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461  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANNOUNCE] Ixcoin - a new Bitcoin fork on: August 12, 2011, 10:59:16 PM
Why go through all these hoops?

bitcoinx.com can do it for you, input difficulty as 4096 and hashrate, it comes out to 0.00053 @ 1024 diff thus now at 4096 you need to get atleast 0.00212 per namecoin to be even with bitcoin mining/price.

The price atm is mostly trailing around 0.002 which makes it just as profitable if not slightly less profitable considering trading fees involved to convert to BTC on the ixcoin exchange.

The previous 1024 and below were really profitable Smiley

Does that math take into account that each found block is worth 96 coins instead of 50? I've not used that site, but in most cases the online calculators do not allow you to change that value...
462  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANNOUNCE] Ixcoin - a new Bitcoin fork on: August 12, 2011, 10:34:16 PM
So here's my latest bit of analysis:

We can approximate an "instantaneous" difficulty if we know the current network hashrate as follows:
Difficulty ~= Hashrate * 0.13969625
If we assume the 133,367 MH/s currently operating on the only IXC pool to be the entire (or at least the majority of) network hashrate then that gives us an estimated difficulty of ~18631 once we get past the "initial climb" difficulties. Assuming this difficulty holds (which it won't) that would require IXC to trade for about 0.005137 BTC each in order for them to be exactly as profitable as bitcoins. At current difficulty of 4096, breakeven value is around 0.001 BTC each. Given that these are the bounds between which price seems to fluctuate, I feel pretty confident in those estimations.

Realistically we won't get breakeven values under normal circumstances, but if we use NMC as an example, they tend to average around 68% of their breakeven value, so we should expect an instantaneous value for IXC somewhere around 0.0035 BTC

Of course there's a lot of assumptions there:
1. 133,367 MH/s is the total network speed - it's not, but with no better tools it's an ok guess
2. The same ratios that hold for NMC will hold for IXC - probably not true as NMC has added value
3. Price follows difficulty - it seems to be the other way 'round actually (but they ARE usefully related for "instantaneous" math)

Does anyone have anything else to add or spot any other flaws in my logic/math?
463  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: GreenGold - a modest proposal for miners with guaranteed returns! on: August 12, 2011, 09:44:23 PM
any comments/improvements welcome!

I somehow doubt that the kind of comments you're going to get on that post will be "welcome"  Wink
464  Bitcoin / Mining software (miners) / Re: bitHopper: Python Pool Hopper Proxy on: August 12, 2011, 09:40:31 PM
I'll see what I can do. NMCWatch looks quite promising and I thank you in advance for the regex Sukrim. c00w, I'd completely forgotten we already have NMC difficulty as well as bitparking, so I'd just need to do the math and override the percentages where necessary... And perhaps add a new role, similar to what you did with mine_slush (mine_nmc perhaps?).

Could also let someone else do the math for us and just compare the USD figures from http://tvori.info/bitcoin/charts/ - easy regex too, from the look of it.
465  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANNOUNCE] Ixcoin - a new Bitcoin fork on: August 12, 2011, 08:01:49 PM
After thinking about it, the reality is that I have way more ixcoins than I have bitcoins.  So why should I want bitcoins to succeed over ixcoins, even if the creator of ixcoins didn't really add any value, and he reserved a huge chunk for himself?  Ixcoins are functionally no worse than bitcoins.

Except that Metcalfe's Law says that bitcoin is functionally vastly superior.
I'm not sure that necessarily applies in this case.

It might serve as an interesting test, though. I'd be interested to know precisely how many participants p (over time) BTC, NMC and IXC have and compare the exchange rates to the relative values p(B)^2, p(N)^2 and p(I)^2 expressed in Metcalfe's Law. It would at least be an interesting exercise (if I could find the data)
466  Bitcoin / Mining software (miners) / Re: bitHopper: Python Pool Hopper Proxy on: August 12, 2011, 07:48:06 PM
@enmaku
Its not very hard. Someone just has to code it.

I'll see if I can find the time this weekend to give it a shot. The big hurdle is that, to my knowledge neither of the bitparking exchanges has an API available, and I'm not exactly a regex master.

If anyone knows of such an API or happens to have some already-existing regex to get the current NMC value I'd be forever in your debt.  Grin
467  Bitcoin / Mining software (miners) / Re: bitHopper: Python Pool Hopper Proxy on: August 12, 2011, 07:43:09 PM
So all this craziness with IXCoin recently has me thinking... How hard would it be to code in some checks to automatically compare the profitability of BTC, NMC etc. to automatically make the switch for the brief span in which NMC mining is more profitable? Once difficulty settles down on IXC we could do the same for them (easy enough since bitparking runs both the NMC and IXC exchanges). We could hack together the logic and just have the appropriate bitparking pool represented as some arbitrary low percent when it's more profitable and use the standard 10^10 when it's not, all configurable of course.

