Well another thing would be to have them post under their own name like you seem to be suggesting Timelord, but I am thinking that if they are my agent(s), then they should post under a Nym that I am able to control and that clearly states the relationship.. otherwise it is too ambiguous, too weird, and even likely to have backlash on me, too... and maybe even harder to keep track if there were to be multiple accounts (besides starting out with one), so now, I am already getting more worried about these kinds of ideas, but I have not yet put such a thing into practice, and I am ONLY thinking about doing it and I am in the conceptual stages.. and I would think that if I clearly state the relationship and maybe even place a neutral trust explainer into my profile and into the profile of my other Nym, then that should be helpful so long as they do not do dumb shit (like Loyce mentioned) in regards to employing the short-cut allure of plagiarism.

Perhaps members here would send you more smerits if you tried to make your images more presentable?  size.

For sure that infographic makes sense if you know what Foss's argument is.

So he is asserting that the whole current addressable market of value that bitcoin could represent is $900 trillion, and if bitcoin were to capture 5% of that addressable market, then bitcoin would be worth $210k at this time.  

Yet our current bitcoin price is quite a bit below $210k, which means that you should continue to buy bitcoin.  

on the other hand, if you do not believe the model, then you better rethink your thinkings about the model because it is fairly conservative model (and still buy bitcoin while you are rethinking your model.. hahahahaha)  

It's a great argument, once you understand it... and that graph is a wee bit mathematical.. but if you continue to think about what it means, then it should start to make sense for anyone who is older that 10 years old (presumably able to employ logic.. hahahaha and some folks younger than 10 years old should be able to understand these kinds of concepts and logic, too).


Sure no problem.. .but pee pare ur lil selfie for UP, too..

In other words, be careful in terms of overly preparing for a DOWN that may or may not end up happening.

Remember $4k in 2019.... there was a bit of dancing around before the BTC price finally broke above it.

I surely have buy orders down to around $13k, but it is quite possible that we will never see sub 200-week moving average, ever again (I mean in this cycle).

Remember 2015?

We spent more than 8 months largely around mid-$200s, and we had one test of $300 in July, yet in January 2015 we had a dip down to around $150... and then again in August we had another test of $200.. but it did not really break below $200, but it sure felt dire and low to get a second test of down around 8 months after the first test of down.. and those kinds of test are not inevitable, even if they happen, and there were still quite a few folks who failed to prepare for UP during that time, and any coins that you bought through most of 2015 would have been good to buy even if your confidence was not that great and even if you might have had some cash in reserves just in case the BTC price dropped lower..

so it was not completely easy to get back above $300.. but it ended up happening. and then those sub $300 prices were not even available.. and the same ended up being true for sub $500 coins in May 2016.. so the dire gloom about dips being inevitable or having high odds of happening should not preclude you from making sure that you are prepared for up (even if you are simultaneously preparing for down (just in case))...


Fuck crypto.


Hopefully you are prepared for Up too, little mouse.. just in case your downity prayer does not end up happening as you be hopening.

Lot's of people end up fucking themselves when they either get too greedy in their downity preparations.. and at the same time failing/refusing to do the prudent things, such as DCAing or at least having some preparations for UP.. rather than hoping for a bargain that may well not end up happening... and you might even be lucky to get any more coins below the 200-week moving average which is at about $23k right now.


Horey sheit.. !!

anyone selling to buy back lower is dumb as fuck.

Even though there are ways to shave some of while the price is going up to have insurance in case it goes down.. but that is a different story than any kind of need to be selling large portions of your stash at these prices.

On the other hand: Do whatever the fuck you want.  Sell all your BTC waiting for the price to make a lower low (such as sub $17,593), and have fun staying poor..   even waiting for sub 200-week moving average or alternatively sub $21k could end in the same results.. the HFSP results.

