eXtremal -

Sorry for the beating you've been taking here.

RE: payments to z-addresses. I've got a little over .005 sitting in my first (z-addr) account; I've already received a payment from my second (t-addr) account. It looks like you're trying to figure out how to allow users to transfer funds from z to t accounts to enable payment. Is that correct?

I think you're right, Richie. Might as well do what you can to get the coins off your books, so to speak, and into the hands of the investors.

I agree there's little hope for them, but for form's sake if nothing else I'd like mine back in my wallet, not on an exchange.

Go Edric. Start by telling us what you need to fix the wallet

These are reasonable counter-arguments, and there's not a whole lot of activity in the thread right now, so what the hell, I'll hit it back over the net.

The basic idea seems to be that there is some minimal level of communication that should be maintained between developers and the community, because:

1 - That's what companies do to keep their customers happy.
2 - As a new industry crypto-currencies require a regular flow of information to grow.

As a reminder, my basic point was that ANY information has the potential to move the market, which is a reasonable explanation for the silence we're experiencing. Just to be absolutely clear, I'd love to hear from the developers - I'm just not worried about the silence because I see tangible reasons why it could be happening.

Okay, so point #1 above: pretty sure you're an investor, not a customer. You did not purchase your Octo from the developers. You bought a highly-speculative, negotiable instrument traded on an open market. Like dollars. Or Euros. If you have dollars and buy Euros, who's the 'company' you bought them from? The EU? And what's Europe's responsibility for keeping you informed about what they're doing to make sure you're satisfied with your purchase? I'm not saying it's zero, btw. The EU does release information about it's economy and plans to support the value of the Euro. For people who've *invested* in Euros. The Euro isn't a product or service, per se, it's a currency, a medium for the exchange of value. Is there some level of communication necessary to keep market demons from freaking out? Sure. But again, my point wasn't that the developers shouldn't be talking to us. It was that there might be good reasons they're not at the moment.

Point #2: I agree that a lot more information needs to get out there so folks can start getting their heads around this crypto-currency world. If we don't get increased stability and utility and, I don't know, fungibility or some such then it's going to be long, hard slog to see the kind of value increases we're all hoping for. But the flow of 'information' in and of itself, isn't always a good thing. Sometimes it's bad information, as in the complete and utter bullshit anyone who's spent more than a week poking around alt-currencies has experienced. Sometimes it's speculative (e.g. we're hoping to accomplish X by a certain date) and if you miss the date then it has a net negative effect. My reference to insider trading was an attempt to point out that in and around 'real' markets the flow of information to current and potential investors is tightly controlled, because it's potentially dangerous. If you want to solicit angel investors for a venture in the US the kinds of disclaimers you have to attach to your offering documents are full of statements like "forward-seeking statements", "highly-speculative", etc. No such controls exist out here in the alt-currency wild west (one of the reasons many of us like it out here, presumably), so the developers of the various currencies are free to develop their own information strategies for success.

One of them might be to keep quiet until you've got something concrete to say.

You have piqued my curiosity, though: if they did announce a secret lair in a hollowed-out volcano, would that make the price rise? Or fall?

I have no knowledge of the status of any of the initiatives hinted at by the developers in previous posts, but it's not useful to accuse them of treating the Octo community badly simply because they're not posting updates.

Updates - even short ones - move the market. Up, down, sideways, whatever. Complaining that the developers are somehow demonstrating insufficient respect for the community is roughly akin to demanding inside information from a company you hold stock in and complaining when they refuse. There's a reason it's illegal for company executives to trade on the knowledge of what's going on inside their organization - they could fleece shareholders. In the 'real' world the release of information that could affect the value of a publicly held security is highly regulated. NO such regulations exist in the crypto-currency world. That's why pump and dump schemes flourish - anybody can say anything they want.

There is no way the Octo developers are unaware of the rising levels of dismay being expressed on this forum/thread. They know. They are actively choosing to remain silent. You could take it as a sign of disrespect, but it's just as likely - possibly more so - that it's a sign of control and maturity.  Maybe, as I said in an earlier post, they want to improve their holdings before making an announcement they expect to affect the price. Maybe the projects aren't ready. Maybe there's a relationship with an exchange, financial institution, or other partner that is still being negotiated. I don't know.

It's possible, of course, that they've decided to abandon Octocoin for some reason. But I imagine we'd see some evidence of that in the market. I don't. I'm no expert, but there just doesn't seem to be the volume to support that.

Whatever their next move is, we don't need it quick. We need it right.

