Mutum Sigilum looks like it was set up for a completely different business, and was just conveniently co-opted when the online exchange business took off. Gox grew fairly organically from nothing, after all.
Yes, I see that too. Mutum Sigilium was created in Delaware on 05/09/2008. Still, after those FinCen regulations came out last month, there's really no excuse for such an oversight on Gox's part. No excuse? It's only been a month, and these things take time and can be very onerous. Gox has had it hard lately -- Repeated DDOS, unfriendly business "partners" suing them for not giving up their customers, and now this... I really hope the last two points (or indeed all of them) aren't related. That would be more than disappointing. |
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It is not improbable that a separate charge is lodged against Mark Karpeles and be extradited, being single owner of Mutum Sigillum LLC, based in Delaware.
Isn't Mark attending bitcoin2013 ? It's located in the US, so that would be a good time to arrest him wouldn't it? Not that Japan wouldn't extradite him. But this sounds like a good opportunity to bring him to "justice" quickly. Yes, but I hope they don't. The law may be the law, and Mt Gox can improve, but he doesn't deserve to be arrested for this. |
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MtGox US LLC may have dropped the ball with their Dwolla account linked to their US company acting as a US to BTC gateway and not being registered with FinCEN.
Yes, it's looking like that is the extent of it, which is a relief. Failure to register their US subsidiary as a Money Service Business is completely negligent, but at least this doesn't seem to involve an actual money laundering charge. The subsidiary, Mutum Sigillum LLC, doesn't appear to be registered on the FinCen site: http://www.fincen.gov/financial_institutions/msb/msbstateselector.htmlMutum Sigilum looks like it was set up for a completely different business, and was just conveniently co-opted when the online exchange business took off. Gox grew fairly organically from nothing, after all. |
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Strange how it's taken this long to discover Mt.Gox wasn't doing things by the books (according to local laws), as I am fully aware they operate out of Japan, However they do apparently have a US company, with connected US accounts.
Which also the US operations were suppose to been taken over by another company by now, which didn't happen, so they in trouble with that as well.
Their stack of cards seems to be falling apart. Ouch.
There has been a decent number of other exchanges doing the same things shutting every year, obviously not lasting very long, yet they only looked at one of the biggest out there now? Talk about odd. How expensive are the US money service licences anyway, surely Mt.Gox could of afforded them, as one of the largest exchanges out there, right?
It isn't about "affording" anything. Its about the regulations that are imposed and the requirements one must meet to get a license which essentially prevent many businesses from operating. I've studied what is needed in the UK and apparently we are well known for being strict in this area. However since I have no intentions of operating in the USA, I don't know it's requirements or costs. Mt.Gox when I used it (last year) was annoying with all the verification of your details, so it easily did all of what was necessary for the requirements. So does it really all come down to the fact it wasn't declaring that account was being used to move money around? Exactly -- it looks to me like they were generally acting in good faith in terms of the regulations. They were quite strict, and just for a minority of payment flows at that. As it's not that easy for a foreign company to open a bank account in the US, it looks like they just did what they could for Dwolla. I wouldn't be surprised if Coinbase were behind this. |
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Off-topic: look how far we have fallen since 9/11. I think it's fair to say the terrorists have won.
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I think it's fair to say the terrorists have won
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Yesterday's troll was just a precursor. The real trolling has yet to begin.
Fixed that for you. |
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The real panic sells haven't even started.
Bullshit |
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It's feeling kinda... Bullish.... In here.
Good. It's been a while.
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That's what I believe and that's all that matters.
This is becoming a running theme in these forums. I don't watch TV, and certainly not reality shows... but I would start if there were one with you and rpietila trapped in a lift (elevator) together. Surely, hilarity would ensue! |
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Anyway, a bit of perspective...  Wasn't really even a blip, was it? Much less deep, although admittedly much less decisive than the blockchain fork even in March. This plateau we've been experiencing actually reminds me a lot of that time, just on a slightly longer timescale. The price could admittedly do anything, but as time goes on, a continuing crash does appear to be increasingly unlikely. Even if volume is weak and we hold at around $110 - $115 for another couple of weeks, any downtrend will be pretty much broken. |
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Stop feeling the troll. Coinseeker is a retard. He's hoping the market goes down so he can buy back in. He's fourkey2001 2.0. Just click ignore, stop quoting him if you do reply, and move on. Pointing out he's wrong just makes he move onto some new FUD.
And here comes the name calling. Ah...yes. The height of supreme intelligence.  Not sure how wanting the price to drop makes me a bad person and certainly warrants being called names. I guess you'd prefer there was a Bull section and a Bear section so you wouldn't have to read any posts contrary to your beliefs and opinions? Segregationist? You should tread softly, Coinseeker. Arguing with unalloyed Bulls or Bears is like arguing with freshly-converted religious zealots. If your opinion differs, it's simply data noise to be squelched. If you introduce logic to your arguments, your arguments become malicious noise. You know, it's funny you say that. I made that comment to my wife that some of these people are so hateful, nasty and have views that are anti-humanity, that I'd rather hang out with religious nuts and listen to them judge me with their twisted versions of the bible. And that's bad. Sadly in the US, many of these folks are one and the same. The upside is many of them spend their money building bunkers to hide from society so that works out for the best. Out of sight, out of mind.  In the end I feel sorrow that such anti-social personalities need exist. I think many just need a hug. I'm sure IRL most of them are just fine. It's a weird situation here, and the timing is bad. Bad news -- people get sensitized & edgy. My own dog snapped at me when he was really hurt.  Not a one of us is perfect...we all fall short, especially me. But there is no excuse for treating people outside of how you want to be treated, so please don't try to justify it. It's only money. Finally, a point we can agree on :-) |
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If there's bigger news in the morning about DHS launching criminal proceedings against Gox, yesterday's downswing will look mild. If the biggest BTC exchange loses the ability to do business with US clients, that's a _huge_ problem, and not at all a case of having weak hands or being too bearish.