Don't get me wrong.. I am a BIG advocate for DCA especially for anyone in their earlier stages of BTC accumulation, but I am even a BIGGER advocate for attempting to accustom your approach to your own particular personal circumstances, and surely anyone who figures out what are their BTC accumulation targets, then they become way more empowered to be flexible in their approach with their getting closer towards reaching their targets or even being on time (or ahead of schedule) in terms of their timeline to reach their BTC accumulation targets.

Therefore, even though I consider DCA to be the best "getting started" BTC accumulation strategy, buying on dips, lump sum buying and even HODL can end up supplementing such DCA strategies.

I also personally believe that if your budget is not very high, and therefore your extra amount of cashflow that you can invest into bitcoin is also not very high, it could take you 5-10 years before you are even able to move off of a strict BTC accumulation strategy, and at the same time if someone is somewhat trying to study their finances, they might surely feel that they are becoming much more empowered by employing DCA on a regular basis and even strategically tweaking within their DCA approach.. and such feelings of empowerment would thereby grow with the passage of time.. and maybe even if the amounts of dollars that were used to invest into BTC had not felt like very much after a certain amount of time, there may well be needs to study how to improve security and to get those accumulated coins into a kind of cold storage because no one should want to have their coins in any kind of vulnerable place such as on an exchange or somewhere in which security could be compromised or other kinds of ways that you could end up getting parted with the coins that you may well have spent so many years building up.

I am pretty sure that I would be reviewing all the posts until I get to trust anyone posting from the account.. and that sometimes my own inabilities to sufficiently delegate...   but yeah, I am not really used to using plagiarism tools.. and for sure I would not want posts that are not either original content or adequately citing the source.. so I suppose that should be part of the training process regarding citing sources properly... and in writing my response, I can see where there could end up being a danger because so many folks do like to take short-cuts.. and surely teachers these days have become experts on searching for plagiarism.

I was planning on creating an alt account that would clearly be connected to me because it will have some variation of my name within it, and I am planning to use it as a kind of business account.. meaning that it would be tied to a kind of work/project that I am doing and planning to do.. and I am thinking that my first post with such account (once I make it) will attempt to describe what I am going to try to do with the account that is connected with me.. might not always be me posting from it (even though I have authorized all the posts therein)... something like that... still working out the details.

Of course, for me, I would not be cross trusting or sending smerits to such account.. and I am not sure if there might be backlash or confusion.. and I am hoping to work most of that stuff out as I go.. .. but still it is a project that I am "getting around to" in terms of how it is going to be presented on the forum and through my intended alt account.

I have come to believe that countries who do not have their own currencies are more inclined to adopt bitcoin as legal tender, so there seems to be a bit of a lack of an incentive for countries with a currency to adopt bitcoin and they may well start to employ policies and practices that are more hostile to bitcoin.. that's my current thinking about trying to consider what factors would be more important to attempt to predict which countries are more likely to be next.

Here's an example proving my point.  Some peeps just lock away their sats and they find other things to do in life to keep them busy, entertained, which should not be a problem..   We should not have to babysit our sats. .. even though sometimes there do seem to be scary things going on in the world.. on the regular.


Wow shock my lil selfie to death!!!!

I am surprised to see Biodom criticizing anyone for being overly pessimistic, and I am not even disagreeing with anything that you are saying, Biodom.

I do have a question, however.

How are you going to get to $400 million in BTC value with your 20 BTC if you start shaving off along the way?

I am partially joking, but partially I am not, also?   

Even if you are not drawing examples from the JJG playbook (and I am not even claiming complete authorship over such playbook - since I am just stealing plays from others anyhow)..you do seem to be becoming more receptive to ideas of selling some of your BTC along the way....

Maybe you have also become more receptive to the idea of overinvesting too.. rather than merely resting on the laurels of your 20 BTC purchased in 2015?    I will tell you one thing (not trying to be too preachy.. just a little preachy), it surely would have been much easier to have had added more BTC at lower prices between 2016 and 2020 rather than doing it now, but it's never too late to add an additional amount of BTC onto your stash so that you do not end up feeling much if any compunction when shaving a bit off in 2025 or whatever might be your target shaving date into the future (and we know that the circumstances of individuals will vary in terms of reasonable, feasible and prudent shaving dates). 

