. Of course he's very talented, but if you have an XPM pool then making one for RIC should be relatively easy...

Also I wish the developer was more active here

it's not the first time I get this...
so let's try this: I'll post a weekly update every Thursday.. here AND on riecointalk.org

so that is why I decided to just sell and move on.

I'm sorry to read that... I'm mining, buying and HODLING
425  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: ★★ What Is Your Favourite Altcoin & Why? ★★ on: March 06, 2014, 09:05:24 PM
Riecoin (riecoin.org) of course!
because of it's PoW
426  Bitcoin / Project Development / Re: Block Crawler - Portable Block Explorer on: March 06, 2014, 07:43:03 PM
used it for Riecoin, http://riecoin.biz/explorer/block_crawler.php and it works!
Thanks!

427  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 06, 2014, 07:08:47 PM
I'd be more then willing to setup a p2pool, but I would need someone to write the PoW module for it, as i don't know C at all.  I would also be able to have a p2pool node list available after the PoW module is ready.

Right on excellent. I'm going to add you and surfer43 to the list then. The bracketed area is more about who we have that is capable of doing certain tasks and is willing. So if someone else comes along and wants to help or ask questions they know who to talk to. Even if you can't do everything needed, you're available to let people know what you can contribute and what is still needed.

Here (in Python):

Code:
def isPrime( n ):
    if pow( 2, n-1, n ) == 1:
        return True
    return False

def riecoinPoW( hash_bin, diff, nNonce ):
    base = 1 << 8
    for i in range(256):
        base = base << 1
        base = base | (hash_bin & 1)
        hash_bin = hash_bin >> 1
    trailingZeros = diff - 1 - 8 - 256
    if trailingZeros < 16 or trailingZeros > 20000:
        return 0
    base = base << trailingZeros
    
    base += nNonce
    primes = 0
    
    if (base % 210) != 97:
        return 0
    
    if not isPrime( base ):
        return primes
    primes = 1
    
    base += 4
    if isPrime( base ):
        primes+=1
    
    base += 2
    if isPrime( base ):
        primes+=1
    
    base += 4
    if isPrime( base ):
        primes+=1
    
    base += 2
    if isPrime( base ):
        primes+=1
    
    base += 4
    if isPrime( base ):
        primes+=1
      
    return primes

This is part of my attempt to implement stratum-mining.
Disclaimer: not tested!

hash_bin must be the hash of the header up to and including nTime (which is after nBits, not like in BTC! be careful with this: the block header is different. nTime is 64 bits. nOnce is 256 bits).
diff is the difficulty as a number (nBits uncompacted)

riecoinPoW returns the number of primes. If you want 4-tuples to be shares you must test that it returns 4 or more.

Best regards,
Gatra

edit: we should test that non-primes don't have small divisors. But since we are allowing any number (except the first of the tuple) to be composite, not only the last ones (as ypool does) this is less important. With the 210 test we are doing that test for divisors 2, 3, 5 and 7
428  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 05, 2014, 02:53:18 PM
http://riecoin.org/: ..

In Primecoin there is no practical way of estimating the time before finding a block, moreover difficulty 10.1 is easier than 9.9 making it impossible to estimate how secure the network is.

This is not correct. At diff=9.9, all 10-chains found are counted as blocks. So a 10.x is always more difficult than a 9.x diff.

By the way diff a.x is more difficult than a.y f x>y, for any a as expected.

Ok, you are right that 10.x is always theoretically more difficult than 9.x. And that it may be possible to estimate the total mining power, but it really is a lot harder, and relies more on practical measurements than in theoretical models.
The thing is that the behavior is non-linear and unexpected. And because of the way miners work, in practice it took less time to find a block at 10.1 than it did at 9.9
This is because at 9.9 the miners make the sieve looking for chains of length 9 but at difficulty 10.01 they sieve for length 10. At this cirumstances, finding a block when difficulty is 10.01 is really faster than when it is 9.9.
If miners were perfect, and knew the exact value at which the sieve for 10 is more effective than the sieve for 9 then it would be different. I don't know that value but it certainly is less than 10. Using existing miners, there exists a pair of values x, y where (for the same mining power) 9.x gives blocks at the same rate than 10.y

So, Primecoiners: making the sieve for z + 1 instead of z when the difficulty is z.9 is a good miner optimization: you'll get more blocks per second. But you'll get less shorter chains/s - so it's an optimization for solo but not for pooled mining.
429  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 05, 2014, 04:34:58 AM
Summary:

- Primecoin uses the Fermat primality test, which has some flaws.
-  Primecoin numbers are not guarranteed to be prime
- A centralized checkpoint system is implemented inside Primecoin.
- Riecoin is capped to a fixed amount of coins (84M), but Primecoin has no limit.
- With Primecoin it impossible to estimate how secure the network is.

