If you have sufficient resources to contract a murder, you can contract a murder - with or without an assassination market. On the other hand, if a bunch of people all want the same person killed, but nobody has sufficient resources on their own, an assassination market provides a useful tool. Think of it like crowd-sourced assassinations.
Problem is, people will kill for a much lower price than I think you are anticipating. I would be shocked if the price for a head was over $50 in a free, lawless, anarchist society. The reason it costs so much in today's society is because volume is low (no efficiencies of scale), and the risk of getting caught. If you had high volume, and much lower risks (i.e., the only risk is to the assassin if they are incompetent), then it would drive the price down to an extremely low level. Basically, EVERYONE would have the resources to contract a murder.
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Ok, I guess we're talking about two different things then.
I was talking about an open & legal assassination market that would inevitable present itself in an anarchist society. It would be a horrible thing, for many reasons.
Why? How would an assassination market contribute to the murder of non-deserving individuals? If you're concerned about people with lots of money, they can hire assassins already. If you're concerned about individual disputes turning into murder contracts, it doesn't work unless lots of other people contribute to it as well. I'm concerned about individual disputes turning into murder contracts. Why WOULDN'T it work with just one person contributing? That must be the part I'm missing...
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Ubitex is a matchmaking utility to find people physically near you who wish to do bitcoin <-> USD trades. It is an alternative to using paypal to pay someone for bitcoins, since a cash payment cannot be retracted after the fact. If two people meet in a public location, and can send bitcoins over their phone, then it should technically be a completely non-reversible and risk-free transaction for both parties.
The system looks for two people near each other who wish to do opposite trades. I might create a listing indicating that I want to buy 10 bitcoins. You might live right down the road from me, and indicate that you wish to sell 10 bitcoins. The system notifies us both that someone wants to perform a trade, so we contact each other and meet up in a coffee shop. I bring my $30 of cash and a bitcoin address, you bring a phone or laptop to send me bitcoins, and we swap.
Willing to provide more if this isn't detailed enough, but I need questions to answer!
18TKNbSLTrd3a2W8mtoH5uNzFhWRWNcuHU
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Thought this might make for an interesting thread...
If you've lost bitcoins (i.e. they're gone forever, completely unrecoverable), post how much you lost, and add it to the running tally. Right now, the running tally is 0BTC, since I haven't lost any bitcoins.
I recently read a thread about someone losing 0.000001 BTC, and someone else losing 20 BTC.
So person one would write: + 0.00001 BTC = 0.00001 BTC
Person two would write: + 20 BTC = 20.0001 BTC
Etc, etc. That way we don't have to run through pages and pages of thread to figure out what the running tally of lost bitcoins is.
Make sense? Good. Do it.
Starting lost BTC balance: 0.0000000 BTC
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No, post a link. I want to see this deal for myself!
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Sounds more like a betting website than anything else. Nothing wrong with that though, sounds like fun. I might check it out when I actually have something to work with.
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I'm just saying, there would be a LOT more of it happening, and it would be a LOT more common-place, if people weren't threatened with going to jail for doing it.
That's not what we're talking about. This system only makes it difficult or impossible to trace, financially, the funding for the assassination. It assumes nothing about the current legal system. It could work in everything from North Korea to Somalia to hypothetical anarchist utopia. Ok, I guess we're talking about two different things then. I was talking about an open & legal assassination market that would inevitable present itself in an anarchist society. It would be a horrible thing, for many reasons.
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The OP is utterly incomprehensible to me.
+1 if you agree.
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It also sounds like a great way for an ex-wife to get revenge. Or anyone who doesn't like you, for that matter.
People will kill for very little if they are good at it and there are no consequences. I would hate to live in such a society - I would always be living in fear.
Your example of government officials sounds all dandy, but it could just as easily be used against you. Someone gives a bloke on the street $50 to cap you in the head, and you'd probably never even see it coming.
All of what you say are concerns regardless of an assassination market. It could just as easily happen that your ex-wife or guy that doesn't like you gives a crack head $50 to kill you... An assassination market is really only useful as tool for a bunch of people to contribute a little bit toward the untimely demise of a widely dislike figure. BitterTea makes some good points here. And keep in mind that there are still would be courts, security providers, and insurance providers to protect against asassinations for meager bounties. And yes, even today and throught history, stupid people have been killing people for stupid reasons all the time. Hypothetically, an assasination market (or better yet an arrest market) could be set up against random blokes on the street who assasinate people for unjust reasons. So it works both ways. Again, assasination markets are a tool, just like nuclear energy or explosives. It can bw used for good of bad. But don't blame the tool...but rather blame the criminals. I'm just saying, there would be a LOT more of it happening, and it would be a LOT more common-place, if people weren't threatened with going to jail for doing it.
