The coins were never on Ledger. The coins are never "in the wallet". The coins are "on the network", the wallet is only a tool to spend the money.

Now, think what you could have done in a way that have allowed others get your seed:
* did you initialize/properly reset Ledger yourself?
* did you write the seed somewhere else (a website, or a notepad to print it out)?
* how did you transfer money "to Ledger", did you provide only an address or something more?

I have a Ledger for a year now and no funds were stolen from me.


You'll have to give us much more info, but until now I tend to believe that you either got a tampered device, either done something that allowed somebody else steal your money.

Well, small pocket players should buy or earn some Bitcoin (could have been much better if they would have done that some more years ago). Mining is not everything. Just imagine the "small players" that simply got a few Bitcoin from faucets.


It's easy to cry that's unfair that the train has left, while you watched and maybe made fun of all those who got in for all that time the train was waiting.


I has simply re-distributed some wealth. Some wealthy people afford to profit now and it makes everything more visible. But I am sure that some have become wealthy exactly because of Bitcoin and they seem to be conveniently forgotten in this discussion.

If you've ordered when they had the starting advertising, you may have it for free. From my checks I think that I didn't have to pay for my card either.


In the second you click on Binance site that you've received the card, the virtual one will go pooof, and iirc you need that operation in order to get the PIN for the physical one.
For the record, a couple of days ago my first coin was BNB, I made a payment, BNB and then some EUR have been used there without any issues.


It will be in BNB. And it's a nice addition since it usually^* covers the -0.9% 3rd party processing fee (that you'll have after the first week of use)

^* I think you don't get cashback for ATM withdrawal.

Always question the declared reasons for any move the Chinese government does. Imho the "crackdown" is unrelated to pollution, consumption, planet and even Bitcoin mining. It may be related to the fact they have other plans with the population from there.

And on this "war on Bitcoin" (lol!) topic, I'll come with the fresh news: Chinese Public Firm to Buy $155M of Bitcoin Mining Hardware

The usual exchanges don't sell you their coins, they sell you other users' coins. The exchange only matches the orders of various users.

When you deposit 1000$ to the exchange, that becomes a number in the database.
Then you buy 0.018xxx BTC and then the database area for your account will change to 0$ and 0.018xxx BTC

When you'll withdraw you'll get the 0.018xxx BTC minus the withdrawal fees (which pay the miners/transaction fee and some more).
The withdrawn coins will come from other users that have deposited BTC.
Others will withdraw fiat, hence "your" 1000$ too.
Of course, after your withdrawal, the database will show 0 for your account.

And the exchange will survive just fine, since it gets trade fees (possibly from buyer and from seller too), withdrawal fees and so on.

On every kind of "gold rush" some will get rich easy and the vast majority will miss the opportunity. This can be seen as bad, by both those that are already rich and those that have missed the chance. But is it fair the way people get rich? I don't think so. Some are rich from the moment they are born. Is that fair? Some earn millions of dollars for acting or playing whatever sports. Is that fair? Heck, even those that get rich from lottery win are not actually "fair". And the inequality in the society is already there, I don't think that Bitcoin will change much. It would just give the chance to some more smart or lucky people to get a better life.

Is Bitcoin a bubble? Possibly. But it's the one of the very few valuable "things" we can be sure it's indeed scarce. This makes it highly valuable.


Bitcoin's success is a somewhat different story.
I see multiple things necessary for the success and the price is just partly involved in this.
1. It has to have a very secure underlying network. Checked.
2. It has to be valuable, "digital gold". Checked.
3. It has to be 100% fit for worldwide use for payments. Without that it will never be a full success and we are not there yet. But it's work in progress.
4. The "system" should remain working, stable and secure also after the block rewards become insignificant. I fear that this may be tricky, especially after secondary layer(s) will take over most of the transactions.

Mai departe, daca o s-o tina in prea multe lumanari de alea lungi, subtiri si verzi, o sa ne trezim cu o corectie de o sa ne punem noi lumanari si-o sa vina si popa...
Nu vreau sa sara asa repede. Mai bine domol si sigur. Sa vedem...


