UPDATE

Additionally, the codified legal process is punitive, not restorative. So if there are any fines to be levied, they go to the government, not the victim. Any profits earned from the labor of the prisoner go to private corporations, not the victims. What does the victim gain from the incarceration of the perpetrator other than the small piece of mind that they are not roaming the streets for an indefinite and short period of time?

LOL, the face on that woman is priceless. You can practically hear her thinking "I hope no one I know sees this!".

That is interesting, because these are your exact words, stated before the above quote I might add.


Funny, you can't even seem to keep your own lies straight.


I already repeatedly stated I am using the number of 10 seconds from The 9/11 Commission Report. Is the official report too "conspiratorial" for you now? The number of 9.2 seconds is from independent video analysis. The .8 seconds is not "a margin of error", because it is the difference between the independent analysis and the official 9/11 report. I am already using the highest number of the two, so no, 10.8 seconds is not the upper end of the claimed "margin of error", 10 seconds is. Are you trying to say that the official report was not accurate? I am not talking about some random guy on youtube analyzing it, this is the official government analysis. Do you think they were not accurate in their proclamation of a 10 second fall time? We have already been over this several times but you really want to milk it for every second of distraction you can get from it even though I am not even attempting to debate the 9.2 second time vs the 10 second time. On top of that you feel like seeing if you can word salad your way into adding another .8 seconds. Sorry, that is not how it works.

Not that you bothered to read it, but I already sourced the final NIST report which admitted free fall speeds in building 7. As far as towers 1 and 2, NIST HAS NO OFFICIAL EXPLANATION of how the towers fell, only a collection of assumptions. Assumptions based on "dry labed" models that have widely been disputed for lack of accuracy completely dismissing things like the core support structure in their models. Additionally your quote from the NIST F.A.Q. says nothing about free fall speeds, it says what their interpretation of the seismic record is. Nice attempt at misdirection.

You are the one supporting the official narrative, not me. I only used numbers out of The 9/11 Commission Report so that it would not simply be used by you as another source of distraction from the violation of the laws of physics that had to have happened even based on these numbers for the official narrative to be true.


Since you are so insistent that the seismic records corroborate the official narrative, lets take a look at them shall we?

The First Building's fall:





The Second Building's fall:



Source

That sure looks an awful lot like a 10 second duration to me.



Furthermore the seismic records also show lots of other discrepancies from the official reports, including more undeniable physical evidence of explosives:

The following are excerpts from a report by Dr. André Rousseau. He is a Doctor of Geophysics and Geology, a former researcher in the French National Center of Scientific Research (CNRS), who has published 50 papers on the relationships between the characteristics of progressive mechanical waves and geology. Dr. Rousseau is an expert on measurement of acoustic waves.

This report can be found here.


"EXPLOSIONS THE SOURCE OF 9/11 SEISMIC WAVEFORMS
A subterranean explosion might not be heard, but the ground would shake and initiate a series of waves (body and surface waves). If we distinctly hear an explosion, it is either aerial, which does not give a seismic signal, or it is subaerial, in which case surface waves could be generated. The seismic wave data provided by Palisades prove the occurrence of surface waves radiating outward from the World Trade Center. In addition, witnesses reported hearing explosions very close to the times at which planes struck the Towers and when they collapsed (see particularly MacQueen, 2006).

Given these two types of evidence we can affirm that subaerial explosions occurred close to the base of the Towers almost or quite simultaneously with the crashes into the Towers by the planes. The sound coming from these explosions would have been mixed with the sounds generated by the impacts of the planes. The explosion at the base of WTC1 was heard and reported by William Rodriquez (Spingola, 2005).

The employees of the Secret Service, whose offices were in WTC7 wholly separated
from WTC1, noticed this event:

“On September 11, like any other morning, most of the Secret Service employees were either settling into their offices or still making their way to work. Others were about to attend meetings to prepare for the upcoming meeting of the United Nations General Assembly. At 8:48 a.m. their offices in Building 7 shook and the lights flickered. Most of them stopped for a quick moment but quickly returned to their work” (Congressional Record, 107th Congress (2001-2002). As a simple impact against a tower cannot be transmitted to a separated building, an explosion was the likely source of the shock in the offices." pg. 7-8


