Next two years of hurr durr cheep hard drives :
[argumentum ad Amazon]
That is one data point. The trend, however, is not blockbloat's friend:  Perhaps you recall this lesson from Economics 101: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diminishing_returnsUnlike Nielsen, Moore, and Kryder's so-called Laws, diminishing returns is an actual a priori Law of nature, not merely an artifact of a cherry-picked sample range.  |
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Heh, the Gavinistas are having a very bad day week.  First, Frap.doc was put upon to explain... Actually it's been a bad 18 months and counting for Mr. 'bitcoin up' fap.doc. OK sure, but the recent one-two wombo combo of Gavin declaring A. "the financial crisis is over" and B. "The sky will not fall if the block size stays at 1MB" can't be easy for poor old Doctor Frappy to explain away with his usual hand-waving assclown routine. By ignoring gainsaying and insulting the expertise of Nick Szaboshi, Adam Bakomoto, Bram Cohen, and ALL THE CORE DEVS, he's really painted himself into a corner.  |
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The way to generate resiliency for Bitcoin is to get to the point that each block generates $10M in fees.
Today each block generates around $4,500 in fees on average.
That is not resilient, that is weak and easy for any state to attack.
This idea that using fee pressure on a low # of transactions is a way to get to high value blocks from fees is absurd. The way to get to high value blocks is tons of transactions paying minimum fees.
Agree with the first 3 sentences, but only in a superficial way. The fourth is just more absurd, Frappuccino Doc-esque bloviating. As fee pressure rises, "attacking" (IE filling up) blocks becomes more expensive. An attacker would have to pay higher fees than anyone else to stop tx propagation. And PT's replace-by-fee makes that already unworkable strategy obsolete. Your naive $4.5k/block figure illustrates the fact GavinCoin won't fix this so-called problem; 20 (or eight) times $4.5k is still nothing to any semi-resourceful attacker (much less TLA national statists). The only way to densely pack "tons of transactions paying minimum fees" into the extremely scarce resource of the blockchain is to use LN/SC/alt/off-chain mechanisms to aggregate payments and settle on the MotherChain. Even on a cluster of 24-core Xeons, blockchain tech cannot verify tx fast enough to *DIRECTLY* compete with centralized/specialized Visa-scale infrastructure. As others have already noted, Bitcoin's value comes from its decentralization, not low tx tees. If u don't value that, centralized systems can meet ur needs and "universal payments" is both a laudable goal and a
shopworn bitcoin marketing slogan.
The fundamental engineering truths diverge from that misty goal:
Bitcoin is a settlement system, by design.
The process of consensus "settles" upon a timeline of transactions,
and this process -- by design -- is necessarily far from instant.
Alt-coins that madly attempt 10-second block times etc. are simply a
vain attempt to paper over this fundamental design attribute:
consensus takes time.
As such, the blockchain can never support All The Transactions, even
if block size increases beyond 20MB. Further layers are -- by design
-- necessary if we want to achieve the goal of a decentralized payment
network capable of supporting full global traffic. |
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you got nothing
That's true, I got nothing. But I can still be touchy, rude, and grumpy while being content-free.Thanks for reminding me I forgot to include this logical technical argument in my re-cap of the Gavinista's Very Bad Day Week: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/11/10/kryders_law_of_ever_cheaper_storage_disproven/Kryder's Law says disk storage will keep on getting cheaper. Yet it is increasingly looking like it won't, which has baleful implications for cloud storage and archiving. Like Moore's Law, Kryder's Law is (a) not a law, merely a wonderfully apt observation for a prolonged but not eternal period of time, and (b) borne of an incredibly bold and confident view of technology. The assumption was that: "If you could afford to store some data for a few years, you could afford to store it forever. The cost of that much storage would have become negligible." Only that is no longer true. So much for the 'hurr durr cheap hard drives' (AKA argumentum ad Amazon) rational for GavinCoin.  |
