yep yep

"Two big wrong assumptions by the BTC devotees get thrown up in this and every thread:

1. It is rare/limited so is valuable.

BS - rarity does not always equal value, plenty of rare things are worthless, just search eBay."

I don't know who you are referring to but it certainly isn't me. I know that scarcity is a property that can make something valuable but only in combination with other factors.

"2. Fiat currencies depreciate so they are bad to hold.

Yes, but only if you hold them in physical coins/note. If you have them invested then what matters is your investment return relative to their depreciation (inflation) and anyone who cannot out-perform inflation over the medium term is doing pretty poorly. No-one holds any serious amount of currencies in non-interest or non-investment formats."

I don't know where you are from but in the UK it has been extremely difficult or even at times actually impossible to match the rate of inflation with bank interest. This is because the Central Bank's interest rate has been held at 0.5% for years and inflation rose to over 4% a while back. Also note that most methods of calculating inflation are selective and controversial. The UK moved from the "RPI" to the "CPI" in order to exclude certain costs and housing costs and house prices are excluded. Therefore, in the UK saving fiat currency in banks is a losing game; you will lose purchasing power. Guaranteed.

In addition you don't only need to worry about inflation but the devaluation of the currency. Pound Sterling lost 25% of its value in 2008. Pound Sterling and the US Dollar lost 90%+ of their value over the course of the 20th century.

This leaves investing, which means assuming risk. This is fine but the equity markets of the US and UK are problematic. The underlying economies are doing very poorly yet those markets are now as high or higher than the crash of 2008. There is a serious question mark over whether the prices of equities should be that high. One of the reasons for the bull stock market is the low interest rates and quantitative easing. It is possible that the whole equities market is overvalued at this point and will suffer a correction.

These concerns and more are some of the reasons why people are unhappy with monetary policies and skeptical about the ability of fiat currencies to store value.

Yes paper currency will be around for 20+ years, probably more. However the US government DOES want a decline of the dollar, though not a death. Its enormous debts are denominated in dollars so it is in the interests of the US government to see a decline in the dollar because this means a decline of the real value of its debts. The pound lost 25% of its value in 2008 and this was praised by many in "The City". Paper currencies are in a "race to the bottom".

There is some logic in what you say but hoarding is far better for bitcoin as an asset class than a currency. For it to work as a currency people need to use it. Its not either save or spend. Save most of your bitcoins but use a few Satoshi's now and then to show willing and keep the real bitcoin economy going. Thats all.

The OPs post actually suggested not touching your bitcoin savings or "hoard" and instead converting fiat to bitcoin to spend when you want to buy something which is a great idea.

Very good idea.

If gold is $1315 an ounce theirs room for growth in bitcoin. Gold is $1315 an ounce despite their being three ounces mined per person on the planet. There aren't that many bitcoins to go around that's for sure.

"I have.. enough. Smiley"

No you don't. One can never have enough!