Anyone know how hard it would be to do this?
468  Other / Archival / Re: delete on: August 12, 2011, 07:31:10 PM
Sure, about the same as they have been.  Do you have some reason to believe that they'll go up?

Hey Chris, the Ixcoin exchange is blocked for me at work.  What's the current exchange rate right now?  I can't see it.  Last night I remember it was .0008.  Can you tell us what it is now?  Thanks!

It was around 0.0015 leading up to the difficulty increase.  It's hovering around 0.0021 right now.  Not exactly impressive, considering that the difficulty quadrupled.  The price range has mostly stayed around 0.001 to 0.002 since the exchange started.

If the hashrate hasn't dropped since I last checked, there'll be another 4x difficulty increase in about a day and a half.

We're still in the "initial climb" stage for difficulty, so analysis is difficult. That said, IXC has gotten a LOT of attention this week, certainly enough that as many people are aware of it as are aware of NMC. NMC may have an actual use aside from just currency, but bitparking NMC volume vs actual dot-bit registrations should prove that it's NOT being traded because of its intended purpose. I expect to see IXC on competitive par with NMC, perhaps moreso considering that it's far easier to use than the current command-line-only NMC implementation. That said, I'm holding on to most of the IXC I generated when difficulty was 4. I could maybe get a few hundred USD out of them right now but I think this market is just getting started.

Edit: Oh, and as for this:
Quote
Not exactly impressive, considering that the difficulty quadrupled
As I mentioned, we're still in the "initial climb" phase. Whether you're of the school that believes difficulty influences price (or vice versa) I think we can all agree right now that difficulty is meaningless. If you've got some analysis once it STOPS climbing by factors of four let me know  Grin

On a related note, look what NMC profitability was like during their "initial climb" - http://tvori.info/bitcoin/charts/ (the light blue line).
469  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: IxCoin is a SCAM on: August 12, 2011, 07:19:55 PM

So basically, at current Ixcoin difficulty, in the time it takes me to mine 1 Bitcoin, I could mine about 1000 Ixcoins and sell them for about 2.4 Bitcoins.
Nice...if that is true, then it should get arbitraged away *very* quickly.  I think if I had any IxCoins I'd want to sell before that happens.  It's not too often that you can more than double your mining yield like this (but again, it's probably a good idea to act quickly).

It's not any different than the brief periods of time where namecoin is more profitable than bitcoin, really. Check out http://tvori.info/bitcoin/charts/ if you're not familiar with this phenomenon. Specifically go to the "all time chart" at the bottom and watch the relationship between the green line (BTC profit) and the blue line (NMC profit). If we had several more popular and well-known forks we might see network hopping as widespread as pool hopping is today. As long as you can determine (in real time) the BTC value of NMC/IXC/whatever and the difficulty of each network, it's trivial to determine where your GPU will make the most cash.

For the record, I do expect the profit differential to be arbitraged away quite quickly, but we probably won't see a stable exchange rate until we see a stable difficulty. Every increase thus far has been a factor of four (currently at 4096) and block times have been well under a minute. With the exception of the brief times when NMC mining is more profitable, NMC seems to have a stable value of 0.03 BTC or so, meaning that it's usually worth about 68% of what you'd get for the same time/equipment mining BTC. We're still in the "initial climb" phase of difficulty with IXC, but I'd expect a similar result once the initial climb is over.

Only time will tell of course.

As for the "value" IXC adds? I'm not so sure that too many exist, certainly less value than namecoin - but one look at the trade volume on bitparking's NMC exchange compared with the actual number of .bit registrations should tell you it's as much a speculative commodity as bitcoin. Speculators in NMC are betting that its potential as a DNS replacement will make it more valuable in the future, and with IXC the bet is that hitting a deflationary curve earlier than BTC will increase its relative value as it will be deflating while BTC is still inflating.

If nothing else, trading BTC for IXC or NMC and then trading them back goes a long way toward anonymizing non-generated BTC since the IXC and NMC exchanges don't deal in regular fiat and therefore don't care so much about who their customers are.
470  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANNOUNCE] Ixcoin - a new Bitcoin fork on: August 12, 2011, 05:46:50 PM

Are you sure they are not the same person? LOL

Fred Twingham at least isn't immediately apparent as an anagram of anyone I know in the bitcoin community (Thomas Nasakioto ≅ Satoshi Nakamoto)
471  Other / Off-topic / Re: test out my game on: August 12, 2011, 05:34:27 PM
Lol, I'm probably not cut out for this sort of game if I can't get past the 1st level, eh?  Tongue

I've tried everything I can think of that N/A stands for, nothing works.  Hmmm...

