People do have their coins. We've been processing payments out during the last few days. But the process is extremely slow and tedious.

2012-06-17 Claims Payments Specifics
Be sure to fillout the payment instructions section of the claim.
Failure to do so will significantly delay claims.

[14:18:38] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> frankly if we dont fix this nobody is going to see one red cent after bankruptcy fees and liqudation fees
[14:18:41] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> i looked it up
[14:18:53] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> liquidation costs about a grand per creditor
[14:19:00] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> there would literally be nothing left

[14:29:10] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> my best guess is it would cost about 20 grand just to file the initial complaint
[14:29:22] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> it would cost you probably 100 grand to go to trial
[14:29:25] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> AND YOUD LOSE
[14:29:55] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> so no i dont think there's some mystery attorney out there waiting for file a complaint
[14:30:41] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> oh and as soon as you filled the complaint
[14:31:01] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> your legal costs would go through the roof as everybody simultaneously pointed at everybody else
[14:31:19] <phantomcircuit!~phantomci@c-67-188-9-35.hsd1.ca.comcast.net> so yeah i dont think anybody is even remotely stupid enough to think that's a good way to get their money back

I think only the scammers are making noise here to rush the process for their selfish gains.

13 June 15:00: Initial payouts have been made to verified people for 50% of their claim.

So pay out everyone's btc/usd balances today not 50% not 80%. Every last cent of it.

Anyway, let's hope actual payments begin soon enough.

No database, a huge mass of data (much of it useless) and a number of false claims that could push out legitimate claims. The data makes sense only as a whole which makes payouts difficult (you have to build a case and gather evidence based on the known data). Being careless and paying people without being sure is stupid as you cannot reverse payments if more evidence later ends up contradicting your early guess.

That's why the initial payouts so far have been for only 50%. And only for people we're highly certain of. I support extending that to more, but the others are understandably taking more caution. If people are paid out, then it's realised there is a mistake in our assumptions, that means legitimate people will not get paid (the pool of money for payouts is limited). $1 erroneously paid out, is $1 of someone else's money. The honest and correct decision here is being as certain as possible for people you pay out, and no amount of shouting will speed up the process. The records for making the payouts are incredibly bad and inefficient. It might take 15 mins to check a single person before you realise that the records on hand for that person are useless/contradictory. Now multiply this by 100s of people.

Someone earlier mentioned hiring people but that's not an option here. I would not trust a relative unknown with this data and the time/effort involved with finding a new person who would be competent does not make it a positive tradeoff.

Except we already did make some payments for confirmed people.

I am not the correct person to answer your questions. I have messaged the correct person.

Not sure if this has already appeared in the thread but from the bitcoinica.com page,

"Claims which have been internally identified as reasonably accurate based on records and for which the ownership of the claim has been determined will receive an initial payment of 50%"

30 May 23:30: We're going to proceed with payouts of the few people we have verified hopefully tomorrow for 80% of their claims (the remaining 20% will be refunded later). A more lengthy process will be applied to everyone else.

I have my pass written on a paper in my wallet so i know its correct. No reply to my last email i sent to them. WTF is going on? As patient as I normally am, I am getting pissed!

Not all the password hashes exist. Only a few of them. That's why it says no password hash found. The record is not an old record but simply a recent sample of a random bunch of users. It does not matter how old your account is.

i am 100 percent sure my pw is correct

No password hash found please contact verify@bitcoinica.com to request manual verification

There is now a password form on the claims page.

Please enter your password to verify you are indeed the rightful owner of the account.

Please verify your ownership of the claimed account by opening the claim and authenticating.

tl;dr Bitcoinica thinks that having their computers hacked releases it from any liabilities to everyone.

Force majeure is a common clause in contracts that essentially frees both parties from liability or obligation when an extraordinary event or circumstance beyond the control of the parties, such as a war, strike, riot, crime, or an event described by the legal term act of God (such as hurricane, flooding, earthquake, volcanic eruption, etc.), prevents one or both parties from fulfilling their obligations under the contract. In practice, most force majeure clauses do not excuse a party's non-performance entirely, but only suspends it for the duration of the force majeure.

Force majeure is generally intended to include risks beyond the reasonable control of a party, incurred not as a product or result of the negligence or malfeasance of a party.

Let's assume that those tos are geniune.

I am not the correct person to answer your questions. I have messaged the correct person.

I haven't done much research, but to my best knowledge, DRS only applies to NZ residents.

7Application of Act
(1)This Act applies to persons who are in the business of providing a financial service.

8ATerritorial scope
This Act applies to a person who—
(a)is ordinarily resident in New Zealand (within the meaning of section 4 of the Crimes Act 1961) or has a place of business in New Zealand, regardless of where the financial service is provided; or
(b)is, or is required to be, a licensed provider under a licensing enactment.
Section 8A: inserted, on 1 July 2010, by section 10 of the Financial Service Providers (Registration and Dispute Resolution) Amendment Act 2010 (2010 No 41).

I believe that the company had plans to amend the Terms of Service to mention the illegibility of NZ non-accredited/non-institutional investors for Bitcoinica service.

[17] Force Majeure

You agree that Bitcoinica will not be liable in any way to you or to any other person in the event of force majeure, or for the act of any Government or legal authority, or for the failure of or damage or destruction to its computer systems, data or records or any part thereof, or for delays, losses, errors or omissions resulting from the failure or mismanagement of any telecommunications or computer equipment or software. The parties shall be released of all responsibilities for partial, full or non-fulfillment, as well as for improper fulfillment of the obligations under this Agreement, if such non-fulfillment or improper fulfillment was a result of extraordinary events, which occurred after this Agreement was concluded and which the party could not either foresee or prevent (natural calamities, wars, armed conflicts etc.).

Just under 10% of claims have been verified, and I'm waiting on those payments to be made out soon.

5% of people are verified so far.

Membership in a DRS is mandatory for FSPs who provide a service to retail clients, because it provides consumers with an avenue for redress when a dispute arises with their financial service provider. Membership in a scheme is a pre-requisite for registration as an FSP.

FSPs who are unsure as to whether they need to join a dispute resolution scheme should seek legal advice.

This is what I need from each of you today:

1) A sign of life that the claims processing has begun -- an announcement to that effect and/or actually paying people back

2) An email reply that you are acting as directors for the Bitcoinica LP general partner.

3) An email reply that you will supply the NZ Companies office with valid docs to reflect your director status at your earliest opportunity

I must consider anything less to be an abandonment of your legal obligations.

But it does not matter who is legally in charge right now as the way forwards is clear and everyone is in agreement about what needs to be done. We will make the payments, we now have consolidated all the records and the money.

For those who got a payout did you get a full refund and did you have a open position? and did you get your funds returned in bitcoins in cash or both depending on what you had with bitcoinica?