Short-term players may well be able to ride some BTC price waves that are in periods of less than 4 years, and intermediate players might be able to ride some BTC price waves that are 4-8 years, and surely some folks might not really be able to ride waves of 8 years or longer, but it seems to me that if any of us had been persistent and even marginally aggressive in our BTC investment in a period of 8 years or longer, we should be able to ride some BTC price waves and to feel comfortable shaving off some of our lil precious if we had been involved in BTC for 8years or longer, and if your personal goal is 2025.. then that would be getting close to 12 years plus-ish.. so even if previously whimpy there should still be reasonable and prudent ways to shave off some BTC profits (aka ride the BTC price waves) in that period of time. .not that I am suggesting shaving all at once (because 20% is a lot to shave all at once.. but sometimes it may well be clear that lump-summing may well work out better than incrementalism).
 if you are going to

You are speaking gobbledy-gook, and not even likely from a position of an informed person.

You come to lecture us about a topic that you do not seem to understand, so perhaps asking some questions and making some more simple observations might be in order, no?

There are all kinds of injustices in the world, and some of them seem to relate to bitcoin in one way or another, but if you have hardly any clue about what you write, then you may well not recognize bitcoin as part of the solution rather than the problem, but you still would need to figure out how to invest and how much in order to end up being empowered by it rather than seemingly frustrated by it and mixing up your topics, at the same time.


Even though you are providing information about an existing phenomena, sometimes during periods like this people get a bit frustrated and give up, which might not be a bad thing to just go away for a few months... or maybe longer?  

I cannot bring myself to go away completely, and I do have some bitcoin related projects in mind that I might be better able to focus on such bitcoin-related projects when the BTC price is still seeming to be in a kind of doldrums.. and sure, there is some decent possibility that all of a sudden BTC price is no longer consolidating.. which gets us back to the "being distracted by price" phenomena.

Regarding the poll, I did appreciate the link that Fivestar4everMVP had provided - even though it is difficult to have very much confidence in such a poll - but if such a poll were made through prediction markets (in which betting was involved) then the information would likely be a better predictor regarding what might happen..

Of course, short-term measurements are going to be difficult to measure for some of the reasons that you mentioned; however, 2 to 4 to 6 to 10 years down the road there should be some abilities to make assessments regarding how well various bitcoin promotional efforts are spreading through society and potentially starting to stick in terms of whether more citizens might have started to use bitcoin, continued to use bitcoin and even held bitcoin.   

Difficulties in measuring should not justify giving up upon measuring or proclaiming that bitcoin efforts are having little to no positive effect, and for sure there are going to be ambiguous (and perhaps even contradictory) information that is being gathered that cause even more challenges to assess the extent to which bitcoin adoption is both growing and/or having positive effects that might justify the amount of financial and brain resources that are put into building and expanding such systems.

Your proclamation that you have knowledge about "online currencies" is not very convincing, and of course, the main "online currency" of interest in this thread is king daddy, so hopefully, if you do happen to know something about something, then if you are able to put it within the framework of understanding bitcoin then that would be a great start... and another great start would be if you have actually accumulated some in the past couple of years since your forum registration (even though you have already conceded that you failed/refused to buy BTC back to 2014-ish when you supposedly lost your MTGOX bitcoins, to the extent that we can eve believe you about having involvement in BTC going back that far).


There seems to be a kind of contagion in the space. 


If you attempt to think about the matter more critically, the graph is not saying anything about the quantity of bitcoin whale addresses, it is ONLY talking about the value of the addresses, and of course, the number of BTC addresses above or below $10k is going to go up and down with the movement of the bTC price, even if we were to hold the number of BTC addresses constant.. and if there are severe BTC price movements in a short period of time, you could get the number of BTC addresses going UP when the BTC price is going down, but the BTC price would cause it to appear as if the number of BTC addresses were going down because the measurement relates to spot price of the BTC in terms of dollars.