Oh for sure. If they go after Gox directly...that's 80% of the market, frozen. These prices may make no sense to me at the moment but there is no way, I'd be keeping anything at Gox right now. You're just asking to lose it all. And nothing says they have to give it back either. On a side note: This stuff is really fascinating. What a unique time in history. The solution is to keep your assets in BTC in your own wallet, not as fiat or BTC in exchange accounts. Which really is nothing new. Buying BTC to transfer out makes sense but holding a devaluing currency is just silly when I can convert to fiat somewhere else and rebuy low. Your constant desire to buy lower (along with others like you) when you have already had ample opportunity is what is devaluing the currency. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. At some point, the momentum of what you are trying to do in the short term will overwhelm any momentum that will allow you to gain longer-term. People will just get bored. Then you can buy your cheap coins, and keep them. No, a warrant from homeland security and a possible shutdown of the largest exchange (80%), is devaluing the currency. Don't blame me for being a bear and I still think we're going to double digits and probably retesting our 50-60 lows. I hope DHS rains fire in the morning. Cheap coins for all! Hopefully me saying it does fulfill it. Happy now? No, shutting down fiat payment flows does NOT devalue a currency intrinsically able to route around such problems. Furthermore making it more difficult to obtain does not decrease it's value. Frittering away market value speculatively just at the time when big investors may be looking to come on board, does. |
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It could be anything...
"Because Iran" seems to be a popular reason these days.
It's quite ridiculous. Revolution long overdue.
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If there's bigger news in the morning about DHS launching criminal proceedings against Gox, yesterday's downswing will look mild. If the biggest BTC exchange loses the ability to do business with US clients, that's a _huge_ problem, and not at all a case of having weak hands or being too bearish.
Oh for sure. If they go after Gox directly...that's 80% of the market, frozen. These prices may make no sense to me at the moment but there is no way, I'd be keeping anything at Gox right now. You're just asking to lose it all. And nothing says they have to give it back either. On a side note: This stuff is really fascinating. What a unique time in history. The solution is to keep your assets in BTC in your own wallet, not as fiat or BTC in exchange accounts. Which really is nothing new. Buying BTC to transfer out makes sense but holding a devaluing currency is just silly when I can convert to fiat somewhere else and rebuy low. Your constant desire to buy lower (along with others like you) when you have already had ample opportunity is what is devaluing the currency. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. At some point, the momentum of what you are trying to do in the short term will overwhelm any momentum that will allow you to gain longer-term. People will just get bored. Then you can buy your cheap coins, and keep them. |
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If there's bigger news in the morning about DHS launching criminal proceedings against Gox, yesterday's downswing will look mild. If the biggest BTC exchange loses the ability to do business with US clients, that's a _huge_ problem, and not at all a case of having weak hands or being too bearish.
Oh for sure. If they go after Gox directly...that's 80% of the market, frozen. These prices may make no sense to me at the moment but there is no way, I'd be keeping anything at Gox right now. You're just asking to lose it all. And nothing says they have to give it back either. On a side note: This stuff is really fascinating. What a unique time in history. The solution is to keep your assets in BTC in your own wallet, not as fiat or BTC in exchange accounts. Which really is nothing new. |
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Here is my prediction for next weeks trading on Mt.Gox  i didnt know the US govt. had jurisdiction in Japan. They have jurisdiction over the .com domain names. And the 7th fleet to prove their point if Japan finds anything to say against it  Wait, you're proud of the fact that your government can censor the Internet? |
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A lot of people haven't had time to react to this news/non news story yet.
But if they hear the news and see the price recovered, will they do something?  This is bitcoin, logic doesn't apply so anything could happen of course! What logic? There's not much logic in selling _after_ the fact, when the bottom could already have come in -- safer to hold. There's not much logic in selling unseizable currency to buy fiat when the government is trying to prevent you from receiving it. There's not much logic in expecting non-US people to react to news that only affects users of a small payment service provider that only offers its services to US citizens. |
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Is this deal still open?
Beat me to it. I'm not bearish long term, but buys on gox will suffer amid the more casual US trader seeing gox-->fiat liquidity evaporate with the stroke of pen. On the contrary, if you can't get USD out, your only option is to buy. Anyway that is academic, because you can still get USD out -- just not via Dwolla. I get the feeling that whales don't use Dwolla ;-) |
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In China, you can buy Bitcoins pretty much instantly with the two Chinese equivalents of PayPal.
Dwolla only caters to the USA -- I actually signed up with them; they looked international... but there's just no way to put in anything other than US details.
This news weakens the perceived value of traditional online payment processors -- they can be blocked at any time on a political whim.
Bitcoin, on the other hand -- can't.
Short term the price dropped, but it is actually pretty bullish news long-term. The US can continue to shoot themselves in the foot. They're getting quite good at it.
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