Coindrawer launched in beta a month ago to simplify the bitcoin transaction process. Within that month, we have seen tremendous growth and an overwhelming response to our bitcoin wallet. We are thankful for all of the comments we have received and are pushing out updates daily in response to the suggestions we are getting.

However, despite the quick growth we have encountered, Coindrawer must temporarily suspend all bitcoin buys and sells. While we have been using Bank of America to facilitate ACH transfers, it has recently and abruptly implemented a new policy decision wherein it will no longer process ACH transactions for bitcoin-related companies. We are presently in the process of finding a new bank to complete these ACH transactions for us and welcome any suggestions.

While we secure a new bank, you will not be able to purchase or sell bitcoins through Coindrawer, though currently pending buys and sells will be completed. All other features of Coindrawer remain available and bitcoins stored in your wallet are, as always, secure.

Please feel free to contact us at support@coindrawer.com with any questions. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.

Describe things in more detail please. You certainly mean something more here, otherwise this is instantly crackable.

That would be a very boring hunt (i.e. not a hunt at all) for those that know bitcoin.

I take that you are imagine implementing this based on IP addresses ? This makes no sense as lots of IPs are dynamically attributed, lots of devices are constantly changing its position, and you would need all the ISPs in the world to collaborate with providing the geographical address of a given client that is using a certain IP at a certain moment.

Gotcha, thanks for clarifying.

Their is a legal difference between TH voluntarily giving you a refund. Compared to a forced refund (charge back) (reversal) via Paypal or Credit Card.

If you have a Paypal account and are doing something illegal, have a judgment against you, didn't deliver a product etc etc etc. They can freeze your account. This doesn't apply to a customer that has received a charge back.    

If you were a relative or friend etc etc of TH and received a refund while nobody else did. Then a court could take the money back from you. But this isn't the case.  

Sorry. This isn't Holland Dutch justice.

Nowhere does it say anything about confiscating a charge back of a customer for a trustee in a court bankruptcy case. This is more likely related to when TH had their Paypal account frozen. And if they are sued it could be held up again for garnishment. Their were no refunds.

Although I wrote that I was out of this thread, I will weigh in one last time to explain just how court ordered chargebacks work.

I'm not going to tell you a pack of lies; I'm only going to tell you how things work in the real world.

First, Paypal does not, repeat DOES NOT dispute court orders.  Not now, not everl NEVER! It's just not worth the cost to them.  Right in the Terms of Service, it is as well.

Now, let us assume for the sake of discussion that Terrahash has filed a bankruptacy proceeding and that all transactions within 90 days of that filing are being examined by the Court Trustee.

Now the Court Trustee, he's tokin' on a number and diggin' on the radio while he looks at these transactions, finds a few he doesn't like, looks out over the bow of the ship that is Paypal and says, "I'm gonna move you Baby!" and he does, right into the Terrahash Paypal account, instigating a chargeback which Paypal will immediately pay to the Court but wait.....................................

The Terrahash bank accounts are either empty or have been seized already by the Trustee and there is no money to be had from that quarter.

Now Paypal, being the Evil Empire of payment processing is not going to stand for this or any other kind of loss so the Paypal guy, who is also tokin' on a number and diggin' on the radio takes a look around and sends a chargeback to the person who received the refund payment.

BANG!

The entire amount of the funds paid to the Court is now charged back to the person(s) who received the refund in the first place, zapped by Paypal from either the associated bank account or credit card.

This is how it works and the ship that is the Paypal account of the person who received the refund acts as though it has hit an iceberg and goes right on down!

If the person wants to fight the chargeback, it will be up to that person to secure legal counsel, which counsel will require a hefty retainer which number might even exceed the amount of the chargeback and there will be little hope of recovery of the funds.

Now there is a way to protect yourself against such chargebacks but the method will result in the loss of your Paypal account, which is probably going to happen anyway, so no real damage done.

Here are the steps you would take:

(1) Make NO changes to the Paypal account itself so as to not draw unwanted attention to what you are doing.


(2) Clean out your Paypal account, leaving only USD $1 in it.  If you sent the money from the Paypal account to your bank account, wait until the money hits the bank account before proceeding to Steps 3 and 4.

(3) Close the bank account associated with the Paypal account but don't tell Paypal.  They will not know unless and until they try to charge back to that bank account.

(4) Cancel any and all credit or ATM cards associated with the Paypal account but again, don't tell Paypal.  They'll figure it out if they try to charge back.

Now if Paypal does attempt a chargeback and you have followed the above steps, you are at least temporarily immune to chargebacks.  Your Paypal account will be locked and Paypal will email you to death to try to get you to update your account with new info.

Ignore them.

Following this plan will get you smooth sailing for at least a while and protect your hard earned funds from what amounts to legalised theft due to the actions of Terrahash & Co.

If you are lucky and depending on the amount involved, Paypal will only send you nasty letters and eventually go away, turning the bad account over to a collection agency.

If you are not so lucky and the amount is large enough, Paypal will instigate legal action against you but that scenario is not really very likely as such actions are often just not worth the time and expence involved.

My $.02.



P.S.: Apologies to Jamie Brockett.

Since Terrahash was essentially dealing in unregistered securities there is no telling exactly how the Court will handle the matter but anyone who received a refund in the 90 days preceeding the filing will have that refund in jeopardy.  Remember, the Court can go back as far as two years in reversing transactions and does so on a regular basis.

I think Amir would do that, but somehow he is not able to. However this is the best solution to work out for everyone. While he can be sued, someone can take a lot money from him, but for the BTC customers won't left anything then. It has to be someone that is in contact with Amir and settle things right!