View the source you must... Difficult, the path of the hacker is, mmm yes - but walk it you will! Your destiny it is.....

On an unrelated note, level 6 can die in a fire... Why? Because f**k math, that's why. I'm 99% sure I'm failing due to rounding errors... When you say [8 dec places] do you mean to ROUND to 8 or TRUNCATE at 8?
472  Other / Off-topic / Re: test out my game on: August 12, 2011, 05:13:14 PM
Once you locate the GIF you will find that it is corrupt. You need to download the corrupt GIF file. I'll leave out the last step even though it should be fairly obvious.

D'OH! that was pretty obvious. I knew it had to be something stupidly simple that I was just missing.
473  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANNOUNCE] Ixcoin - a new Bitcoin fork on: August 12, 2011, 05:11:34 PM
There's a guy here saying the code will break once it reaches 21 million coins
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=36701.msg451411#new

Which makes it no different than a couple old versions of the bitcoin client. An oversight in the code doesn't make it a scam, though I am keeping a close eye on how quickly this one gets fixed...
474  Other / Off-topic / Re: test out my game on: August 12, 2011, 05:07:31 PM
OK, since a lot of people seem to be stuck on lvl 5 I will give quite an obvious hint.

Gambling Is Fun

Yeah I saw that but it's not helping...  Maybe I'm still just looking at the wrong thing  Embarrassed
475  Other / Off-topic / Re: test out my game on: August 12, 2011, 04:56:13 PM
Stuck on L5 also. I'm hoping it's just me being blind to the obvious because the difficulty was scaling quite nicely on 1-4 but compared to the time I've spent on 5 they were trivial...
476  Other / Archival / Re: delete on: August 12, 2011, 04:32:18 PM
Sure, about the same as they have been.  Do you have some reason to believe that they'll go up?

Hey Chris, the Ixcoin exchange is blocked for me at work.  What's the current exchange rate right now?  I can't see it.  Last night I remember it was .0008.  Can you tell us what it is now?  Thanks!



Last Price:   0.00214300   High:   0.00249800   Low:   0.00023231   Volume:   346938.55050340   Time:   08/13/11 04:31:50
477  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: IxCoin is a SCAM on: August 12, 2011, 04:04:40 PM
i dont see why you guys even need to see this. the guy privately mined like 400000 coins before he published it.

That was all I needed as well along with the no improvements.  It might have been an improvement if they REDUCED the block reward by 4 and doubled the speed of blocks.  Maybe.  But the only change they made was actually something most people would point to as going in the wrong direction. 

Increasing block speed has been discussed. All it would do to double block speed is to halve the security of each block so instead of needing to wait 6 blocks before considering a transaction to be confirmed/secure you'd have to wait 12.
478  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANNOUNCE] Ixcoin - a new Bitcoin fork on: August 12, 2011, 02:56:48 PM
Again with the people seeking higher purposes and making obvious fallacies: "why do we need another blockchain?" we don't, necessarily NEED another blockchain, but someone thought bitcoin would be better with a steeper initial rise so we get to the deflationary fun faster so they made one simple change. "But we're diluting the bitcoin brand by allowing IXCoin to exist!" Maybe there's *some* truth to that one, but in the long run is FireFox a better or worse product when it must compete with Chrome, Opera, Safari, IE etc? Is there a need for silver bullion when we have gold? Do we really need as many varieties of sliced white sandwich bread as I see in the supermarket? And how many kinds of toilet paper can one grocery store possibly sell? Competition isn't a bad thing and not every competitor need offer a drastically different product.

Edit: and while I was posting, dancupid said it much more eloquently and with fewer words Wink
479  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANNOUNCE] Ixcoin - a new Bitcoin fork on: August 12, 2011, 06:04:40 AM
I like how we all pretend that forks have to have some extra purpose or other functionality aside from just using different math and Namecoin is always everyone's favorite example. Sure, it serves a meaningful purpose and that's awesome, I'm happy it's there and agree with its purpose, but really look at the trade volume on Bitparking's NMC exchange and look at how many registrations ACTUALLY happen on the namecoin network in a day and tell me it's not just another den of speculation...
480  Bitcoin / Project Development / Re: New release of MultiCoin client a branch of the BitCoin client on: August 11, 2011, 03:56:31 AM
I have boost in my MinGW libs folder, but there aren't any hpp files at all. Did it not install correctly or something?

And no, now that I test the vanilla client won't compile for me either Sad
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