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4301  Economy / Speculation / Re: $3k range the new $6k range? on: February 06, 2019, 01:47:33 AM
This time it might not be any different. People are just in it mostly for the money anyways and it doesn't mean anything. Its no different than the people who jump in on a stock like all those pot stocks which they assumed would make them rich

Technically speaking, you may be correct after all, but this is not what most of us would like to know. What we want to know is how low the price will go. I think you will agree that it is a big difference between the price finding a true bottom at 2.5k and at 0.5k. On the other hand, I don't agree that it doesn't mean anything. In fact, it means everything, and still more so with such a speculative asset as Bitcoin, as it is exactly these people who are in for money are driving the prices up (as well as down, for that matter)

Though for you personally, it may not mean anything, of course
4302  Economy / Speculation / Re: BITCOIN IN 2019 on: February 06, 2019, 01:34:52 AM
do you think this bearish trend will continue until Q2 2019?

In my opinion all this year we will see this trend and in the next year we will begin to see the recovery. This year there is nothing that drives a great increase of prices, for example ETF is still pending for approval and its chances of being approved are very few. another case is BAKKT that is also in the same situation as the ETF and their chances of approval are very small. With this I can say that I wait for next year to see the price recovery

do you still want to stand up and hold it until the end of 2019?

this is a long-term investment, something like 2 to 5 years, so expect good results in 2 to 5 years

Expecting results in 2 to 5 years is not what many are actually expecting

For most holders it would likely mean accepting that they lost their cryptocurrency investments. I don't mean that prices won't revert in 5 years (probably they will), but how much? As I see it, the only possible way for prices to return to 20k and beyond is another speculation boom ("bull run") but it basically means that a new, bigger wave of holders should arrive with fresh money, and that may actually take so many years
4303  Economy / Speculation / Re: Is it time to sell Ethereum & all coins , and buy Bitcoin on: February 05, 2019, 08:06:40 PM
So when we are answering this question we need to also ask do we think bitcoin will go down or go up. If we think bitcoin will go up then most likely answer is to keep the altcoins because when going up altcoins go up faster whereas bitcoin goes up slower so there is no point on keeping the money on bitcoin

That's not a given

Obviously, for the majority of altcoins it was a one way ticket to the graveyard, so whether Bitcoin rises or falls, they are going to die anyway. But it is not only them as even top altcoins are unlikely to outperform Bitcoin long term. How come? If Bitcoin is set to rise in the future (which is not a given, either, just in case), most likely it will be due to its real value expanding (as opposed to purely speculative value). But in these circumstances we shouldn't really expect altcoins to rise as much as Bitcoin (let alone outperform it)
4304  Economy / Economics / Re: Warren Buffet has some very wise words. Crypto applicable. on: February 05, 2019, 07:23:17 PM
Those are wise words, better than the crap that comes from john mcafee's twitter posts. Bitcoin will fall, it has fallen many times, buy now at the bottom then sell when it peaks, easy

Absolutely agree with this

People should listen less to publicity whores and drama queens like John McAfee, Craig Wright and their likes, who obviously have their own agenda, while listen more to people like Warren Buffett and Charlie Munger, who don't make empty promises, who are clear and honest about their true intentions

For example, many of us are not quite happy with what Warren Buffett thinks and says about cryptocurrencies in general and Bitcoin in particular but in no case we can call him a liar or hypocrite. In other words, whenever you see or hear John McAfee mentioned, skip it and ignore it
4305  Economy / Speculation / Re: Lesson from the prolonged bear market on: February 05, 2019, 07:06:16 PM
What you should be really thinking in a bear market like this, assuming that you do believe in bitcoin and have the capability to invest for the long run, should be to load up as much cheap coins as possible through dollar cost averaging, instead of trying to time the bottom absolutely correct and/or panic dumping when others are doing so

I wouldn't advise anyone to do that thing

Dollar cost averaging, averaging down, lowering your entry point or anything to that tune is all about adding to a losing position, by whatever name. I don't know how long this bear market is going to last or how low the prices are going to plummet yet but I'm 100% certain that people who have been averaging down since the 20k levels are not quite happy with the results of their investment decision. So think twice before following advices from random dudes on the Internet like this one
4306  Economy / Economics / Re: Cryptocurrency Volatility: Creeping Evil or Essence of Crypto on: February 05, 2019, 06:34:58 PM
I don’t think the goal was to make something that would become a currency in any society, the goal was to create a way of making quick and cheap transactions. Bitcoin is a lot of different from banks and other payment systems, you don’t need emails or to fill out any long information concerning the person you’re sending money to. All you need is just their wallet address and you’re good to go, just copy and paste and that’s it, within a few seconds they have got their money

Are you sure about that?