It looks like the flaws of Fermat's test a are more rare than I thought, but they are still there. If you wanted cryptographically secure primes, the Rabin-Miller tests done by Riecoin are overwhelmingly more than enough (according to NIST standards) while Fermat's test isn't.

Also:
- Most importantly: cunningham chains != prime constellations
- We are testing Hardy-Littlewood k-tuples conjecture for k=6. And it's not even known if prime sextuplets are infinite. I find this more interesting than Primecoin's scientific value.
- Primecoin's primes are limited to a maximum size while Riecoin's aren't. This may imply Primecoin's verification is faster but more ASIC friendly.


As for which one is better, I'll let you decide. Primecoin still has 30x Riecoin's market cap.
Of course I like mine and I'll defend it Smiley
Hopefully, open source pool software will be a great advantage that will spawn many pools. Will post news soon.
430  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 03, 2014, 05:49:09 AM
As I think Supercomputing mentioned, using larger numbers instead of 2310*n+97, say some number 200 bits long instead of 2310, could go a long way.
Regarding the metric, I proposed "range scanned / s @ diff", but "time per 2*32 nonce @ difficulty" would probably work just as well, just don't forget to adjust for the numbers you are skipping (4 out of 5 in the 2310 case). I agree that it's difficult to compare between different difficulties...



Regarding the roadmap, cool! Very good as a start. I'd add Android wallet next to the Mac wallet, I've been thinking on taking on those 2. Also GPU miner.
Open source stratum-mining is my first priority now, it will get many pools and it's easier to do than p2pool, which should be later on the list. I firmly believe we have the potential to grow big once there are lots of pools online, since that will bring more decentralization and trust.
Also get everyone to accept RIC! and website and video in many languages
But don't disregard what goin2mars says: faucets, giveaways, recognition, TOR, news articles. We got an article on NewScientist! let's get more
Let's complete the article in wikipedia. Also there's a wiki here: http://www.reddit.com/r/RieCoin/wiki/index


it's too late here, need to get some sleep now...
431  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 02, 2014, 04:15:55 AM
I see 0.8.7 on sourceforge but not on github?

Gatra, can you confirm that you are the same gatra that is authoring at https://github.com/riecoin/riecoin.git

Please update github if possible. Thanks.

Hi!

The code already is at github. The name of the branch is "0.8.6-ric" but it contains the latest code and it has the "0.8.7" tag. The "0.8.6" part of the branch name is a reference to the fact that it's based on Bitcoin v0.8.6, I see it may be confusing but if you look at the tags it's there.

I'm gatra at bitcointalk, riecointalk and github. I also have user riecoin at github and sourceforge, and @riecoin at twitter. I own riecoin.org and riecoin.biz. But NOT riecoin.net
432  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, CLIENT UPDATE v0.8.7 AVAILABLE on: March 01, 2014, 03:43:57 AM
Edited OP.

I'm still working on a customized stratum-mining for Riecoin. I contacted a few pools that support non-standard PoWs without success.

Meanwhile, I made an optimized solo miner. Download here: https://sourceforge.net/projects/riecoin/files/cpuminer%20rminerd%203.1.1/

433  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, launches Feb 11, 2014 on: February 26, 2014, 09:06:29 PM
Hey Dev,

Can you contact Gliss to post Riecoin on coinmarketcap.com?

Riecoin needs a static site that displays total supply first. This will come when a block explorer comes on, which I and another user are still working on

It's great that you are working on the block explorer: we really need that, and it would be cool to have a friendly way to display the prime numbers.
In the meantime, I made the site that displays total supply in real time. Now WorldCoinIndex and CoinMarketCap.com are ready to add Riecoin.
I didn't have contact with anyone from CoinMarketCap.com yet, but I just filled their new coin request form.

Thanks and regards,
Gatra

What is the URL for the site that displays the supply?

http://api.riecoin.org/minted
434  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, launches Feb 11, 2014 on: February 26, 2014, 08:50:43 PM
Hey Dev,

Can you contact Gliss to post Riecoin on coinmarketcap.com?