If bitcoin is one of the options that you employ for yourself, then you are far from making yourself "completely dependent on bitcoin."

Each person needs to figure out and then choose their level of allocation into bitcoin and with having some bitcoin in your holdings, you likely give yourself more rather than fewer options.

Regarding what the government wants or what they may want or what they think they want, that is both an evolving thing but it is also not any kind of specific thing because we have all kinds of governments and their ways of coordinating what they supposedly want is also not necessarily clear.

Bitcoin seems to achieve a lot of things that governments say that they want, but frequently those governments with money printing capacities might not want bitcoin and/or they might be threatened by bitcoin because bitcoin reduces their frequently abused capacities when it comes to money printing and various ways that they control the money supply - which ultimately seems to get back to various ways (especially in recent times) that governments have been debasing the value of money through printing techniques but then mostly lying (unless they are confused as well) in regards to either what they are doing or the negative effects that monetary debasement seems to have.


Yes, technically you are correct that bitcoin is not the "only" escape route, and it likely would not be very smart for people to fail/refuse to diversify the various ways that they hold their wealth and then also if they fail/refuse to account for their own individual circumstances including but not limited to cashflow, other investments, view of bitcoin as compared with other investments, timeline, risk tolerance, time, skills and abilities to strategize, plan, research and learn along the way including tweaking strategies from time to time to consider trading, reallocating, use of leverage and/or financial instruments.

Bitcoin has a lot of advantages over a lot of assets/currencies, yet getting too much exposure to a good thing has its own likely problems.

I doubt that Tesla had much of a long term vision and/or investment plan regarding bitcoin... so they would likely need to be a bit more strategic and deliberate in their approach to BTC rather than playing around like they don't know what the fuck they are doing.. which seems to be a strange thing when dealing with $1.5 billion dollars, and a public company too.

Yes, the BTC price might dip, or it might not dip, so what is your plan in order to deal with the situation?

The same was true last November, December and January when the BTC price dipped down to the lower $50ks and then dipped even below $50k.  

So people bought on the dip, but the price kept dipping, and are you saying that we are supposed to do anything different now as compared with what we had done back then?  

What if we run out of money?  or what if we hang onto money "just in case"?  How are we going to know?  Presumably if there is a cashflow that has been coming in since January of this year, then if we did not buy bitcoin, then the cash amount in reserves would have been continuing to build during that time.  Are you suggesting any method to figure out when to buy and how much of the fiat to use for such BTC purchase(s)?

Are you trolling, you retard?  Now all of a sudden you are an "online currencies" expert?

You initially claimed that bitcoin's scarcity did not give it value and I 'splained the concept of scarcity a wee bit MOAR better to uie pooie.

An example of something that is scarce but not valuable would be each time that you assemble a set of rocks, you arrange them in a unique way... it is a one of a kind that a no named troll like yourself had assembled.  .. So, in that regard, it is surely scarce but it is not necessarily valuable. 

An example of something that is valuable but not scarce would be breathable air.

There are other examples of scarcity and not valuable and other examples of valuable and not scarce, but there is likely little to no need for me to provide further examples, especially when you are ongoingly showing that you are not even trying to reasonably and meaningfully engage in the topic... unless you are going to provide some better ideas about what it is that you are talking about.. that might have been trying to address some kind of genuine question related the this thread... whether you consider bitcoin to be valuable or not.. do you have any point, exactly?


In other words, is "tonight" coming somewhere in the world?

Where's the link?


Please 'splainening of lil selfie..... or it didn't happen


Where dee linkieeeee, newbie?

Is it still night anywhere in the world?


Are we getting jam tomorrow, too?


To the extent that you have any brain, you need to rethink your concepts of what brings value to anything. 