Na, aia cu masa Pamantului a fost un exemplu. Din cate vad DuracellDeMonaco se asteapta sa avem intercity si poate ca nu se opreste in toate statiile noastre ponosite.

I would not trust just random websites over the internet. Keep in mind that you hand over sensitive data which they may use to steal the full content of the wallet.
But I've read nice words about Dave ( Bitcoin Wallet Recovery Services - for forgotten wallet password ) also from people I trust (example).
So I'd start from there.

Nu sunt sigur.. asta doresti?


In afara de puiul de vulpe nu cred ca altcineva are ce-i necesar pentru a face saltul inapoi in timp 


Cred ca omul zice - pe stil Nostradamus - ca predictia mea nu este buna si urmatoarea ar fi $66.6k
Ce sa zic? Globul meu de cristal trebuie dus la service, asa ca momentan nu stiu daca ar trebui sa-l contrazic 

Pai daca iti dau toate datele de la inceput, tu iti poti face strategia de joc pe baza zarurilor care stii ca urmeaza. Nu prea ar fi bine 
Da, in teorie ei pot avea o lista de seed-uri ca sa triseze. In practica cei mai multi aleg seed-ul pe baza orei (milisecundei) curente si eventual fac vreo operatie asupra acelui numar ca sa nu iti fie evident de la inceput ce seed ai avut (si, repet, sa stii ce zaruri urmeaza sa dai).


Te inteleg. Eu am jucat destul de mult table (de fapt joc aproape saptamanal cu fiu-meu), dar nu am jucat pe bani si nu intentionez.
Cumva cred ca nu sunt suficienti oameni care sa ia atat de mult in serios tablele cat sa faca unul profi. Insuficienta cerere => lipsa unei oferte de top. Sorry..

Tranzactia este in prima postare. Au platit 77.6 sat/vByte, in total 0.00025764 BTC. Omul chiar a zis asta si in BTC, nu doar in lei. Si chiar este pe la 50 RON...
Ideea ca ar trebui sa fi stiut si ei ca e week-end si pot sa puna chiar si un sfert din fee-ul ala. Adica eu nu am afacere in bransa si tot stiu atata lucru. Sau sa intrebe clientul... (explicandu-i avantajele si dezavantajele)

Si banii nu i-au fost furati per se, ca nu au intrat in buzunarul operatorului sau a firmei, dar o mare parte puteau sa ajunga la client...

In rest sunt de acord, initial chiar crezusem ca nu este afisat niciunde tx fee-ul, ca sa aflu mai apoi ca in mod normal se poate alege.
Dar pana la urma Danny031 a facut cam ce trebuie: a explicat aici cum a vazut el situatia (perceptia este intotdeauna un factor de luat in seama) si ce s-a intamplat, cum a fost tratat si rezultatul.
Si acum clar va incerca si oferta concurentei. Cel putin eu asa as face. 

It's a web page. Nobody stops certain employees change its internals conveniently for 10 minutes to something that will also save/steal all that's needed to access the money later.
You have to trust them that this will not happen (to you). Or you use a proper wallet, with much better change to find out in proper time if the version you've installer has problems.
With bitcoin getting more and more expensive, more and more people will try to steal it.

Is blockchain.com responsible? Hard to tell; one would have to undoubtedly prove it.
And without that, their ToS pretty much makes them untouchable; if the user doesn't read nor understand it, too bad.

Correct means you also had the money in, right?


If you mean a transaction, then I think that somebody has stolen your money. Sorry.


1. The old laptop, although uninstalled, may still have the original wallet, but if my assumption is correct, that will also be empty.
2. You didn't say anything about where you downloaded electrum from, whether you verified it and what version it was. You didn't say anything about the update you've made - was it a popup dialog offering a download link and you downloaded from there "Electrum 4.0" (a phishing clone of Electrum)?
3. If you always had verified Electrum and indeed you had the money there at least once on the new laptop, you'll have to think on what software (malware) you've installed, what shady links you've clicked, where you saved the backup of the seed (mail, dropbox and other places you should not trust?) or who else had access to the laptop.