"The local magnitudes (ML) that the LDEO seismologists calculated from the surface waves gave results that consolidate our analysis. They were higher than 2 on the Richter scale for the waves emitted at the moments of the collapses. It is impossible to get such a magnitude from the falling of the building debris alone, especially falling over a duration of ten seconds. Even if an entire Tower had been compacted into a tight ball, it would have necessitated a higher speed than could be caused by the Earth's gravity to even approach such a magnitude. Moreover, we must note that the magnitude attributed to the subterranean explosion at the WTC1 is ML=2.3 -- comparable to the earthquake that hit New York on January 17, 2001 (ML =2.4) -- while the magnitude coming from the WTC2 explosion is ML=2.1, thus weaker. This disparity is consistent with the explosions described in this study and is particularly appreciable given the logarithmic scale used to designate event magnitudes. Given that the Twin Towers were of similar height and mass, the falling debris from the collapsing Towers should have generated similar magnitudes, if they were indeed the sources of the waves." pg. 9

"CONCLUSION
Near the times of the planes' impacts into the Twin Towers and during their collapses, as well as during the collapse of WTC7, seismic waves were generated. To the degree that (1) seismic waves are created only by brief impulses and (2) low frequencies are associated with energy of a magnitude that is comparable to a seismic event, the waves recorded at Palisades and analyzed by LDEO undeniably have an explosive origin. Even if the planes' impacts and the fall of the debris from the Towers onto the ground could have generated seismic waves, their magnitude would have been insufficient to be recorded 34 km away and should have been very similar in the two cases to one another. As we have shown, they were not.

The types and magnitudes of the seismic signals show significant differences. The greatest differences occur in their propagation speeds, even though their paths were essentially identical under identical conditions. This difference is physically unexplained in the interpretation of the events offered by the LDEO researchers, the 9/11 Commission and NIST. Therefore, we must question their calculations of wave propagation speeds based on their assumption that the wave origins are shown on the video images of impacts and collapses. We can only conclude that the wave sources were independently detonated explosives at other times, thus accounting for the variable discrepancies for
each wave origin in relation to the videos." pg. 10

"There is a factor of ten between the power of the explosions at the time of the plane impacts on the Twin Towers (as well as at the time of the collapse of WTC7) and the strength of those more powerful explosions at the times of their collapses, the subterranean explosion under WTC1 being the one that transmitted the most energy to the ground. " pg 11





As usual I am the one providing all of the sources, science, and math. You are providing assumption, denial, speculation, allegories about bowling balls, ninjas, lizard people, and space rays.

No, you are discussing something else every time I demolish your argument. When you have lost an argument you simply move the goal posts and claim you meant something else. I brought up the fact that the WTC towers were designed to withstand hurricanes. You called a hurricane static. I displayed the definition of static which has no relevance describing a hurricane, now suddenly you claim you were talking about "static loads" all along. Please, your attempts at misdirection are pathetic.

Suppose the laws of physics apply and the towers fell at free fall speed, faster than possible with any resistance from crushing the floors below, even if this wasn't in violation of Newton's 3rd law as well.

I never even debated the .8 seconds. You can have it, not that it helps your argument other than providing another distraction. Lets use the official report which states 10 seconds which IS STILL FREE FALL SPEED. Your talk about the "margin of error" again is just more word salad to attempt to sound like you have an argument.

It doesn't matter if the energy of the buildings falling was 20 megatons, they still will not fall at free fall speeds unless explosives are used to clear the supports and remove the resistance of the columns. As usual there is zero substance in your statements.

Yep, I can confirm that is his Steam account.

So now not allowing anyone who decides they feel like a man or a woman that day to go into whatever bathroom, locker room, or shower they like is "bigotry against trannys", oh of course. It couldn't be that they are defending the rights of everyone else against a small fascist minority subset of this tiny community now could it? No, that makes too much sense!

  What does David Icke have to do with me? David Icke doesn't speak for me, and this is you yet again grasping at straws to try to defame my point rather than counter it with logic. You are really struggling now aren't you?




I already showed you calculations, not only from the speeds that the building was falling at demonstrating it fell at free fall conductive with the rate of gravity showing ZERO resistance which should have been there had it been a collapse without explosives, as well as the explosive forces required to propel multiple multi-ton sections of the building hundreds of yards from their original positions in all directions. You however ignore these facts to maintain your pretext of having an argument.