I don't think the devs have abandoned the coin. I think they're buying it. They probably have specific Octo holdings/positions in mind (possibly even necessary) to back their development plans, and of course they (and their investors) want to profit off of their activities and announcements at least as much as any of us. Octo is cheap at the moment. As soon as they announce something concrete the price will rise, possibly quite dramatically. Until they've acquired as much as they want/need they're probably in no rush to announce, and as you know it's a bit of a chore to get your hands on large blocks of Octo.

Like many on this thread, I counsel patience.

I'll put 1.8Mhash on the job.

Hermosa Beach, CA

Love my Octo. Now if I can just figure out how to attach my game to it. . .

We're not in any defined 72 hour window at the moment. The developers have proposed the following schedule:

{some unknown time from now} -> release of new (beta?) wallet

{some unknown time from release of beta wallet} -> 72 hour warning of upcoming verification

72 hours after warning -> 72 hour verification period begins

72 hours after verification period begins - verification period ends and new Aircoins are deposited 1:1 in - where? Another wallet, I suppose. Which we'd have to have before they can deposit/giveaway the matching coins.

Actually, it's not explicit. They gave no indication how long it will be until 0 hour, which is essentially what Juicemixer is asking.

I don't mind ISAWHIM postings either; he might be poking a sleeping bear, but arguably this bear needs poking.

I think I understand why the developers are silent - they haven't demonstrated much skill in the communication department. The original whitepaper was full of suggestions and hints of new ideas and approaches to building/maintaining coin value that were enticing - at least to me, as a newbie - but had some awkward phrasing and ideas that didn't quite seem to gel, along with an alarming tendency to toss out formulas and call that communication. Or education. If the developers are, in fact, students of the 'Chicago School' it would seem they skipped a lot of their English/Comm classes. Like most economists do.

Subsequent communications got progressively worse - my eyes nearly bugged out of my head when I saw those two photos - and this isn't exactly a patient audience. If the developers are, in fact, assembling a new plan I imagine (hope?) they're thinking very hard about what they're going to say next and how they're going to say it.

Here's my communication to them: you had a theory about how to control an alt-currency market. It didn't work, which often happens when expectations meet reality. The reason there's something called the 'Chicago School' is that there's different schools of thought on economics, free markets, etc. Everybody knows this stuff isn't black and white. And even if you have a great idea, well, sometimes the oncoming truck swerves into your lane. Now, in the face of adversity, is when you show us what you're really made of. And if you're not up to it, that's okay too: DESTROY THE PREMINE and hand over the controls.

Here's a formula: developer + community = price. In the absence of a developer, the formula is even simpler.

Context: I hold ~2400 aircoins, mostly mined. I'm still mining. And I've got a crazy idea: let's not sell it cheap.

Sorry to clog the thread with yet another client/wallet problem, but I'm wondering if anyone else has seen this: I don't seem to be able to send Octocoin from my wallet.  Blockchain explorer agrees I have them, when I send they get broadcast through multiple nodes, but I get zero confirms and blockchain explorer doesn't see the transaction ID. Nothing.

Any ideas?

port number?

I had to connect to their alternate stratum server - stratum+tcp://air2.okaypool.com:4455

I've been watching this launch for the last couple of days and mining it - well, trying to mine it - from launch. There are a few things I'd say are 'not a good sign' here:

First, apparently in the hours and minutes running up to the launch of their shiny new cryptocurrency, the devs were going through safety lectures and putting on coveralls so they could climb into a zero g (misnomer, actually, it's not zero-g, it's freefall) simulation/parabolic flight. So you can pretty much forget coverage for any sort of untoward event that might happen in the race up to the launch.

Second, the actual launch (mining of the first block?) is apparently triggered by someone on the team during the flight. Did you know they call these things vomit comets? Brilliant idea.

Third - don't know about you, but I was trying connect my modest ~5 Mh to one of the launch pools. Said launch pool couldn't find a block for nearly an hour, while someone (dunno who, seemingly not the other pools) was apparently finding plenty of blocks, thank you very much. Apparently the pools had to regenerate addresses and reconnect to stratum, etc. to finally get everything to fly.

Fourth, when the devs (hate calling them that, but okay) finally do make an appearance they blame the pool operators, saying they can't be bothered to 'test' them, and anyway it's just like a 'gold rush' so relax, there are plenty of blocks coming up. Well, yeah, now that the difficulty is at {insert higher difficulty here}

I'm still mining this (p2pool, getting about 20 coins every 10 minutes last time I looked), because there isn't much else to play with tonight. Yeah, I'm a noob. But it looks to me like this team forgot that they needed to be PRESENT for their launch, and not flopping around exchanging high-fives with their Macau-based investor in a plane over Texas.

Why aren't they around now? - They're at SXSW, fer chrissakes. Partying their faces off. Probably leaving paper wallets full of Octocoins in the urinals at Stubbs.

That reminds me, I'm hungry.