If I'm not mistaken, Satoshi's whitepaper is called something like "A Peer-to-Peer Electronic Cash System". Cash is synonymous with currency (or money), while cash system as I see it refers to a payment system which makes use of this currency. Apart from that, creating a way of making quick and cheap transactions can be done via creating a currency in its own right (though not only that, of course). Anyway, if you come to disagree, you are welcome to explain your stance in greater detail
4307  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Is the coming halving our last hope? on: February 05, 2019, 06:15:19 PM
Bitcoin broke a new record of bearish market (over a year long). Many people are skeptical about this year as well. Do you guys think that only next halving will change situation on the market and bring back bull run with itself like it was previous time?

The halving won't help us much

If we are to continue slowly sliding down, it won't mend matters, if only temporarily due to hype. The inflow of new coins is already not great (relative to the total number of coins circulating) and halving is unlikely to have a strong impact on prices. Many folks were telling that Bitcoin can't drop below 6k as it would make mining unprofitable. But we already crashed 2 times and probably will crash lower. In this way, halving can be our hope indeed and perhaps even should be as the only thing worse than false hope is false hopelessness, but don't expect too much
4308  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: How long do you think this BEAR MARKET will LAST? on: February 05, 2019, 05:09:10 PM
When bitcoin hits this low there are not many people who are willing to sell lower, the price hits to a level where people are not comfortable with selling their coins which in return means as soon as we have some new hype that makes buyers go into rage mode and gather all bitcoin they can afford we will sky rocket

It is a matter of time until people start selling again, and they will unless we see a surge in demand. When the price falls, people are indeed not inclined to sell at first. But when they get used to these lower prices (especially if there is no sign of recovery), they will start selling again as they need fiat for their daily expenses. After all, 3k is still a huge price compared to, for example, Bitcoin Cash which is worth some measly 120 dollars per coin (though I think that it is still highly overpriced)

That likely explains why we go down in steps
4309  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Do you have a reason to stay? on: February 05, 2019, 03:29:05 PM
Those who invested in bitcoin way back 2009 had not experienced any bull run before nor have much knowledge about the blockchain technology, yet they took the risk to invest. You and I have witnessed a bull run and heard about the numerous potentials of crypto so why do we still have to feel reluctant to invest in bitcoin. Let's be optimistic about our digital assets because its all we have

It cuts both ways

I mean we saw bull runs but we also experienced bear rushes too, and right now we are following one of those. As they say, once bitten twice shy. Apart from that, you can't actually say that the early adopters had taken really great risks. Yes, they had patience to wait (I refer to those who actually managed to wait that long, at least till 2017 tops), but their financial involvement in Bitcoin was not great as they received most of their stashes basically for free (e.g. via CPU or GPU mining)
4310  Economy / Economics / Re: Warren Buffet has some very wise words. Crypto applicable. on: February 05, 2019, 03:02:32 PM
This is a very wise word, many people complain when bitcoin price keep on reducing, but when it reach its peak everyone regret of not buying early, and some of them think crypto as an investment that going to make them rich in an instant, now the bear market had happened for a long time, its time to buy and wait for the reversal

This is, sadly the truth. In the end, as many people suggest, investment is moving the wealth from the masses to individuals, and hopefully, I can be one of those individuals with my holding bags. Last year I learned it the hard way that holding is not always profitable, so it is really important to watch the market periodically in crypto. Unlike traditional assets, crypto is very volatile and this nature makes people hope that they can get rich quickly. Most people are here for the money, they don't care about the tech

Shares are not less volatile than crypto

And this is exactly what Warren Buffett himself says specifically about Berkshire Hathaway stock which plummeted 50.7 percent in less than half a year. Today I read a post by some dude around here who brought forth the very example of Berkshire Hathaway stock as something which can't possibly fall in value, and here you see Warren Buffett in person saying that Berkshire shares have suffered four "truly major dips". Can it really be more ironic than that?
4311  Economy / Economics / Re: Can a new crypto exchange take a place in the market? on: February 05, 2019, 02:13:26 PM
Deisik you are legendary member maybe you remember the times when this numbers were much smaller. Can you remember which exchanges were popular in 2015 and earlier?