Sure, no problem. Since you have problems with definitions of basic English words here is the definition of STATIC:

Full Definition of static:

    1: exerting force by reason of weight alone without motion

    2: of or relating to bodies at rest or forces in equilibrium

    3: showing little change <a static population>

    4: characterized by a lack of movement, animation, or progression

    5: standing or fixed in one place :  stationary

None of these things are descriptive of a hurricane. I think you know this however and are playing your usual semantic games attempting to redefine words rather than admit your point has no merit.

No, a bowling ball has nothing to do with towers over a hundred stories tall, sorry. That is not a valid explanation let alone an even reasonable comparison, but since you bring up deceleration in your inadequate comparison, where is the deceleration in the towers as they fell? They fell at free fall speeds, and according to your crappy bowling ball comparison, impact results in deceleration, precluding the possibility that the towers impacted anything below as they fell, REQUIRING explosives in order to clear the supports before that impact could occur. You cant even make your half ass comparisons work for you. I have applied the laws of physics and proven you wrong, your continual denials of this does not change the fact that it happened, it is only a pathetic attempt to distract from it. I know in your mind this is all about Muslims, and "we can't let the Muslims win", but this has absolutely zero to do with the laws of physics, which is why you have to keep invoking Muslim extremism in order to distract from these facts.

Oh, so some aholes put up a website with more word salad just like you practice and that is proof huh? Clearly no one has EVER lied on the internet! I noticed there is no math or anything close to a scientific examination on that site, just more semantic gymnastics like you are so fond of to distract from the facts.

Sorry, but I didn't use documentaries to collect these FACTS about physics, additionally my sources come from many places, including the official reports themselves. You accusing me of basing my logic on documentaries does not argue against the points, it is just yet another distraction in a long string of distractions you hope will divert people away from the facts I presented.

As far as your point about 2000% over engineering being a static load, please tell me, what do you call wind shear? Is the fact that the building was designed to stay standing in a hurricane a static load? Again this has nothing to do with the fact that the laws of physics do not allow for a building to fall at free fall speeds without explosives. Your foot and a bowling ball have nothing to do with massive towers. More deny, distract, and dismiss, no actual arguments of substance as usual.

You accuse me of denying reality when your only arguments rely on juvenile oversimplifications like dropping bowling balls on your foot while I have demonstrated with the laws of physics a complete collapse without explosives would be impossible. These aren't even just calculations with a margin of error, they are LAWS of physics. Laws are not malleable or prone to error, that is why they are called LAWS of physics.

I already refuted your claims about the insurance company payout, and your reply is to stick your fingers in your ears and say "LALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU!".  People did speak out, and then they died.

I don't like Muslim extremism any more than you, but your argument is a logical fallacy. I don't have to support your fantasy narrative of 9/11 in order to be against Muslim extremism, nor does proving the official narrative is false provide any material support to Muslim extremism. The fact is I don't like when my country and its people are USED AS TOOLS against their knowledge to be the iron fist in a fight that was not even theirs until they were induced into it with this false narrative. The "War on Terror" did far more to GROW Muslim extremism than it did to fight it. In fact there is a lot of documentation pointing to the fact that Al-quaida and ISIS were funded and trained by the CIA and other US domestic agencies. This isn't even conspiracy theory, it is in the main stream news! So in short, you can take your pro-Israel at the cost of everyone else rhetoric and shove it right up your ass.

This is America, and Americans are tired of being used as the military to push globalist interests, and we sure as fuck aren't going to forget that thousands of our people were killed in a false flag and then sent to war over a lie just because you cry about Muslims.

Again, this is all just designed to distract from the facts and physical evidence and the fact that you have no replies to my retorts. Who is offering this magical billion dollar payout for speaking up about it, and I will ask you again for the 20th time, how do you explain the official narrative violating the laws of physics in MULTIPLE ways?

You jumping right back to accusations of hate and latent homosexuality as your argument says a lot more.

Amazing demonstration of logic. Gold star.

I am pretty sure most people in this thread don't have a problem with transexuals or homosexuals for that matter. They have a problem with the rhetoric and totalitarian policies pushed using the banner of this small minority of individuals dictating to the vast majority of people what they can and can't say (kind of like what you are doing right now), as well as putting them at risk to satisfy the emotional demands of a small subsection of their group. You rely on accusing these people of homophobia because you have no other argument but to accuse these people of hate because there is no logic for you to stand on! You had better start working on growing a brain now, because the era of the social justice warrior mentality of emotion = logic is over.

