|
Interesting development. Nice efficiency increase.
|
|
|
|
Long time since last posted here, quite a lot has happened since. Basically the asic manufacturers have used revenues from sales of their mining machines to fund super sized mining farms, driving the difficulty up and up and then to add insult to injury, stopped selling their wares to consumers.
Don't want to say 'we told you so', fact is that we did but that's history, with the way things are going just now the only way for home miners to make any money is either to get 'free', (stolen, for want of a better word) electricity where essentially they are monetising the power supply or buying a new rig, running it for a few month then selling onto someone else. The rise in difficulty is going to make life harder and harder for miners and I suspect you haven't seen the worse of it yet, think 1,700+ PH by halving time next June.
The only way individual miners are going to be able to compete is by working together, I know it's an idea that's been touted before and failed but what's needed is a community solution, one that's owned by the community and can't be abused. We tried crowdfunding and failed but that doesn't mean that it's a bad idea, especially if it was project managed by a respected figure like Gregory Maxwell, for instance. There are lots of different crowdfunding models nowadays and many of them allow for equity ownership, to fund an all new 28nm asic program - forget about 16nm for now - and use it to build a competitive super farm would cost around $20 million delivering around 300PH using 2 cents per kWh electricity. Even at 1700 PH with halving in place it could generate net profits of over $2 million a month which could be used to build more chips/systems which equity holders could buy for their own use at cost prices or add to the farm to boost their earnings.
No VC's to pay back or interfere, no manufacturers shutting off supplies just when you need more hashing power.
$20 million is a lot of money, but when you consider the number of existing and potential[/i ]miners out there that might be willing to pony up $1000 it's achievable, and many miners might want to put in a lot more, especially if they know their money isn't being used against them as it were.
Comments?
It saddens me to make this statement, of all the wonderfulness that Satoshi gave the world with Bitcoin he has one fatal error in the concept that I am not sure we can fix in Bitcoin 1.0. This may offend people or they may just disagree and I can accept that but here it is:
You can not secure a network of trust and confidence on human greed. Eventually it will consume itself to the point where only the most aggressive, ruthless and cunning players get to reap most if not all the benefits. Satoshi had epic insight when he/she/group/x made Bitcoin but with the great understanding of economics, there is a glaring lack of understanding of human nature on this one point. Bitcoin is not robust in this area and in the end it the mining/processing will only be done by a few huge conglomerate interests and that is it.
You do not know how much this pains me to say. The best we can do it try and put capital into people who are doing what they can to make this accessible as long as they can but in the end, mining is not and will not be for the people in a manner that they matter at all, full stop. I(Dalkore), personally am on record a long time ago warning of this before ASICs hit and I was decried as either stupid or a hater. Well now I am being proven correct and it gives me zero pleasure in being right. Human interest and greed are some of the most powerful stuff around, it literally can move mountains if directed. In this case it was directed at the mining of a p2p decentralized digital currency and look what we have created, I literally have a data-center that only exist because of this singular idea that Satoshi gave to the world. I don't know what a solution could be and there might not even be one expect let it runs its course and maybe that will give us insight on how to fix it. On the bright side, the idea of a p2p decentralized digital currency with a publicly shared ledger is now planted firmly in the human mind and THAT, will never go away and even more epic ideas will spawn from this, you can be assured of that. If you want to talk about this more in-depth, you know how you can reach me. Thank you. -Dalkore |
|
|
|
I'm not very smart on mining although I started doing it in 2012 and stopped for a while but I have about $1000 on amazon so I would like to know what you people think would be the best bang for my buck on a mining rig from amazon for around $1000 I can go a lil over aswell. BTW: I won't be paying in electricity bills if that helps. Thanks in advance.
amazon you will overpay for a miner. can you withdraw the 1000$? you can buy the S7 currently for around 1000$ without shipping added. I can do that, but is it worth buying the S7? yeah it's the best option right now, great efficiency, less pace needed, less psu needed etc...although reaching roi will be still hard Amph is 100% correct in his analysis, he is giving you honest and quality advice. |
|
|
|
|
We run on 100% hydro-electric power so fossil fuel use is not an issue. Many mines do not have this access so it does create pollution. What I would say is that Bitcoin is worth the pollution because it decentralizes power to people in a fairer manner.
|
|
|
|
Big mine operatior and builders aren't likely to hang out here.
Or go into the detail needed to answer this very technical question with many variables that deal with your specific situation. |
|
|
|
hi guys ,
we are seting up a small farm with 30 s7s
i just have a question that bother me and is [ how long can last s7s in a nice enviroment[
also i would like to know if some one can let me know if there are some other hardware with more power than s7s
thank you
Antminer S7s will last a long time in a nice climate controlled environment that doesn't exceed 77 degrees Fahrenheit. |
|
|
|
|
It means the per block reward will be cut by 50% at set increments. Currently it is 25 BTC per block and when the halving happens, it will drop too 12.5 BTC.
|
|
|
|
Avalon 6 would be your closest match. Not as efficient but in the ballpark and that is still good enough.
Spondoolies Tech has the SP 50 http://www.spondoolies-tech.com/products/sp50It outforms the antminer on every front. Check the specs. The Antminer S7 is a baby if you look to the power of this baby: 0.15W/GH/s Effective Hash Rate 110 TH/s ± 10% Have you actually tried to get your hands on them? You can't just buy one according to my customers that have inquired. I was referring to miners that the average can get their hands on. |
|
|
|
|
Avalon 6 would be your closest match. Not as efficient but in the ballpark and that is still good enough.
|
|
|
|
Yeah it's pretty disgusting that just 1000 miles away I'm paying 9x as much for my power thanks to Edison hiking up the rates again for the next 3 years. Sad that it costs more for electricity in metropolitan Los Angeles than it does on a secluded island like Hawaii.