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Unbelievable! It's almost as if subsidizing spam/noise transactions creates more of them.  Indeed, building wider motorways doesn't necessarily solve traffic congestion. A bunch of other things sometimes do (raising gasoline/car taxes/prices, regulation, unemployment, crime, alternative transport, virtual working, better city layout, emigration...). Problem: traffic congestion Free market solution: build turnpikes for high-priority trips willing to pay the toll; encourage/decentralize ride-sharing for lower priority travel Gavinista solution: put absurdly large wheels on the cars; ignore valid safety/engineering concerns contrary to GavinWheel fanboy preferences  |
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we're not even under attack yet blocks continue to fill up:
Unbelievable! It's almost as if subsidizing spam/noise transactions creates more of them. Whoop - Whoop - Whoop | emergency! | Whoop - Whoop - Whoop | emergency!Paging Justusranvier to explain in free-market principles pretzels how iCEBREAKER is muddled in his thinking. Heh, the Gavinistas are having a very bad day week. First, Frap.doc was put upon to explain with some semblance of logical consistency how he reaches the same pro-bloat conclusion as gavin@tla.mit.gov, despite operating on quite opposite assumptions w/r/t the financial crisis being over (now and in the med. term future). Then came yet another face-r3kking, sig-worthy domination tweet from Jon Matonis (as if the previous from Szatoshi Backamoto weren't enough) about the utter futility of shoehorning Bitcon's square settlement peg into VisaPayPal's round payment hole:  And finally(?) Dear Leader Himself debunks hearn@google.mil and Frap.doc's attempts to ram through ill-considered hard forks using fear and mass hysteria:  |
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we're not even under attack yet blocks continue to fill up:
Unbelievable! It's almost as if subsidizing spam/noise transactions creates more of them. We need 20MB++ blocks ASAP, because God forbid it costs more than a penny to use Bitcoin's seemingly magical, unprecedentedly powerful settlement system (which is based on the most secure and well distributed database in history). Why should any of the exorbitant expense of running nodes and miners be passed on to consumers? After all, growth at all costs is more important than closing loops and weaning the network off block rewards. Bitcoin is like a shark; it must keep moving or die. As with Uber, it must stay two steps ahead of the regulators. Oh, wait: http://techcrunch.com/2015/06/17/uber-drivers-deemed-employees-by-california-labor-commission/Nevermind: http://www.coindesk.com/ny-bitcoin-business-45-days-bitlicense/ |
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You can't blame a software developer for not understanding economy, even if that is not the case here.
When that software developer seeks to make a (security-centric, financially-sensitive) project dependent upon his economic proclamations and predictions, he should be blamed for that poor design rationale. |
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ugly ending to the day. $DJT clearly has broken down. get your Gavincoins while you can:
Enough of your silly FUD. The financial crisis is over. Our benevolent telecom overlords will, any second now, embark upon unprecedented roll outs of retail broadband infrastructure, all thanks to their massive post-Bernanke/Obamanomics budget surpluses. NFLX and APPL are at all-time-highs, so stop moaning just because you picked the wrong horse.  GavinCoin is stagnating and doesn't even pay dividends! |
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I can't stand this level of PC-pandering. It's ridiculous. If you're offended by a game or anything in it - don't play the game. Problem solved. And what's next? Removing Shindler's List and Inglorious Basterds from itunes? I love how they've been fine with the confederate flag up until a couple of weeks ago.
I love it *because* it's so ridiculous. Better to use their own PC black magic against them, until their energies are spent and narratives exploded. IE: Take up Farrakhan's cause, and help him demand Apple, etc. also get rid of the American flag. Because History! http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2015/06/25/louis-farrakhan-we-need-to-put-the-american-flag-down/Dear Apple, Displaying the American Flag is a micro-aggression. It triggers me and must be thrown out along with the other unacceptable old symbols of racism/sexism/classism. Remove all US Flag apps from your store, or suffer the wrath of the SJW army! Love, College_Liberal.gif |
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If you would consider you helping me to prove I'm not an impostor by (a cited, uneditable) sig and do something positive for flawed the system (plausibly staff would remove it then since you are a respected member of the community), I'd appreciate it.
PM me if you would do that for me.