Said the man with a 3 sentence reply to pages of information. What fucking prize? Who is paying for this mythical prize? How do you spend it if your brains are splattered? No, it hasn't gotten harder to hide conspiracies, the strategies for hiding them have just changed. They used to try to hide the information, now they just bury it in a mountain of bullshit information (much like you are attempting to do here in this thread). Needle in a haystack strategy. No, most conspiracies can't be kept indefinitely, that is why there are only a handful of willfully ignorant people like you remaining. I know you spend a lot of time trying to ignore it, but evidence HAS been being exposed in the decade and a half since 9/11. People like you are now the minority. Enjoy ninja boy.

So what country are you from? I am willing to bet it does not have anywhere near 300 million people from differing economic, social, religious, racial, and ideological backgrounds. I am also willing to bet the over all per-capita crime rate is similar to the USA if not worse.

I am not accusing him of anything. Those exact words came right out of his own mouth. I would link the video but I saw it quite a while ago and can not seem to find it again.

No, I am fairly certain. I have gone up against the real McCoy plenty of times and he falls way short. The vast majority of his "arguments" aren't even challenging. Just divert divert divert. Of course what is left when you have no argument?  

He is not a good enough shill to be a professional. Probably just a freelance ideologue.

Yes, because I understand physics completely enough to know anything else is impossible. There is tons of other evidence as well, but most of it is debatable forever and ever, which I know is your goal to avoid hard evidence such as this. This is not up for debate, it is a fact.

You sound like a parrot. I did not just cite large amounts that could have been made by the government, I also listed off many private financial organizations that had a lot to gain from this event going down as well. It is becoming increasingly clear you aren't even skimming any of the information I present. Afraid you might learn something you won't like? Perhaps you are reviewing this information and choose to maintain your facade of willful ignorance. Again, you never explained where this mythical  payout comes from. Also you never explained how that person keeps from catching a bullet after they collect.

By your logic, any time there is a massive pay out there is no chance of keeping a secret. If that is the case, how do companies develop new super profitable products and keep them secret? That often involves thousands of people. How are they all kept quiet when a payday is just a phone call away? I am seeing a few gaping holes in your logic here. Really I shouldn't call it logic though, I should call it knee jerk reactionary conditioning to information that causes cognitive dissonance resulting from your confirmation bias.

Who exactly is offering all this money for this "secret". A "secret" by the way that was known by most of the world's intelligence agencies before the attack even happened. The only people in the dark are people like you, and people who get their information from a talking head in their glowing box. The real powers that be do not consider this event a mystery.

Again, let me explain how conspiracies are kept quiet.

COMPARTMENTALIZATION

This is a strategy practiced for thousands of years, from military and intelligence agencies, to private enterprise. The idea is that each individual involved on the project is only given as much information as they need to complete a tiny portion of the project. Either they are told nothing or they are given an alternate explanation, also known as a cover story, for what they are working on. In this way most individuals working on the project will believe something else other than the reality of the project, and the ones who don't will not have enough information to figure out what the end goal is themselves let alone prove it to anyone else.


NON-DISCLOSURE AGREEMENTS

These are used widely in business as well as government. As you might know, Hillary Clinton is currently being investigated for breaking a non-disclosure agreement with the US government over the fact that she mishandled classified information. These agreements are designed to keep individuals who do have actionable information from sharing that information with third parties under threat of severe criminal or civil liabilities. If it is going to cost an individual everything they own as well as their careers to share specific information, they are unlikely to do so. Even if they do, the courts might very well aid in suppressing that information as it was illegally obtained.


MILITARY HIERARCHY

In combination with the above two methods, many of the individuals likely involved were in the military or intelligence communities. If they had any information that was counter to the official narrative, disclosing it would be an instant end to their careers and possibly their freedom regardless of its validity considering the sensitive nature of their work. Whistle blowers within these organizations do not fair well.


BRIBES

I don't really need to explain this one very much. People with information are told to keep quiet and they will become very rich. If offered this option, most people take it because they know it is better that the alternatives that follow...