You are likely correct that scarcity in itself is not necessarily going to bring value to some thing that does not have a reason to be valuable - however, if there are other reasons (besides scarcity) that something has value, then scarcity can end up enhancing the value that the thing already has.. and the opposite is true too.. a lack of scarcity of something that is value will also undermine how that item is perceived to be valuable.. even if it is valuable...

Do we need to get into examples for you to understand the concept a wee bit MOAR better?  I know that you eXPHorizon are not really trying to learn.. since you don't even seem to have any kind of bitcoin accumulation strategy beyond begging for something that you are claiming does not have any value.


You seem to be speculating on unlikely to happen scenarios aesma.. and even overly worried about your own situation which might cause you to want to gamble too much.

I think that it remains a good and sound practice to just stayed hunkered down on your strategy of ongoingly accumulating BTC with DCA and buying on dips  and HODL when you run out of money, and you are still early as fuck to this whole thing so there seems to be little need to be overly thinking about what if this and what if that when we already have decent ideas of more likely scenarios that 1) bitcoin is likely going to remain volatile as fuck, 2) there are going to continue to be large battles in relation to bitcoin that ends up affecting its price and 3) in the long run bitcoin is going to continue to gravitate value and it's price is going to ongoingly gravitate UPpity, even if there are going to continue to be a lot of UPs and DOWNs along the way and sometimes we are going to lose confidence in it.

We are not talking about selling in this thread.

Furthermore if you are in BTC accumulating mode, then selling is not a good tactic for BTC accumulation - even though there can be ways to employ selling for various risk management purposes.. but still that is also not the topic if this thread.

Attributing some portion of what I said to your gobbledy-gook and foggy thinkenings does not seem to be a very reliable way forward.

I understand that a lot of folks will point out some kind of a limitation that bitcoin has and then suggest that another coin is better because it does not have the same limitation, and there are a lot of balances that are struck with bitcoin in terms of onchain transactions versus various kinds of ways that other layers are being developed that work for bitcoin, but if you talk about some other project, such as some piece of shit project like ethereum as if it were making similar kinds of tradeoffs, then you are likely just losing any concreteness that might have existed in any points that you seemed to have been trying to make.

If we just focus on something like bitcoin's blocksize limits and its transaction times, those have come up as issues, and there had even been actual spam attacks on bitcoin's base layer for a decent portion of late 2017 and early 2018 that ended up sparking lightning network into going live way before a lot of the main developers and and other influential folks in the bitcoin space wanted to happen.. which seemed to have had motivated (at least on the margins) a lot of the spam attacks from continuing to happen, but at the same time, there has been ongoing back and forth discussions in the bitcoin space regarding ideas of scaling as you go rather than making some kind of a change to the block size limits that would then contribute towards a lot of negative trade-offs in terms of giving space for spam attacks on the main chain to be potentially economical.

If we try to figure out what is going on with ethereum's proposed balancing of the various trilemma ideas that you set forward, we have hardly any fucking clue about what they are or what they are going to be because even they admit that they have a lot of problems with their current set up, so they are transitioning to some vague and amorphous bullshit thing that does not even seem to make sense on paper.. but still they seem to continue to have money flowing into such nonsense.. at least for the moment (ever heard of a ponzi scheme.. yeah, they work upon the principle of money flowing into them to keep them going.. and they surely seem to have that going for them if you can figure out what the fuck they are beyond mere descriptions and aspirations from whatever they supposedly are now to whatever they are supposedly moving towards).. and yeah, maybe you understand it WatChe, since you seem to be somewhat versed in goobledy-gook as a language.. and maybe as a lifestyle, too?... hahahahaha.


Poor widdo ting-a-lie!!!!

It's tough getting old...


You fart.


