Interesting thought. Deposit btc but denominate the asset in USD ?
Basically just use BU (Bitcoin Union) instead of WU (Western Union) to zap the USD over to him... -MarkM- |
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Maybe Nefario should have used user-provided "codes" to which the users have the private keys, such as, for example, bitcoin addresses or PGP pubkeys provided by the users for this kind of purpose? Then they could prove they are the holder of the privkeys to that code?
-MarkM-
You could do this easily through bitcon signing. Yes but presumably not violating customer privacy by revealing a bitcoin address they use for some purpose other than as one to give to new host of assets in the event assets have to move to another venue. Especially not revealing an address they actually used for coins. Similar with PGP: a PGP key given for this purpose, not some other key that might tie them to some other activities they might not wish owners of assets to learn they are connected with. -MarkM- |
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Maybe Nefario should have used user-provided "codes" to which the users have the private keys, such as, for example, bitcoin addresses or PGP pubkeys provided by the users for this kind of purpose? Then they could prove they are the holder of the privkeys to that code?
-MarkM-
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Yeah we have a bounty out for someone to make an Open Transactions client "that grandma can use" but not much action on that yet. The current GUI is a "test GUI" that includes pretty much all the things Open Transactions can do, as example code showing coders how to do all those various things. It is accordingly only for the cleverest grannies. But we gotta get people using it, else really there won't be much incentive for anyone to bother making it more useable, and in fact the geeks might even hardly notice anything unusable about it to improve.  (WTF, a GUI? Who uses a GUI? Everything it can do better be right here in the command line commands or else...  ) -MarkM- |
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Huh? No flipflop here, I have some of most altcoins, all that I could mine a few of. I mined a block of ppc and am keeping them, plus leaving the client running to see what this stake thing ends up doing.
-MarkM-
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But I am sure a niche will appear, full of people who want to trade interests in various rpg properties.
These people will likely want to do so completely disassociated from any "real life" they have and want to transact strictly online and with bitcoins.
I am very interested in what will be developed to serve this niche, as players like the GLBSE go the NYSE route.
Well do yourself a favour then and set up an Open Transactions client! -MarkM- |
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Probably because most people here are geeky enough that the hand-holding one gets from a "full service brokerage" does not seem to them particularly useful thus the only real advantage they see in using an "exchange" that has tons of people like themselves all issuing assets on it is the change to grab a chunk of the traffic others like themselves, and possibly even the operator, bring to the place.
Given that there seemed to be so few business models represented thus that a large fraction of the others bringing traffic there are your own competitors, maybe such "malls" are not really so great afterall?
Maybe if GLBSE was free open source software (as Open Transactions is, by the way) a whole lot of people would be running it themselves to hawk their own wares instead of putting up with being buried among countless competitors and forced to rub shoulders with oodles of scams at least as scammy as they themselves are and in some cases maybe even scammier?
-MarkM-
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I suspect the big problem will be "know your customer" type laws, since apparently in a lot of places a fully legitimate company has to know the identities of its shareholders. So maybe anyonymity for buying shares of really legitimate companies will involve setting up offshore holding companies in jurisdictions that do not require revealing their own owners. That way your offshore company can own shares on your behalf without revealing who you are. I invite you to look over the contracts I use though, they are in the file digitalis-assets.tgz on my sourceforge file-download site http://sourceforge.net/projects/galacticmilieu/files/Basically what it comes down to is I don't think there are any "know the players who control the characters who own the shares" rules for online roleplaying games... -MarkM- |
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Incidentally I think it'd be good to make an effort to explicitly shun services like GPUMAX. Mining is voting and it's clear that many miners don't realize that today. Putting reminders into the documentation for mining tools, the forum sections, etc would be cheap and beneficial.
If mining is voting, gpumax is probably bread and circuses, or at least bread. So while its a nice idea it seems likely "good luck with that" might apply. -MarkM- |
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Sell them? You crazy? I have nowhere near enough to go throwing them away like that at the pathetic prices prevailing nowadays. Heck even bitcoins are only fetching two digit prices in dollars these days, and altcoins fractions of a dollar. No, we'll see how things look in a decade or few...