THREATS

Threats usually take the form of violence, ending ones career, violence against ones family, their livelihoods, and other forms of harassment and marginalization. These can also take the form of financial domination. For example if the targeted individual has a mortgage, and you have a large pool of resources to pull from, you could simply buy the mortgage from the bank and then call in the debt forcing the individual and his family out of their homes. There are a million different ways this type of pressure can be applied.


FRAMING

If threats and bribes don't work, often disruptive individuals are simply framed for a crime. A popular tactic for this one is using child pornography. It has been reported by many activists that they have been e-mailed PDF files under some pretext later to find that these files contained a trojan virus that automatically downloads child pornography to their computer, instantly creating legal liability for them. Some individuals were able to take care of this problem before it was too late, others not. At this point it is simply a matter of sending a SWAT team to the targets home and their life is over. Furthermore anyone who ends up in prison relating to any kind of pedophilia charges is in for a short and painfully horrible life. Of course people are framed using other types of crimes as well, other popular tactics are planting drugs or accusations of rape, both which can be done quite easily with a single participant willing to do so.


SILENCE BY DEATH

This category is usually the last option after the others have failed unless the information held is so sensitive that they skip right over the others to make sure it never gets out, this is a rare circumstance though. Often this category is filled with ideologues who refuse to be bribed or intimidated, and take careful steps not to be framed by their aggressors. The object of killing the target this way is to dampen any questions about why the individual ended up dead, so as to not create more inquiries into their life and involvements before death. Usually these individuals are killed in such a way to make it appear as an accident, overdose, suicide, or other natural causes. There are drugs and devices which can induce heart attack and stroke which are not detectable under a standard coroner screen, and some which are completely undetectable. Overdoses can be as simple as slipping something into a targets dinner, then posthumously planting paraphernalia around the victim to make it appear self administered. The seemingly most popular way is what is commonly known as being "suicided", where an individual is murdered in such a way to make it appear as a suicide. This can be done by throwing some one off of a building, hanging the target, etc. Needless to say there are many ways this goal can be achieved.



Speaking of suspicious deaths, here is a small list of individuals who were tied to the events of 9/11 who ended up dead for one reason or another:

David Wherley Jr. - A General in charge of the 113th Fighter Wing at Andrews Air Force base, in Maryland who ordered fighter jets to scramble on 9/11.

Kenneth Johannemann - Kenny Johannemann worked as a part-time janitor in the World Trade Center when it was attacked and destroyed on September 11, 2001.

Barry_Jennings - He was the Deputy Director of the Emergency Services Department for the New York City Housing Authority. He was rescued from WTC Building 7 before it fell.

Beverly Eckert - A prominent spokeswoman for the families of 9/11 victims after her husband was killed in the attacks.

Job W. Price Commander Job W. Price was assigned as the commander of SEAL Team 4, a Naval Special Warfare unit based in Virginia Beach, Va. He was best known for being part of the team that found and then killed Osama bin Laden. 17 members of the SEAL team responsible for finding and killing Osama Bin Laden were killed shortly after the raid under suspicious circumstances when their helicopter was attacked with an RPG.

Michael H. Doran - Mr. Doran was a 9/11 victims lawyer who volunteered his services to help the victims of the 9/11 attacks receive compensation.

Christopher Landis - Christopher Landis was Operations Manager for Safety Service Patrol at the VDOT (Virginia Department of Transportation). He was responsible for road safety, road closures and maintenance of light poles.

Paul Smith - Pilot of WABC7’s 9/11 “International Shot” Chopper.

John P. O’Neill - The former head of the FBI's flagship antiterrorism unit in New York City, O'Neill had investigated the bombings of the U.S. embassies in Africa and the USS Cole in Yemen. For six years, he led the fight to track down and prosecute Al Qaeda operatives throughout the world. But his flamboyant, James Bond style and obsession with Osama bin Laden made him a controversial figure inside the buttoned-down world of the FBI. Just two weeks before Sept. 11, O'Neill left the bureau for a job in the private sector -- as head of security at the World Trade Center. He died there after rushing back into the burning towers to aid in the rescue efforts.

Deborah Palfrey - Also known as "The D.C. Madam". Ran an escort service which catered to many suspected to be complicit in the 9/11 attacks.

Perry Kucinich - Brother of Congressman Dennis Kucinich who advocated a new 9/11 investigation.

