Very interested in this as well...  Even if I don't use it, the fact that it is available in a professional tool might help bring more "professional" investors in. It's a win-win no matter what to the holders of bitcoins. OP, you might try asking for a bounty to a particular bitcoin address. Once the address balance reaches 120 BTC (or whatever your bounty is, though 120BTC is roughly worth $1000 USD), then you begin work. Or you can start on it now, and just not release a finished project until the bounty is completed. Lots of people here like to donate towards projects that they believe will help increase the value of their investments. I think this is one such project, so I do not believe it would take long for a bounty to be reached. |
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Awesome, thanks dbitcoin!
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Holy shit! I got my new source for condoms!Bad move, going to hurt his diaper sales. This post is so full of win. |
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Requesting a feature: 24 hr production statistic
Deepbit has this, and it was a very convenient metric to have. I could easily take that number and determine whether I was still operating in the range of profitability, how profitable it was, etc. As it is, on BTCMine, I have no way to really know how much I am making per day, without tracking it manually.
I would prefer to see a "last 24 hours" measurement, but if you can only do it on a per day basis (i.e., all the bitcoins mined on 5/31 = 5.5BTC), then that's ok too. Just SOMETHING for me to be able to track how much I am currently generating per day!
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Well, whether you agree with them or not, those are 4 very real reasons that prevented me from switching from deepbit before the recent downtime.
These are cosmetic reasons. The goal of my arguments was to invalidate the logic reasons. Now if you think the cosmetics are worth 2-3% of your daily payout, go ahead, it's a free network. But don't come telling me it's "better", it's not quite the same as "I like it better". I never said it was better. I was answering the OP's question, which asked "why do people use pools with fees when the cost to switch is nil?" Those are four real reasons why. I don't care if they are logical/reasonable, they are reasons nonetheless. The arguments that you came up with can be just as easily rebuttaled, but I am not here to argue the merits of them, I was just here to answer the OP's question. The thing that annoys me with the BTCmine interface is that I cannot easily see how much BTC I made in the last 24 hours. The best I will be able to do on that front is take an average of the payouts I've had vs the time it took to get them, but that isn't going to be exact for a 24 hour period. You can opt to receive a daily email with your mining stats. Not quite as a good as on-site daily reward, but at least there's something about it. You can also petition the official thread to try and get the feature added. Surprisingly, it works most of the time. Good point - I'll go make a petition in the thread now. |
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I'll try
Won't put cc in, and not sure about telling friends about it yet.
If its like that free ipad thing where you sign up for something I won't g far with it.
Hey now, I DID actually get a free monitor from one of those things. And that was back in the day when a 17" LCD cost $300-$350! |
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- Reliability can be an issue with free pools
Not really. There are a few free pools that have been around long enough to know they are reliable. This remark is more relevant to new vs old pools rather than free vs pay pools. Also, it makes much more sense to attack big pools first if you intent to disrupt the network. Since we know the profit expectable from a full blown attack on the network is orders of magnitude less than the price of the attack, it is expect that the majority of attacks will be motivated by trolling/stupidity/politics/hatred for the project, so the bigger pools will definitely be a prime target. And somehow #1 and #2 pools in the network are pay pools, so... - Free pools often have lower numbers of users (for whatever reason), so increased variance in day-to-day mining collections That's only relevant to the people in DeepBit to move the f*** out to a cheaper pool. I can't fathom why, with the explicit motive of making money, one presented with the choice of equivalently yielding processes, only distinguished by usage fee, would pick the more expensive solution. - Pools with fees often have better user support and user interfaces. For instance, I much prefer the deepbit interface to the BTCMine interface. That's cuz you like it ghetto. I like my pool with instant stats, round times, shares submitted, miners top, email alerts and all the fancy shit. - Free pools often have lengthy payout periods. It takes me a good 24 hours to get the bitcoins from my BTCMine account, whereas I can ask for an instant payout on deepbit and get my coins transferred on the next block found by deepbit. That's purely cosmetic, and I would discuss the underlying motive of being in such hurry one would want to instantly cash out amounts around 1 BTC and lower several times a day. Well, whether you agree with them or not, those are 4 very real reasons that prevented me from switching from deepbit before the recent downtime. The thing that annoys me with the BTCmine interface is that I cannot easily see how much BTC I made in the last 24 hours. The best I will be able to do on that front is take an average of the payouts I've had vs the time it took to get them, but that isn't going to be exact for a 24 hour period. |
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In that case... make it 0.50 BTC, and I'll bite.  |
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Windows 7 will run fine on 1GB of ram and a single core sempron.
I don't know enough about linux to answer your question regarding drivers, etc. All I know is, many people are successfully mining in linux, and usually at slightly faster speeds than in Windows.
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At stock speeds, with little or no optimization or overclock, a 5830 will pull 220MH/s. So that setup will give you at least 440MH/s.
Drop it to 1GB of ram and a single-core Sempron processor to save money if you're really desperate. Also, I think cheaper hard drives can be had. The PSU I'm not familiar with, but if it has good ratings on newegg, it's probably ok.
Are you forgetting about an OS? Or are you using linux? Or do you already have a Windows license?
EDIT: And yes, get a different case. There's some good $20 specials on newegg that would work just fine...
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Such an investment, right this instant on MtGox, would drive bitcoin prices up to $9.5 per.
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If you expect bitcoin to blow up exponentially in the next few days/weeks then obviously buy coins, if you expect bitcoin to remain stable(ish) then buy mining stuff. If you expect bitcoin to die a horrendous death, maybe you shouldn't be here.