LaudaM is a respected person, but staff is not going to remove feedback from your account. Their stated policy is that they don't get involved in such matters. On my own account I have several feedbacks which are pure nonsense and there's nothing I can do about it. A lot of members have nonsense feedback on their accounts. The best you can do is try to get the person who left it to remove it, barring that you can put your proof in a public place and link to it (as a reference, say, in a counter feedback on the person who left the nonsense). Then anyone who sees what that person said about you will scroll down and see what you said about them and that you've posted proof that their claim isn't correct. Good luck! I got my Trust spammed with X-POOL links, because crackfoo is upset I asked him to stop spamming X-POOL links. That'll teach me!  |
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I personally am fixated on keeping activity on the 'mainchain' as minimal as possible. This to keep it super lite and the entire support infrastructure distributable mostly in terms of messenging bandwidth. I want to minimize transactions.
Economically, I feel that if an on-chain transaction represents thousands of off-chain transactions, very generous fees can be paid to core infrastructure supporters while end-users continue to pay a tiny fee (if any) for their coffee purchases. We then have a win/win.
That's exactly right. Garzik couldn't have explained it any more precisely: Bitcoin's destiny is eventually moving from emphasizing payments to becoming the settlement network for all settlement networks. As another one who "gets it" explained: The true value that Bitcoin brings to the table is not "everyone gets to write into the holy ledger", it is instead "everyone gets to benefit from sane and non-inflationary financial instutions whose sanity and honesty are ensured by the holy blockchain".
-davout This is the vision of the anointed. Let us pray Satoshi will remove the scales from cypherdoc and the other Gavinista's eyes. |
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both $DJI & $DJT accelerating to the downside now.
get yourself some Gavincoin.
but but but... I heard the financial crisis is over, and soon magical NFLX bearing unicorns will frolic across the globe, bringing fiber to all the deserving children of Ukraine, Africa, Florida, and other formerly impoverished backwaters. Since all is most assuredly well in fiat-land, it's not clear why we even need Bitcoin, except perhaps as yet another centralized payment rail to act as a retail POS gimmick for the amusement of hipsters/yuppies and profit of VC frat boys. Of course if that's *not* true and we are headed towards a messy/violent end to the petrodollar's death throes, perhaps preserving and enhancing BTC's diffuse/diverse/defensible/resilient properties is a better idea than forever committing every tip at every coffee shop to the MotherChain. Forget about Gavincoin because the financial crisis is over, thanks to our brave heroic consumers binge watching Game of Thrones and Breaking Bad:  ATH BITCH! |
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Oh, so the lead developer of a software project is not necessarily the most competent person alive when it comes to matters of international economics? Who da thunk it?
Come on, are you f***in serious?
He's a software developer, not an economist.
Now close this thread.
That's exactly my point. Why is a hyper-specialized code-monkey like Gavin (who is obviously "not necessarily the most competent person alive when it comes to matters of international economics") pontificating on matters of which he knows little? Moreover, why would he presume to tie the fate of a resiliency-based FOSS project to his Pollyanna prognostications and crystal-ball gazing? Many (probably most) Bitcoiners believe we are operating under multiple cascading financial crises, going back to 1913 (Federal Reserve), 1933 (gold confiscation), 1971 (Nixon Shock), etc.:  Compounding these ongoing unresolved/unresolvable crises is the Deep Capture of the economy and most social institutions by Deep State operatives like gavin@tla.gov and hearn@google.mil. The petro(dollar/euro/yen) are dead paper walking. The "Rollover" scenario isn't off the table, it's just been kicked down the road like a can. Of course Gavin thinks putting off difficult work like scaling Bitcoin or abolishing the warfare/welfare state is the is the same thing as solving the crisis... Gavin isn't even the lead developer. Thank goodness the remaining core devs know better than to expose Bitcoin to an iffy bet on Bernanke and Obama's economic legacy (BECAUSE NETFLIX tm). Financial crisis is over? Ha-ha, very funny - tell us another one!  |
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This Gavin-bashing smear campaign is pretty sad.