-MarkM-
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So, again, coloured bitcoins.
-MarkM-
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Coloured bitcoins.
-MarkM-
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Most people have set up similar to the way fiat systems are set up: they have one "special" asset/commodity that is "local currency" and gets special treatment or focus on account of its being the local favourite.
That is basically a bias people have brought with them from the fiat world. In Open Transactions assets are assets, you can trade any for any, you can send any of them as dividends any time you choose and so on. Well okay, shares are special in the sense that to accomodate people's preconceptions the ability to send dividends is only enabled for assets of share type, but really you could choose to set up your dollars asset contract using type share if you wanted to be able to send dividends to all holders of dollars so there can be that distinction between shares and other types of assets but its up to you to use it or not when creating your asset contract.
(Eventually there will also be a type "deeds" for things of which each instance is individual too, for things like real estate or vehicles etc.)
A lot of the bias comes simply from being on the bitcointalk forum, if you were in the alternate blockchains forum maybe there would be more variety.
-MarkM-
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People who want to be anonymous can connect through Tor or an anonymity proxy or whatever.
All the seller needs is a bitcoin address or an Open Transactions nym or a PGP/GPG public key type of thing by which to know each customer. Probably preferably all three, maybe with the customer specifying a sequence of priority of their use, like which one to accept for normal operations, which one to require for any change of that first one, and which one to require for any change of that second one.
So anonymity does not require a blockchain.
Also if the issuer's system is online 24/7, then the shares could even be issued as Chaumian blinded cash tokens. When you give me such a token I turn it in untraceably at the site for a new one. The site must be online at the time of the trade for this to work, and it is more untraceable than a transaction permanently recorded on a blockchain for all to see.
Obviously most people use third parties for hosting their public-facing servers, so your objection about third party hell might as well apply to anyone who does not host their website on their own machine on their own premises. If they have their website off-premises they will probably also have their shares-trading site also off-premises, though not necessarily at the same datacentre as their website since possibly their webhosting provider specialises in providing web hosting and their transaction server provider specialises in providing transaction servers.
Open Transactions is intended for this kind of use, that is why it is designed not to require that the issuer trust the operator of the transaction server.
The issuer has to be trusted though else what they issue is pretty much worthless.
-MarkM-
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A blockchain seems like overkill since shares only have value if the issuer acknowledges them / honours them. Thus in the absence of the issuer they are worthless or at best represent speculation that at some future date/time the issuer might show up again.
Thus it seems to me to make a lot of sense to have the issuer do the accounting / exchanging. If you try to sell me a share of Company X and their site is down, aren't I wiser to wait until they are online again before buying, in case they have in fact already "flown by night"?
Since I want to check they are actually still in business anyway, I might as well conduct the exchange through them directly while I am at it...
-MarkM-
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That is such an insanely obviously idiotic piece of programming that it surely must have been deliberate?
-MarkM-
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I do not see any stake listed yet in my getinfo, yet mined a block my first day, which I had thought was one of the first few days of the code being released. So I don't know what that is about, I thought having my mined coins online would mean after 30 days they would count as stake. Maybe not, maybe that field will only show anything once some of them have managed to mine a stake block or something.
Mining it makes no sense since it cannot be merged-mined since any hashing power diverted to it would be diverted from mining seven other chains, it is silly to spend hashes on this that could instead be spent on seven chains all at the same time via merged mining.
-MarkM-
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If you ask most about PPC they couldn't tell you how it works 100%.
We aren't sure yet that it actually does work 100% -MarkM- |
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Maybe then all you need is a free open source bitcoin-exchange with your shares plugged into it instead of fiat, so all the normal stuff would be there that a site for buying and selling bitcoin for fiat would have but no fiat, instead it'd be for buying and selling your shares.
Basically search and replace "USD" with your shares code and disable the scripts that deal with the fiat banks...
-MarkM-
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