Someone needs to sig that. |
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- Reliability can be an issue with free pools
- Free pools often have lower numbers of users (for whatever reason), so increased variance in day-to-day mining collections
- Pools with fees often have better user support and user interfaces. For instance, I much prefer the deepbit interface to the BTCMine interface.
- Free pools often have lengthy payout periods. It takes me a good 24 hours to get the bitcoins from my BTCMine account, whereas I can ask for an instant payout on deepbit and get my coins transferred on the next block found by deepbit.
That said, I've switched to free-pooling for now. With deepbit having reliability issues from a DDOS attack, I'm not real confident that it is a better option than a smaller free pool anymore.
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See my spreadsheet, Invest or Mine? (link in sig). That'll tell you whether it's a better choice to mine or buy, once you input all of the information properly.
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Fair enough Exponere, fair enough. |
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Savings are not bad at all. Moreover, Grignon's coins don't decay to zero, but to the perpetual coin value. So speculation is not so easy.
What's wrong with speculation? Shouldn't people be able to choose when they want to buy/sell bitcoins? |
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P.S. Communism sucks. I've witnessed it, total fiasco ...
Communism works fine, it just doesn't scale up well. In that case... I now force you into my communistic dictatorship. You will mine for me, and I will distribute all productive goods evenly, which, for now, only includes you and I. Thanks for the extra 50% in advance. |
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I'm interested, as long as you're not going to sell my email address to a 3rd party.  |
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Bitcoin is nothing less than a binary revolution. It is a statement of purpose that embodies the sentiment "Don't tread on me". We're tired of endless ineffective regulation, a body of law that only protects the top 1% of the wealth-holders in the country, while fee structures and arbitrary transaction policies push common citizens to the brink of poverty.
Bitcoin is the upthrust fist of all internet citizens who simply wish to live their lives without needless interference. The existing banking system has become a defective node that will be routed around, if you don't 'talk' Bitcoin, we won't understand you or need you.
By running the Bitcoin client, you are telling the existing financial system you don't need them anymore. They've become the inefficient middleman in an increasingly networked world. The buggy-whip makers in the age of the automobile, the "dead tree" news distribution dinosaur gasping its last breath in the freewheeling ecosystem of blogs and up-to-the-second news sites.
Financial policy and regulations are now decided by who has the most money to contribute, the best lobbyists, public relations flacks and speechwriters. Monetary decisions are made by men who have never earned minimum wages beyond their teen years -- if ever, and never have had to live hand-to-mouth just to survive.
They can't relate, because simply - they don't have to. Bitcoin users know this, which is why the collective will to bootstrap the system and change the world has surged throughout the internet, filtered down to the most remote nodes and places on the planet. We've seen the financial disaster of 2008 unfold, seen the lack of regulation enforcement, the greed and corruption, and we've had enough.
It took the pendulum of greed and corruption swinging through the country like a wrecking ball, destroying lives and homes as the sub-prime monster fed on financial ignorance and bank-enabled butchery, to fuel our growing discontent. Watching the talking heads on popular news programs, announcing another round of congressional interrogation proved ultimately futile, to feed our belligerence.
It is time to take up the standard, hoist the digital flag high and cry out "NO MORE!". It is time to take hold of your own destiny and financial future by deciding for yourself where to put your trust. In each other, not a financial system that benefits the few at the expense of the whole.
They have awakened a large slumbering giant, and we will utterly change the face of finance.
1AsJaJ2AKuYySfKnjDczxoZsNekaY18NJD
I find the bolded portion ironic, considering the advocation of bitcoins in this post. But otherwise, I like it.  |
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Yes a few people have.
Its not a wise thing to do in bitcoin though.
I understand the wisdom of it. Fiat money relies on usury. CB's need to print more money to satisfy repaying the original loans. My question is if bitcoins start earning interest, where will this extra money come from to pay of the principle? It shouldn't be necessary to charge interest...Bitcoin's value increases over time, so there could reasonably be loans for 0% or negative interest. 0% or negative interest loans won't happen. The investor/bank may as well just keep the money instead of offering a 0% or negative interest loan. Loan percentages will be the same as they are today, less current inflation. So for a low-risk loan, such as a home mortgage of a person with good credit, you might see a loan of 2.5% to 3.0%. For a higher-risk loan, say, a credit card of someone with bad credit, you might see a 27.99% interest rate (vs the "normal" 29.99% interest rate). The lender will always have to consider risk into the equation, and they are not going to lend without some form of profit ABOVE AND BEYOND the gains/losses of the currency itself. Because the currency is deflationary, it will mean fewer people will be willing to take out loans. Instead, they will be more encouraged to save until they have enough to purchase whatever they want. Some people want to sell BTC short (this means betting on a price decline). These short sellers will pay to borrow your BTC, in order to sell them with the hope of buying those coins back later at a lower price. So someone could setup a bank that offers interest to depositors, paid by the people who borrow BTC to sell short. Those "borrowing" the BTC might not need to physically hold the coins if they are to be immediately sold short into the market. This would prevent people from running off with depositors' coins. However there will need to be a lot of collateral on hand from the short seller, otherwise if the price of BTC goes up quickly, there could be problems for the bank and the person who loaned the BTC.
Yet fiat was adopted to facilitate margin leading. In the future if bitcoins are to be used for trade what facility unlike fiat is to be used to create new capital? People won't simply lend bitmoney for free. No one needs to lend for free in the scenario I described. Nor does 'new capital' need to be created.  In a bitcoin universe if I needed to open up a mine, build a factory, develop a new tech (new capital) where will I get the bitfunds to pay for labor? There will be banks, and there will be loans, but the loans will be disadvantageous to the borrower. |
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