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Paypal transactions can be reversed multiple ways... most commonly, one can paypal with a credit card, then dispute the claim with their credit card company. Paypal will reverse the whole thing, and whoever was selling the BTC is left with nothing.
I understand that part. However, if I'm not selling BTC, but accepting BTC and paying people with PayPal, I see no risk involved. Well, whoever you are paying is at risk of you de-authorizing the transaction through your credit card company or paypal dispute or whatever other means. Just because you trust yourself doesn't mean everyone else does. There wouldn't be any risk to you, but there IS risk for the other people involved.
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Hey, I'm all for the dollar going wild with inflation. That'd take care of my mortgage in short order!
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Sweet. I've got three of those Sapphire 5850's on the way. Two will be here tomorrow. Glad to see they are performing well!
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Ninja-OCNer... probably for good reason. I wouldn't want to get on this crowd's bad side. They're all leagues smarter than I am.
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What OCN has "Upper management"? ... they are hardly big enough to have any management, what pompous, self-important know-nothings.
Longtime OCN member here. OCN has gone down the shitter the past couple of years. The new moderators are just god awful. They will give you infractions and close threads just for not agreeing with you or saying something simple like "stupid". It's beyond ridiculous. The management is killing the site basically. I found out about bitcoin from that thread though, so I'm glad someone put it up. There are a lot of idiots at OCN though, more beyond belief. But then there are some people really skillful with computers and some powerful systems. Agreed - and I used to be a mod! (For gameservers, but I digress) Maybe we should start a new OCN...
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I don't know much about this stuff, but based on the fact that a 5870 can get up to 2.7 Teraflops, that would make the government computer 370,370 times faster. I hear that 5870s get about 300 Mega hash/s so that means that the Exaflop computer would get like 111 MILLION Mega hash/s or 111 Tera hash/s. That's a block every 59 minutes on average, at the current difficulty level. Did I do my math right?
From gribble: The average time to generate a block at 111000000000 Khps, given current difficulty of 109670.13329248 , is 4 seconds Hmmm, you are right. 4 seconds... You'd basically corner the entire bitcoin generation market. EDIT: Once the difficulty stabilized around the new block generation, you would still be making about $600K/month off of it... though I doubt you could rent it for less than that.
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Hmmmm, good point. I figured they were technet, but didn't really think about the danger of them being deactivated, which could, potentially, happen at any time.
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Or next time, 409 him?
"Ar har! No, my friend. I will DDOS YOU if you don't pay ME $5000!"
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I don't know much about this stuff, but based on the fact that a 5870 can get up to 2.7 Teraflops, that would make the government computer 370,370 times faster. I hear that 5870s get about 300 Mega hash/s so that means that the Exaflop computer would get like 111 MILLION Mega hash/s or 111 Tera hash/s. That's a block every 59 minutes on average, at the current difficulty level. Did I do my math right?
So rent said supercomputer for $100/hr, and you've got it made!
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It's not really as scary as it sounds.
It was originally thought of as a way to protect citizens against corrupt government officials. The idea is that the more corrupt an official, the more people that will want him dead. An assassination market is simply a site that allows individuals to guess the date on which an individual will die. Each guess costs some amount of anonymous money (Bitcoin, in our case), and people can contribute to the growing pot without actually guessing too. As the pool grows, there is more and more incentive for a lone individual or group to expedite the death of the individual. Since it happens at a time and place of their choosing, they can be almost certain that they will win the pool.
The originator of the idea foresaw it not only being used domestically against dirty state officials, but leaders of aggressive foreign nations. For instance, if the Northeast United States seceded and became an anarchist society, they could rely on individuals to form a militia, or private defense agencies for protection from aggressive nations. However, they could also use the assassination market to protect themselves. What are the chances that a leader of a country will authorize an attack on the anarchist society if he knows it will bring a substantial bounty on his head?
It also sounds like a great way for an ex-wife to get revenge. Or anyone who doesn't like you, for that matter. People will kill for very little if they are good at it and there are no consequences. I would hate to live in such a society - I would always be living in fear. Your example of government officials sounds all dandy, but it could just as easily be used against you. Someone gives a bloke on the street $50 to cap you in the head, and you'd probably never even see it coming.
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An addition: Some kind of barcode or QR code that contains bitcoin addresses. You can scan it with your phone, enter the amount, click send. Viola!
I'm not sure how useful that would be in practice, but it sounds cool! It would make in-person transactions easier though...
"Ok, next I have a capital A, followed by a lowercase z, then a capital M, capital V..." vs. "I brought a QR code printout. Scan it and send me 5BTC plox."
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