Riecoin needs a static site that displays total supply first. This will come when a block explorer comes on, which I and another user are still working on

It's great that you are working on the block explorer: we really need that, and it would be cool to have a friendly way to display the prime numbers.
In the meantime, I made the site that displays total supply in real time. Now WorldCoinIndex and CoinMarketCap.com are ready to add Riecoin.
I didn't have contact with anyone from CoinMarketCap.com yet, but I just filled their new coin request form.

Thanks and regards,
Gatra
435  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, launches Feb 11, 2014 on: February 26, 2014, 12:21:43 AM
But you will then pay a hefty penalty in mining performance for checking all six candidates instead of an early abort strategy when checking a chain of four candidates. Modular exponentiation is a very expensive operation for the size of numbers that we are dealing with.

Yes, that's why I suggest requiring the first number to be prime. This will filter out lots of cases, so if the effectivity of the sieve is good, the overhead of not doing the early abort wouldn't be that much. Maybe require first 2 numbers to be prime... this should be enough to discourage biasing towards 4-tuples without much overhead.
436  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Service Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][Exchange] Bter.com Announcements [VTC/NXT/MAX added] on: February 25, 2014, 08:10:24 PM
BTER

Please add Riecoin.
Probably the most exciting coin we've seen. I believe this coin will be the underdog of the year. It was lost in the Maxcoin hype as it launched a few days after. Very unique coin!
Riecoin.org

Much thanks!

+9000

Riecoin is innovative, and stable:

I use gitian to build the wallets, so all the dependencies are the same versions used in Bitcoin. This way I leverage all the testing that they have done and provide a stable client.
Moreover, I implemented this patch in an attempt to address the transaction malleability issue: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/3651
437  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, launches Feb 11, 2014 on: February 25, 2014, 07:50:01 PM
Thinking about the pooling issue a bit more, I have a suggestion for how to refine it:

A key danger already identified by the Riecoin creators in using 4-chains as the PoW for pooled mining is the possibility of creating a miner tailored to finding 4 chains.

This isn't theoretical - I've played with a proof-of-concept, and it's both easy and gives a share advantage over a "correct" miner.  I've also run into it on the other side, where by too-aggressively screening out all six candidates, I created mining code that almost never generated a pool share unless it also found a block.  

I don't think it's possible to avoid all bias in this, but a few possibilities make it easier to make a more-correct pooled miner.  The first suggestion also has the advantage of providing a form of variable-difficulty pooled mining that is independently controllable from the Riecoin difficulty itself:

(a)  Minimum divisor requirement for *all* numbers:

   Accept PoW only if:
    (a)  The first four numbers are (MR) prime; and
    (b)  None of the six numbers has a divisor <= N for N=some reasonable size prime.

As an example, the optimized miner jh00 released sieves all six possibilities up to 50,000  (https://github.com/jh000/xptMiner/blob/master/xptMiner/riecoinMiner.cpp ).  A minimum PoW of 50,000 would then exclude any share that has more of a bias towards four-chains than the default ypool miner.

(b)  Generator polynomial matches only

The pattern of primes chosen for Riecoin (p, p+4, p+6, p+10, p+12, p+16) can only occur at certain values.  The simplest polynomial for these is n*210 + 7 and n*210 + 97.  Any miner searching at locations *other* than these is clearly doing something weird, because no valid 6-chain can occur at other locations.  Any non-matching share should be rejected.

  -Dave


Another way around the bias towards 4-tuples, is that the pool should accept any sextuplet of the required form as long as at least ANY 4 of the numbers are prime (instead of the first 4). This way, if you bias towards the first 4 you loose the other combinations. If you bias towards all the combinations, you are at the same time biasing towards the full sextuplets. This would discourage searching for shares instead of actually searching for blocks.
In order to optimize both the miner and the server side checking, I would require only the first p to be prime, as long as at least 3 of the other 5 numbers  (p+4, p+6, p+10, p+12, p+16) are prime too.
438  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, launches Feb 11, 2014 on: February 24, 2014, 05:15:41 PM
Thinking about the pooling issue a bit more, I have a suggestion for how to refine it:

A key danger already identified by the Riecoin creators in using 4-chains as the PoW for pooled mining is the possibility of creating a miner tailored to finding 4 chains.