I was actively trading back in the day, so it is not a hard question for me to answer. Bitfinex was the most popular exchange back in 2015. I can't say with certainty about now, but it is still one of the top exchanges out there. And I like their approach to margin trading as it is pretty simple and easy to understand (unlike what they do at Bitmex), though I don't quite like them wrongfully liquidating open margin positions as it actually happened to me once

But they admitted being wrong and even paid back the expenses which I suffered due to their mistake

My point is clear, things are changing in crypto faster than in real world! This is not the end of the game, it`s just starting to be interesting as more people are coming in. We can`t predict the future, all I know that even the greatest ones fall from time to time. Competition is healthy for every business, even for this crypto businesses. What am I saying is that we need to be ready for everything, by that I mean don`t hold to much coins in any exchange no matter how popular or big they are

But I don't disagree with this

In fact, I'm using margin trading (i.e. shorts) specifically to keep as little in my exchange account as possible, while still being able to ride short-term price movements. It is just a matter of time when an exchange gets hacked or something else as bad happens resulting in the loss of coins (like what happened at Quadriga). For the record, Bitfinex had already been hacked in the past, though it is still not clear whether it was a "genuine" hack or an inside job
4312  Economy / Speculation / Re: Is 2019 the new 2015? on: February 05, 2019, 01:35:00 PM
Ah well, people apparently want to see the price go up in order to believe that Bitcoin is doing well.  Roll Eyes

But isn't that a valid assumption?

If Bitcoin is actually doing well as you say, why doesn't its price grow after all? Maybe, things are not as good as they seem to you? For example, you refer to an expansion in Lightning Network use but how do you gauge this expansion really? If you are you looking at the data from 1ml.com, 632 bitcoins can't make a dent in Bitcoin's total supply. We would need something to the tune of 100k bitcoins removed from the market to make a meaningful impact on Bitcoin's price (but that may take years)
4313  Economy / Speculation / Re: Mike Novograz: Bitcoin growth still needs to wait a few months on: February 05, 2019, 12:37:19 PM
The market has been extremely generous with people when it comes to allowing them to buy at current levels, and traditionally, markets aren't that generous

Sounds big, what do you mean by this?

And why wasn't the market as generous at 20k levels, for example? Personally, I don't expect Bitcoin to crash a lot lower (if that was your point) but I can't say the same about Bitcoin Cash and Ethereum as it seems to me that their current price is too high for an altcoin (still over 100 for both, which should be around 50). So we may likely see a brutal shake-off in the next few months after all but not so much with Bitcoin as with overpriced altcoins like the ones I mentioned. Time to short both of the houses
4314  Economy / Speculation / Re: $3k range the new $6k range? on: February 05, 2019, 12:19:19 PM
I think it is too early to tell if this is a consolidation phase or just a pause for the next dump. If this mid $3k's price holds for about a year or so I would consider it a safe bet that this is the bottom. But I have a feeling whales, traders etc plan on locking in another slew of bagholders in this range by giving a false feeling of stability. I have never seen a two to three month stable bitcoin price end in a pump always a dump. Just like $6k.

I hear ya, but what about the 2015 sideways? We spent like 10 months in that $200-$320 range. It could have gone either way, just like the sideways at $6K. We could be building out a similar scenario now. We'll only know in hindsight

It's a difference that makes the difference

You can't compare what we see today with the market in 2015. Technically, back then it was an entirely different market which you can't even remotely place against today's. The 200-320 dollar range you refer to (actually it was more like 150-400) would match the price swings in the range of 3k-5k nowadays. I'm strongly inclined to think that most traders would be head over heels happy to see such price action today. But we are nowhere near that
4315  Economy / Speculation / Re: Lesson from the prolonged bear market on: February 05, 2019, 12:00:04 PM
Also, it's better to buy in and average down the prices while you can as it will help you get a better and lower entry point, thus helping you get better profit margins

I can't possibly agree with this approach

And this is likely another lesson that everyone should learn. There is a time-tested and age-old trading wisdom which says to never add to a losing position, and this is exactly what averaging down amounts to.

I'm with you. Among conventional traders, averaging down into a losing position is considered horrible form. It ignores risk management and is the quintessential example of letting losses run

And it is not only that

Existentially, it just shows that you don't know what you are doing (or whoever is employing this approach in practice). Because if you did, you would be either waiting patiently till the price hit the bottom or shorted the downtrend with balls to the wall. If anything, it makes sense to sell first and then buy back into a lower price, and that would lower your entry point in a less risky manner as well (actually, in a much better manner)

To sum it up, if you can’t take a small loss, sooner or later you will have to take the mother of all losses. And averaging down will make your pain only worse
4316  Economy / Speculation / Re: Lesson from the prolonged bear market on: February 05, 2019, 11:02:05 AM
Also, it's better to buy in and average down the prices while you can as it will help you get a better and lower entry point, thus helping you get better profit margins