FREEMANSONS, YESTERDAY MORNING I DISCOVERED A TERRIBLE THING HAD HAPPENED REGARDING MY DAUGHTER AYN WHO IS A USER HERE OF THESE BOARDS.  I AM A SIMPLE CORN AGRONOMIST AND SINGLE FATHER AND EVERY DAY IS A TRIAL EVEN WITHOUT THIS KIND OF UNNECCESARY CALAMITY.  I HAD AWOKE TO DISCOVER HER ROOM WAS EMPTY, BELIEVING SHEHAD SIMPLY AWOKEN EARLY TO PREPARE FOR HER HOME SCHOOLING I SMILED AND COMMENDED HER FOR HER WORKMANLIKJE ATTITUDE THAT WILL CARRY HER THROUGH TO BE A POWERFUL INDIVIDUAL IN THE MARKET OF LIFE.  UNFORTUNATELY, THE TRUTH WAS THAT INSTEAD A TERRIBLE THING HAD HAPPENED TO HER AND YOU ARE TO BLAME.  I FOUND HER PASSED OUT IN THE KITCHEN, AFTER HAVING INVADED MY LIQUOR CABINET.  SHE HAD BEEN DRINKING A COCKTAIL OF ABSINTHE, GOLDSCHLAGER, AND RED BULL ENERGY DRINK.  BESIDE HER WAS AN EMPTY PACKET OF SUDAFED.  THE VOMIT WAS OF AN INTERESTING HUE.  I WAS VERY ANGRY AND DEMANDED AN EXPLANATION FOR HER MISBEHAVIOR, IN SLURRED SPEECH SHE EXPLAINED THAT FREEMANSONS HAD COERCED HER TO PERFORM A SATANIC RITUAL AND DECAPATATE ONE OF HER HORSE FIGURINES.  I HAVE BEEN FORCED TO CALL A MINSITER TO FREE MY HOME OF EVIL SPIRITS.  MY DAUGHTER HAS HAD A HARD LIFE SINCE THE DEATH OF HER MOTHER WHILE SHE WAS VERY YOUNG.   MY DAUGHTER IS A VERY IMPRESSIONABLE INDIVIDUAL, THE ONE TIME SHE WASALLOWED TO ATTEND A PUBLIC SCHOOL SHE WAS INFLUENCED BY A GIRL NAMED RACHEL TO PERFORM IMMORAL ACTIONS IN MY HOME.  I WAS VERY SAD WHEN I HAD TO SEND HER AWAY TO CLEANSE HER OF THIS SIN AND GIVE HER THE THERAPY SHE NEEDED.    NOW SHE IS BETTER AND ENJOYINJG THE ONLY THINGS SHE LOVES, HER GOD, HER FAMILY, HER BITCOINS, AND HER HORSE FIGURINES AND ASSOCIATED MEDIA.  I HAVE NO IDEA WHY YOU TARGETED MY DAUGHTER OR HOW YOU FELT THIS RITUAL WOULD HELP FREE CHARLES MANSON, ALL I DO KNOW IS THAT HE WAS RIGHTFULLY CONVICTED OF THE TATE AND LEBIANCA MURDERS.  HE DESERVES TO SPEND THE REST OF HIS LIFE IN PRISON, BUT IF YOU WISH TO FREE HIM PLEASE FOLLOW THE PROPER PAROLE PROCEDURE INSTEAD OF ATTEMPTING HOPELESS MAGIC RITUALS.  I HAVE DECIDED NOT TO SEND AYN AWAY AGAIN AS SHE ONLY AGREED TO THIS HELTER SKELTER SATANIC RITUAL UNDER DURESS AND HER BOOZE AND ALLERGY PILL FUELED BENDER WHICH RESULTED IN THE DEFENESTRATION OF MY CAPPUCINO MACHINE WAS A RESULT OF THE GENUINE GUILT SHE FELT FOR THE DISGRACEFUL ACTIONS SHE HAD BEEN A PART OF.  TODAY I HAVE DISCOVERED THIS IS THE SITE WHERE SHE WASCONTACTED BY THE FREEMANSONS, I HAVE ALLOWED HER TO CONTINUE TO VISIT THIS SITE BECAUSE BITCOINS ARE THE CURRENCY OF THE FUTURE AND SHE MUSTLEARN ABOUT THEM BUT I AM DISTURBED THE SOCIALISM, PERVERSION, AND FREEMANSONRY THAT ARE PRESENT HERE.  PLEASE CEESE ATTEMPTING TO SPREAD THIS KIND OF THOUGHT TO MY PROGENY.  I HAVE DECIDED TO GROUND HER UNTIL HER BIRTHDAY THIS SUNDAY WITH NO ACESS TO HER BITCOINS OR HORSE FIGURINES.  IF THIS COMMUNITY FEELS EVEN A SMALL BIT OF RESPONSIBILITY FOR THE ACTIONS YOU HAVE TAKEN, I HAVE PROVIDED A BITCOIN DONATION ADDRESS TO HELP REPLACE THE SACRIFICED HORSE FIGURINE AND MY CAPPUCINO MACHINE, AND IF THERE IS ANY EXTRA I WILL PRESENT THE BITCOINS TO HER FOR HER BIRTHDAY AS WELL. PRAY WITH ME, DEAR LORD YOU HAVE WITNESSED THE REBELLIOUSNESS OF YOUTH SINCE THE VERY BEGINNINGS OF TIME.  YOU UNDERSTAND A PARENTS ANGUISH AND HELPLESSNESS OVER THE ACTIONS OF HIS CHILD.  PLEASE HELP TO TRANSFORM OUR ANGER AND FRUSTRATION INTO LOVING CARE FOR OUR CHILD WHO HAS GONE ASTRAY.  HELP US TO BEGIN TO MEND OUR BROKEN FENSES AND HEAL OUR BROKEN HEARTS, BLESS OUR CHILD ALSO HELP HER TO MEND THE ERROR OF HER WAYS.  HELP AND BLESS US ALL TO DO RIGHT IN YOUR NAME AND RESTORE US TO PEACE AND TRANQUILITY AMEN.  HAVE A NICE DAY.

Whatever that is, it isn't boring. I can't believe they defenestrated the poor guys cappuccino machine. Now I'm off to expound some socialism and freemasonry, and to partake in some perversion.

If you want to raise other projects then go for it, I won't stop you. I was only using them as examples because they are well known.

Again it very much looks like a pot/kettle scenario.

I feel a degree of solidarity with anybody who has done business with that reprehensible individual. I think that anyone who is part of the bitcoin community should.

There was mention of legal action. What are the prospects for such action?

How about that then?

Also, do you like my new avatar?

WE'LL DO IT LIVE!!!

Ok. I have no dog in this fight but think that's outrageous. I've changed my signature to publicize this behavior.

"PS: Totally jealous. I'm guessing you do indeed have over 9000 BTC :|"

Yeah, he will do. Quite a few people have amounts like that having mined and bought in 2010.


Chang Noi

**Cough cough**

(Bats his eyes)

"You guys try so hard and fail at every attempt.  Does it suck to be such failure, or is it just "normal" for you and you don't know any other method of operation?  Do you lurch from one failure to another, wondering why the world is out to get you?  I've always wondered what it's like to be bad at everything you do, unable to succeed at anything.  It's actually pretty funny, keep it up!"

I'm not really into mining and haven't ordered anything from butterfly labs so I'm not really orientated to the situation. Did a butterfly labs employee just insult the bitcoin community and his own customers in the most venal terms possible? Or have I got the wrong idea?

"invested enough for a bloke with not a cent to his name right now lol, hoping for a steep rise to improve my situation"

A distinctively Anglo-American sentence there. Just buy and hold if you can't day trade effectively. Also, be happy. Although you've had a rough time with it so far you're still way ahead of the curve with bitcoin. If you buy and hold you are liklely to do well in the long term. Though this is a good strategy, also consider spending very small amounts of coin when you can just to keep the bitcoin economy going.

Are all the people with less then one bitcoin unable to drop a bit of fiat to get the feet wet or is it the case that they are having difficulty finding places to buy them?

That's told you Gabi 

Really?

I wonder what relationship cryptocurrencies could have to distributed computing projects like folding at home http://folding.stanford.edu/ or SETI. A lot of underused mining power could be used for useful projects such as this.