Da. A fost clar o coincidenta.
Crezi ca aia s-au uitat pe grafice si au zis "gata"? De ce sa nu astepte pana Bitcoin ajunge la 10, 100, 1000kg de aur si sa vanda? Sau de ce nu la 1.1kg? Fiindca nu e numar rotund?

Incercarea pana in panzele albe de a corela miscarile pretului Bitcoin cand cu una, cand cu alta, nu au absolut niciun sens.
Daca ar fi o corelatie intre preturi, aceasta ar exista si in afara unor momente relativ scute.

Daca mergem pe directia asta, maine-poimaine o sa vina vreun Nostradamus wannabe si sa zica ca Bitcoin nu a ajuns la 59720$ si nici nu va ajunge mai sus de acea valoare fiindca nu poate sa ajunga mai sus de 1/10^20 din masa Pamantului^* (vezi? si eu pot face corelari fara noima!)

^* sper ca nu am gresit la calcule

That's exactly why I didn't answer in that last topic. "Don't feed the troll", remember? On the other hand, what could we do, report it?!
And it has also occurred to me: all that drama, in all directions, (all those vendettas), is it that big or it's between a small number of "multi-account armies"?!

The pressure on DS shoulders is big, since CM is still paying very good and it may be the only campaign paying (hence encouraging!) local boards...

Ideea este - am inteles dupa ce Danny031 a explicat care-s pasii - ca in mod normal la aparat nu e problema.

Doar ca operatorul care s-a ocupat de problema aparuta nu a intrebat si a folosit direct varianta cea mai mare de comision, care a fost vreo 50 RON, adica semnificativa pentru suma tranzactionata. Pai daca tot au discutat, nu-l durea gura sau mana sa intrebe clientul cat are chef sa plateasca, sa evite neintelegerile...

Generatoare de numere cu adevarat aleatoare (sau cu interval de repetitivitate prea mare pentru fiintele vii cunoscute) exista.
Putem vorbi de dezintegrarea radioactiva (https://www.fourmilab.ch/hotbits/), undele/zgomotele din atmosfera (random.org) sau de dispozitive hardware pentru generat numere aleatoare.
Problema e ca nu cred ca vreo asemenea metoda este utilizata de "cazinouri", si aici iti dau dreptate. Si nimeni nu va plati pentru generarea de numere aleatoare doar pentru un joc de table 

Dar ... cred ca OP nu se referea la jocuri de tipul celor de cazinou sau PrimeDice...

You've understood me right, you were on spot. Thank you for the answers. 

1. There's an overwhelming number of so-called Bitcoin users that have their coins only at exchanges, web wallets or micro-payment wallets (especially related to faucets)
2. There are most probably Bitcoin traders that don't care about Bitcoin and they only deposit/withdraw fiat (do they count as Bitcoin users? I'd say yes).
3. I think that the chosen number of 10 addresses/wallet is wrong. I think that people who actively uses the wallet will either have maybe 100 addresses, either only one (not using at all change addresses); on the other hand there are plenty of services having huge number of addresses in their wallets; however, especially because of points [1] and [2] it's hard to determine a good and fair number of users.

Still, I'd say that the number of Bitcoin users is rather "small". We "live" in this "closed box" called Bitcointalk and somehow expect the rest of the world be similar. Well, it's not. Impressive number of people of every kind, color, education, age and so on don't care or don't trust in Bitcoin enough to use it. I would be happy with a 35-50M number, really (that's still the equivalent of Spain's population), and I think that the 135M number is a bit too optimistic.

...But this is only my perception...

I've received recently an e-mail about the new fees for the AdvCash card. And I have questions which may be of interest for others too (and that's why I ask here).
Unfortunately (for you) I don't really use that card. At least not for now. So my questions are about the inactivity fee.
It writes:

1. If, for the sake of example, I don't use the card for 10 months and then I want to use it again, will I have to pay inactivity fee only for months #4, #5, #6, or for all the following months (#4..#10)?
2. If I don't get to use the card again until it expires and after a couple more years I decide I want to order a new AdvCash card, will I have to also pay for those (obsolete) inactivity fees or not?

Thanks.