I can't possibly agree with this approach

And this is likely another lesson that everyone should learn. There is a time-tested and age-old trading wisdom which says to never add to a losing position, and this is exactly what averaging down amounts to. You do lower your breakeven point, that's true, but you do that in exchange for more exposure to a future price fall when it comes about. Now imagine the losses that people would have accumulated by now if they actually had been averaging down from the top at 20k. In short, it is a losing strategy, quite similar to martingale in gambling

4317  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: How long do you think this BEAR MARKET will LAST? on: February 05, 2019, 10:39:19 AM
While checking around, I came across some write-up of how long this bear market have been and we also get to know that this bear market is the longest.

I found out this: https://www.ccn.com/the-crypto-bear-market-wont-last/amp recently.

So what's your own opinion and say about how soon will the bear market be over?

I don't expect much of the next halving on its own

We should understand that while block reward is halved, i.e. the supply of new coins becomes half as much, the total supply is already large enough to make this halving not very relevant other than for hype and noise (i.e. for speculative purposes mostly). But if the cryptowinter is to end (that won't be because of halving), this event may still serve as a good trigger to kick off a new cycle
4318  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Margin trading. Where to start? on: February 05, 2019, 10:18:37 AM
I was looking for some ways to increase my profits and eventually decided on margin trading. I am aware of the risks, but the potential gain impresses. What should I consider before going in for margin trading and which exchange offers more favorable conditions for that?

Okay, let me explain a few things

First of all, you should always remember that with margin trading you are basically playing against the "house". And the house in this case is the exchange where you margin trade. You may be playing against an exchange even when you are long with your own coins, but it is always the case with shorts. In practice, it means you should expect things which you normally wouldn't, for example, exchange forcefully liquidating your margin position on some completely arbitrary grounds (like an alleged glitch in the system)

Second, you should understand how the margin system is supposed to work, i.e. when you are likely to have your position liquidated, and here I mean real liquidation, not the one like described above (i.e. wrongful liquidation). If you don't know or understand how it works, you better stay away from margin trading on this exchange until you do. Otherwise, you risk losing your balance due to a technically legitimate margin call. And remember at all times that you are playing against the house with margin trading
4319  Economy / Speculation / Re: We must work together to crash the price of all coins on: February 05, 2019, 10:09:40 AM
People will sell off coins here at the end of the year to claim a big loss on their taxes.  But we need more than that.  We need bad news.  We need negative press stories.  We need security flaws to be "discovered", even if they don't really exist.

And why do we need this?

To get the prices down so I can buy in cheap to several coins, and then let them ride to BIG PROFITS on the next market cycle upswing!

Gotta get that dolla dolla bill, yo!  Smiley

I agree that we all have to sell and crash the prices of all altcoins.Why?Because they are useless.
But I'm not gonna do this just because you want to make some money out of pump&dump shit. Grin
Go find another "get rich quick" scheme

I can't say that all altcoins are useless

For example, personally, I find Litecoin quite useful, even if for only "pump&dump shit". Kidding aside, if Bitcoin is to become something, it will most certainly have to do with a store of value. But a good store of value can't be a good means of payment at the same time as these things are mutually exclusive to a great degree. So we need an altcoin which would work as a means of payment with Bitcoin being a store of value. And this is where Litecoin fits in perfectly, without any kidding
4320  Economy / Speculation / Re: which way bitcoin price going? on: February 05, 2019, 09:45:03 AM
I really don't know anymore and it really scares me because nothing really moves bitcoin anymore. Unless something HUGE happens I feel like we are going to stay at the same 3-4 thousand levels forever, like something needs to happen and this price needs to change otherwise we are not going to see a bitcoin that is more than this current prices. It really needs to move and it needs to move now, I don't care even if its going down at this point, I just want to see it alive

Be careful what you wish for

As you just might get it finally. This "stability" is very deceptive. It is not the first time we see prices moving in a tight range (though it is definitely longer than usual), but it always ends in a powerful breakout. You may be sure you are not the only one who feels the same way as many traders are not happy with this market either. And to earn as before they have to narrow their trading ranges in such environment and add to their orders

It means that the range between major support and resistance levels is diminishing. At first it leads to price being sort of locked in between the narrowing walls, and this is what we actually see now. But ultimately, when the resistance or support is finally broken, there will a mighty price action either to the upside or downside as it always happens. And I don't think things are much different now (even though it may take longer than usual)
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