Remember Bawb said to wake him up once the price gets to $30k.. and he might be onto something.. I am always worried about prematuredly getting excited.. but $30k might be a sign that we are approaching the 100-week moving average [urlhttps://www.lookintobitcoin.com/charts/bitcoin-investor-tool/](which is currently at about $37k)[/url].. and surely we might not need to actually get above the 100-week moving average in order to start to feel some confidence that the bottom is actually in.


Call me dumb.. but I don't feel like I am even close to fully understanding what bitcoin is, and sometimes my mind changes about various aspects of what I think bitcoin is.

I do have confidence that I have some angles of understanding about what bitcoin is that are better than some people who know other things about bitcoin that I don't really understand..     Sometimes I will hear a developer talking about some angle of bitcoin that I have hardly any clue about what they are talking about, and then when they start to talk about bitcoin's investment thesis or areas in which I feel that I spend a lot of time, then I might start to think.. wholey fuck, that person doesn't know some basic concepts that I know.

Oh there are some newbies to bitcoin, and they have podcasts, and maybe they have only been in a couple of years, sometimes they will present some bitcoin-related ideas that are quite out of my reach in terms of understanding, and other times, they will say things I consider to be dumb.  I bet that there are some folks in El Salvador who got into bitcoin in less than a year, and they know way more about lighting network than some of us who have been in bitcoin 8 years or more (including yours truly because I don't know too much of about actually using lightning network through personal experiences), and maybe some of those folks in El Salvador might be bullish as fuck about bitcoin but only have less than a 3rd grade education..


I cannot really disagree with anything you say here, and even some of the real world Gresham's law motivations might not really be apparent to some of us, even though there could be some bitcoin contagion that builds upon Gresham law motivations principles and some of the folks who are influenced by those kinds of sound money factors might not really realize why it is that they are getting some resonance in regards to bitcoin being better money than any other kinds of money out there... which as you say builds upon itself in a kind of snowballing gravitational way, even if the users might not really exactly know why they are being motivated in that direction.

Fuck ethereum.. that piece of crap... hardly even worth responding to your nonsensical attempt to make it seem as if it has some kind of value. .. beyond scamming normies.. and even scamming you by your trying to present it as if it were to have som value or ability to be mentioned in the same sentences as my lil precious. 


I doubt that we need to get into details of the matter, but it seems to me that $773k in five years is quite reasonable, and I am not even sure how to put odds on such a number at this particular time... because I have not really thought about how we even get out of our current pickle.. I have difficulties thinking about more than one thing at a time, sometimes.. hahahahaha

If you look at my numbers from last December, I had placed around 0.5% for getting to $1.5million in this last cycle, and at the same time, I had placed 2.5% odds for getting to supra $800k and 11.25% odds for getting to supra $650k, so I would think that with the passage of time, those odds should be going up rather than down.. and maybe even my probability assignments are not as high as the probability assignments coming ouf ot that article..

and, of course, our most recent cycle seems to have been playing out quite a bit differently than we had expected in terms of not really getting as much of a blow off top as expected and then so many damned contagions that ended up pushing the BTC price down a bit more than 20% lower than the 200-week moving average (at least so far), so anyhow whatever recovery is needed in our current BTC price dynamics, and the passage of time likely does cause some needs to adjust the probability assignments that I had previously placed on various upside scenarios.. and I would imagine that even if we have experienced some pretty decently negative recent BTC price actions, our bullish cases have not been completely removed, even if Blackrock may well be a wee bit premature in trying to proclaim high odds for $773k - but they control way more resources than yours truly (at least currently.. not that I am aspiring for much beyond my current supra 0.63BTC status.. which surely there can be a quite a bit of value in terms of both accumulating what you can, but accumulating an amount that you are able to hang onto.. .. which so far my supra 0.63 BTC status is much more manageable than some of our recently reckt twats in the space who had to be filing for bankrupcy because they failed to preserve more assets than they had debts (even though I am not even going to concede that the individual owners are still running a way with a lot of BTC because they were gambling with OPM.. you know.. OPM.. so many folks recommend using OPM>. those morally vacuous fucks....