Agreed. It's still a gob smacking quote. Judging by the vehemence of some responses here, my tiny effort to draw attention to Gavin's gob smacking quote has apparently touched some raw nerves. It's remarkable how instead of simply debating the truth/false value of Gavin's "Financial Crisis Is Over" proposition, so many are attacking me for bringing it up, demanding I close the thread, etc. Of course it's uncomfortable for GavinCoiners who believe the financial crisis is *far* from over to hear their Dear Leader explicitly tie purported feasibility of larger blocks to the supposed current and presumably sustained economic recovery. |
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He talks about the financial crises in bitcoin! -> Translation: Bearmarket is over. He knows a huge pump is coming and this is exactly why he is afraid, the blocksize limit could be too small.
Hardly. Read the quote. He's saying big companies will start making investments into infrastructure which will lead to the improved broadband speeds for the consumer. I doubt that has anything to do with Bitcoin's price. That said, what's the relevance here, icebreaker? Predicating larger blocks on a putative economic recovery (and subsequent retail broadband explosion) may not be the safest or wisest strategy. Of all things to base Bitcoin's [future?] magic numbers on, Krugmanesque happy talk about the miracles of Keynesian statism is one of the most bizzarre. How is retail broadband coming along in Greece? Ukraine? Venezuela? Argentina? Larger blocks make Bitcoin nodes harder to operate in some of the places where it is needed the most, and where (for purposes of diversity/diffusion/resiliency/defensibility) Bitcoin most needs its nodes to be. On a side note, now that we know they operate on entirely contradictory premises/assumptions, it's amusing to watch cypherdoc (who nearly everyday proclaims the financial crisis is *not* over) strenuously cheerlead for gavin@tla.mit.edu on 20MB blocks, XTortion forks, or whatever the latest crackpot of scheme of hearn@google.mil is.  |
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http://www.marketwatch.com/story/heres-who-is-most-exposed-to-a-greek-default-2015-06-23“The private sector “has almost no direct exposure to Greece anymore,” wrote strategists at J.P. Morgan Cazenove, in a Monday note urging clients to get back into German stocks. So the whole 2011-2012 Greek loan restructuring was basically a strategy to move the bagholders from rich powerful bankers and investors into the hands of the general population (as taxed by their governments), wasn't it? EDIT: the entire system is broken. Let private lenders lend to eurozone countries at essentially no risk (that's moral hazard of bailouts). Then bail out the country and the private lenders using public money because of political/social concepts like one unified europe. How about letting governments default on loans WITHOUT kicking them out of the eurozone. How about a government bankruptcy -> elect a new govt, fire the top 10 central bankers and any other bankers the other central banks deem responsible and have a 5-10 year probationary period where their local central bank cannot give euro-creating loans. they're lying:  Don't worry your pretty little head about ^that^ sort of gloom and doom FUD. Per Gavin, " the financial crises is over" and we can (because Netflix) all count on the current economic boom to provide us with broadband in line with the idealistic expectations of Nielsen's Law. |
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Given Bitcoin's origin revelation in the midst of the financial crisis and its Genesis Block timestamp's pointed reference to 'another round of bank bail-outs' this kind of Krugmanesque Happy Talk from the self-appointed CEO of Bitcoin raises many questions. How can the financial crisis be over when the BIS and subsidiary TBTF zombie banks still roam the earth, consuming the gains of the living? How can the financial crisis be over when when Bitcoin has yet to assume its rightful place on the throne next to gold's, as a replacement for the world's various forms of dying fiat trash? Is it prudent to subordinate Bitcoin's fate to the continued success of petrodollar hegemony in the forms of QE N+1, TARP, TALF, and the FOMC Plunge Protection Team? |
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Ill start contacting some authorities in the coming days
Jail for Evan
Thanks for your support. Evan is only the fall guy. There are shadowy powers behind the DARSH throne which also require investigating: I'm just jumping into this thread, i'm curious why the foundation address is in a medical plaza. I'll be up there tomorrow to pop in. 60 Minutes style ambush-interview or it didn't happen! |
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we do know satoshi left b/c he didn't want to get carted away.
We do, or you made that up? As far as I know he simply said he was going to work on something else. Without Frap.doc making stuff up, this thread would be a ghost town. |
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