Salvatore Princiotta - 9/11 FDNY Firefighter from Ladder 9.

Ezra Harel - Chairman of the Israeli Company That Handled Security For All 9/11 Airports.

Bruce Ivins - Burce Ivins worked at the government's Fort Detrick lab on anthrax vaccines. He was questioned by the FBI during its seven-year investigation of the anthrax killings and was involved in the analysis of samples from the mailings that contained anthrax.

David Graham - Up until his death in September 2006, Dr. Graham insisted someone poisoned him two years earlier, likely with propylene glycol (anti-freeze) as he tried to publish a book. That book claimed he met two 9/11 hijackers a year before September 11th and feared the men intended to target Barksdale Air Force Base.

Philip Marshall -  Marshall was not just any 9/11 conspiracy author. A former airline pilot, Marshall was a close associate of notorious CIA drug smuggler Barry Seal, and a peripheral player in the New Orleans CIA/crime nexus that killed JFK, Martin Luther King, and many others. Madsen suggests that Marshall, a long-time participant in covert operations, developed a penchant for truth during the last years of his life. Dead in a purported murder suicide, official reports state he first shot his two children, and then the family dog before killing himself. Who shoots the family dog in a murder suicide? That sounds a lot more like a raid to me.

Prasanna Kalahasthi - A 25 year old USC dental student married to Pendyala Vamsikrishna, a Flight 11 passenger. She killed herself approximately one month after 9/11 in her Los Angeles apartment even though friends say she was ‘in good spirits and determined to finish dental school.’ Not only was this suicide shocking and difficult to understand, but the alleged victim’s husband, Pendyala Vamsikrishna of India, was never even listed on the original Flight 11 manifest, only appearing later as a passenger on a couple of conflicting unofficial lists.

Katherine Smith - She sold IDs to five of the hijackers, was “smothered with gasoline and “firebombed” in her car one day before she was scheduled to testify.

Benazir Bhutto - Bhutto may have signed her own death warrant with the famous statement (censored by the BBC) that Bin Laden was murdered by Saeed Sheikh. Her remarks pulled the rug from under Bush’s official 911 conspiracy theory.

Hunter S Thompson - He’d been working on a story about the World Trade Center attacks and had stumbled across what he felt was hard evidence showing the towers had been brought down not by the airplanes that flew into them but by explosive charges set off in their foundations. Now he thought someone was out to stop him publishing it. The night before his death, he called a friend and said:  “They’re gonna make it look like suicide, I know how these bastards think . . .”



Again this is just a short list, there are so many more people who had direct ties to the 9/11 attacks, were eye witnesses to inconsistencies in the official story, or were proponents for investigating the events who died under suspicious circumstances.

The fact is you have no counter argument to the fact that the laws of physics prevents the building from falling at free fall speeds with anything other than explosives. On top of that the fact that all 3 buildings came down directly into their own footprint is again counter to Newtons 3rd law. The fact is the buildings WERE EXTREMELY OVER ENGINEERED. They were able to withstand 2000% of its own load. They did this specifically so if there was damage it would be redistributed via the other supports and NOT cause a collapse, so this fact is very relevant regardless of what you want to explore to distract from these facts and avoid this topic with more tertiary discussion.

Not 10 seconds plus or minus .8 seconds. The video analysis says 9.2 seconds. The 9/11 commission report says 10 seconds. That gives us a MAXIMUM of 10 seconds, that is unless you think the official congressional inquiry into the subject was not accurate enough for you. Nice try attempting to edge in another second to endlessly dither over, not that it would help.

Underwriters aren't bullet proof. Furthermore I already gave you examples of how this process would net FAR MORE money than 4 billion dollars by covering up criminal market activity, tax fraud, and gold rigging let alone a plethora of other scams based on this event. If your only argument is it is too much money, then that is bullshit too because various organizations easily netted TRILLIONS of dollars over this event. So you are telling me successful conspiracy plots are recorded and on the books for your convenient analysis? Please, grow a brain. Also I never said ALL of the conspirators got murdered. Most of them were probably in the military and intelligence communities and know better than to open their mouths. I don't give a fuck what you buy, I am not here to convince you. I am here to force you to dance around your bullshit and lies and demonstrate to the world what a shill you are. The laws of physics prove you wrong, I don't need your agreement.