This isn't theoretical - I've played with a proof-of-concept, and it's both easy and gives a share advantage over a "correct" miner.  I've also run into it on the other side, where by too-aggressively screening out all six candidates, I created mining code that almost never generated a pool share unless it also found a block.  

I don't think it's possible to avoid all bias in this, but a few possibilities make it easier to make a more-correct pooled miner.  The first suggestion also has the advantage of providing a form of variable-difficulty pooled mining that is independently controllable from the Riecoin difficulty itself:

(a)  Minimum divisor requirement for *all* numbers:

   Accept PoW only if:
    (a)  The first four numbers are (MR) prime; and
    (b)  None of the six numbers has a divisor <= N for N=some reasonable size prime.

As an example, the optimized miner jh00 released sieves all six possibilities up to 50,000  (https://github.com/jh000/xptMiner/blob/master/xptMiner/riecoinMiner.cpp ).  A minimum PoW of 50,000 would then exclude any share that has more of a bias towards four-chains than the default ypool miner.

(b)  Generator polynomial matches only

The pattern of primes chosen for Riecoin (p, p+4, p+6, p+10, p+12, p+16) can only occur at certain values.  The simplest polynomial for these is n*210 + 7 and n*210 + 97.  Any miner searching at locations *other* than these is clearly doing something weird, because no valid 6-chain can occur at other locations.  Any non-matching share should be rejected.

  -Dave


I think ypool implements option (a), checking server side for divisors of the last 2 prime candidates.
Regarding (b), actually the only possibility is n*210 + 97 (because n*210 + 7 would be divisible by 7). The RIC client does this check as quick validation to discard bogus blocks before performing RM.
But this is already covered by option (a), since 97 mod 210 is the result of doing a mini-sieve with primes 2,3,5 and 7, hence 210, it's 2*3*5*7 = 210
If you want to add 11 then you have 6 possibilities, not only one anymore.

If you test for divisors up to 50000 then the advantage for having a bias towards 4tuples instead of 6tuples should be negligible.
439  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][RIC] Riecoin, new prime numbers POW coin, launches Feb 11, 2014 on: February 22, 2014, 04:21:00 AM
I don't really believe that Gatra has had his own optimized version of the miner. Even if he did, he wouldn't be able to mine a majority of starting blocks unless he owns a super large botnet.
This was the first fair coin launch that I saw and I think this is why people feel like it was 'hard to mine'. Only 200k Riecoin were created within the first three days. In comparison, Primecoin generated 600.000 XPM within the same timespan. Everyone complaining should just move on and insta-mine the next coin.

Regarding the low value, Poloniex and all the other small exchanges don't really have any buy support at the moment. The value can only go down there. Just take a look at Poloniex stats:
Sell Orders    Total: 24345.77892931 RIC
Buy Orders    Total: 2.35857895 BTC
There are only 300.000 RIC in existence. This means Riecoin only has a market cap of around 200 000 USD. Even the worst of the clone coins have more than that, it is only a matter of time until value shoots up. If you believe in Riecoin it would be a good time to actually buy more RIC and wait for the big exchanges to add it.

I completely agree that this coin was fairly launched. People in my position had the time to study the proof-of-work and start work on their own miner implementations in advance. As for me, I did not have the time until last weekend. I spent about 4 hours implementing my own optimized miner and it is only slightly faster than jh00's implementation.

I will continue to mine both Riecoin and Primecoin. And at this time, I am much more interested in optimizing the miner than I am interested in the coin's current market value - this coin is only a few days old.

So far, my  implementation uses 16,777,216 sieving primes with a 240-bit primorial. This weekend, if time permits, I will search for better pseudo-primorials.


If you're going that route also - have you modified the rminerd in a clean way to handle 256 bit nonce results coming from the scan function?

This would be a great patch to get gatra to accept for the reference implementation.  My own hack is just a silly quick fix, or I'd submit it.  It's a core function needed for a lot of the ways to build a very fast scanner.  I'd be delighted to share some of the work of improving the infrastructure for all of us poking at faster miners.

  -Dave

I did it for 64 bit nonces, which seems enough. Will publish during the weekend, but I think my miner is not faster than xptMiner...
440  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Service Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: WorldCoinIndex.com - Indexing all Cryptocoins and Prices on: February 21, 2014, 10:59:39 PM
cool site!

please add Riecoin
riecoin.org

Thanks
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