Too many people, too much demand, it forces California to buy power from surrounding states and they likely think their is too many people in LA, so they don't feel like they should give California a discount on the rates. It really taxes a lot of resource from that region. |
|
|
|
Is power there so cheap because of hydro-power sources ? This is an insanely low price for electricity...  Yes, that is why it is so cheap. The dams are publicly-owned so they can pass a great rate to their residents. It is really an ideal community model that provides a lot of opportunity if you know what is possible. |
|
|
|
This board does not seem too strong, asked a fairly pertinent question in the mining board hours ago and nothing yet. That's a good plan, insult the people you are expecting to provide free help. Wish I'd thought of that one. I was thinking the same thing. That is a solid plan to get expert advice for free. |
|
|
|
Hello, I am from India. And I am actually planning to start a Bitcoin Mining Farm business. The location for the proposed business is actually a hilly area with cool climate throughout the year. Commercial Electricity is also available at around INR 4.2/kwh ($0.064). I am planning for raising capital to the worth of $ 3 Million (INR. 180000000). I am thinking of buying 1,000 units of Bitmain Antminer S7. The Hardware itself will cost around $1.8 Million. The dedicated Internet connection shall be a 10Mbps leased connection. And I am planning to get a 2Mw electric connection along with backup generators. The Farm will be uptime for at least 95% during the year. Also, I will upgrade the equipment in regular intervals. But, before moving any further, I have a few queries: 1. Will it be profitable in the long run ? 2. How frequently do I need to update my hardware to be in the race ? 3. What mining hardware would you guys recommend for a Mining Farm (should be efficient and fast)? 4. Will the value of Bitcoins in respect of USD increase in future (say, 5 years down the line)? 5. What proportion of the mined coins should be immediately converted into fiat money ? And where do I convert those insane amount of coins? 6. If you are from India, could you please help me in understanding the tax structure that shall be imposed on Bitcoin Mining farms in India? Also, what custom duty is levied on import of mining hardware? 7. What are the recurring costs (except for Electricity, Salary of employees, and hardware maintenance and replacement costs) ? 8. Are there any Bitcoin Mining Farms in India? 7. Finally, is the whole effort worth the profits ? As per a Bitcoin mining calculator, it states that I shall breakeven in roughly a year. Provided I start today. If everything goes well, I shall upgrade the farm with another 1000 miners. Please help !! (Free BTCs for everyone who helped if everything goes well. Promise  )
1. Will it be profitable in the long run ?Likely not unless you have other revenue streams 2. How frequently do I need to update my hardware to be in the race ?As much as need to continue to get a positive ROI 3. What mining hardware would you guys recommend for a Mining Farm (should be efficient and fast)?S7, SP50 and Avalon 6
4. Will the value of Bitcoins in respect of USD increase in future (say, 5 years down the line)?No one knows, if they did they would not tell you, especially for free. 5. What proportion of the mined coins should be immediately converted into fiat money ? And where do I convert those insane amount of coins?That is a question only you can answer, everyone has different risk profiles.
6. If you are from India, could you please help me in understanding the tax structure that shall be imposed on Bitcoin Mining farms in India? Also, what custom duty is levied on import of mining hardware?Contact an Indian Tax lawyers, you should not take advice on things that can get you in trouble with the law from strangers on the internet.
7. What are the recurring costs (except for Electricity, Salary of employees, and hardware maintenance and replacement costs) ?
Everything above and your investors return.
8. Are there any Bitcoin Mining Farms in India?I believe so, not sure if it is still operating. 9. Finally, is the whole effort worth the profits ?
That is another question only you can answer, if you don't have passion for the business and what that entails, you will likely burn-out and figure it was not worth the effort.
10. As per a Bitcoin mining calculator, it states that I shall break-even in roughly a year. Provided I start today. If everything goes well, I shall upgrade the farm with another 1000 miners.Good luck! |
|
|
|
|
Antminer S4, S5 & S7. Avalon 6 and SP35. Those are the best choice at the moment.
|
|
|
|
While I agree with the commentary on the cheap power, I don't agree with waiting a couple of months to see since that is a never ending game in this space...
The point being there isn't any real advice to be given because the environment you are setting up the operation in will determine if it is profitable or not, in the US for example there are a select few areas where starting now one could be in the black with such a small investment unless the right set of decisions were made..
Ok now to the easy recommendation, pick a low cost hosting provider (Great North, HashPlex, Toom.in) and deploy your systems there, personally I would recommend Bitmain right now, but $40K isn't a large enough of an order size to get any discount from them, it's almost an order of magnitude too low.. Take a look at the all in cost of Avalon or Bitmain, include sourcing good PSUs (self promotion, I sell hundreds for large and small operations) and hosting, and pick a path..
This is good advice. Also you could buy BTC122.00~ and sit on those as mined coins, Today. Building your own facility will be a money loser if you are just mining at that scale for yourself. |
|
|
|
I ordered 2x AntMiner S7 that costed me a whooping 13 BTC + VAT and now with the big price increase, the difficulty will sky rocket because people paid only 4 BTC for a S7 and I'm pretty sure I will not be able to make almost anything back with my S7 investment, therefore I was thinking of trying my luck and solo mine on ckpool with my 2x S7.
What do you guys think ?
I would mine with it on a large pool and chip away at the ROI. If they are selling for more on the open market. That could be an option and you can mine a bit before you resell. |
|
|
|
|
I agree, once they are done pointing the blame on secure communication technology, next the investigators will have to tackle the problem of "funding source". They have serious equipment and it don't come from thin air.
|
|
|
|
|
Show Posts
