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1  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Service Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥[GUNBOT] Automatic Poloniex Profit Generator🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 on: December 30, 2017, 06:32:55 AM
Hey.  I'm 99% sure I'm gonna buy the 6 markets package before the deal runs out.  I really hope I don't suck at working the bot, but if so, each market license can be sold seperately right?  Many seem to want just one market.  I believe in myself and think I can get to grips with it, but I consider the worst also.
No. The special XMAS deal that incorporates everything for 0.1 BTC can't be sold (unless I misunderstood something) as it would severely damage the second hand market once the deal is over.

Yup, good point, but it shouldn't have zero 2nd hand value just because it's a special.  Allowing it to be sold as a single license would keep the market equilibrium and give buyers the same right to sell.  

Also, do I still need to buy Zeno GUI, or does the latest version have a GUI?
2  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Service Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥[GUNBOT] Automatic Poloniex Profit Generator🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 on: December 28, 2017, 04:49:55 PM
Hey.  I'm 99% sure I'm gonna buy the 6 markets package before the deal runs out.  I really hope I don't suck at working the bot, but if so, each market license can be sold seperately right?  Many seem to want just one market.  I believe in myself and think I can get to grips with it, but I consider the worst also.

Cheers.
3  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][SegWit2X] Together we will see a business through. on: December 28, 2017, 12:10:37 PM
Someone said the fork is delayed 2.5 hours?  I assume it's crap.  Not like you can exactly time block height.  Or is it a different block now?

Oh, almost forgot.

Why give a crap about what B2X is or isn't?!?!

I don't get why people get so crazy emotional over digital bits and bytes.  It's all a game until there's an actual real life use for any of this blockchain stuff.  To date there isn't a single instance of blockchain being properly utilized in any industry.  It will, but until then the only thing to scream and yell about is an actual scam.  As in, thieves stealing from people.  These forks, useless or not, give us something for nothing.  I'm pretty sure that's what you call a good thing isn't it?  

Have some of you performed some freaky marriage with your Bitcoin (or dearly loved altcoin) that you can't help go crazy hating on forks, or this coin and that coin?  You sound like lunatics.  Or do you want in on the free cash but can't bring yourself to part with your altcoin wife to join the party? Smiley.

Peace.
4  Economy / Exchanges / Re: Official Quoine Exchange Thread on: December 19, 2017, 06:05:18 AM
I've just signed up with Quoinex/Qryptos because other exchanges take forever to verify my ID. I hope this one goes faster.
I've seen the transaction fees are good.  You just need to improve the fees to withdraw EUR or USD and it would be great.  You charge 5€ while other places charge 1€ or less. Though I guess the reason is because your aren't physically located in Europe or America.

Regards

Unless you're margin trading it's the only fee they charge.  Zero trading/withdrawal fees.

KRAUSS, is the ban removed?   
5  Economy / Exchanges / Re: Official Quoine Exchange Thread on: December 18, 2017, 05:16:17 AM
I was recently banned from Telegram without a word of warning.  I spend 99% of my time there helping, answering users questions.  I've also been critical, but mostly constructive.  Pointing out bugs etc.  Nothing worth a lifetime ban.  Now I'm locked out forever by an overzealous mod with a tenuous grasp of the English language.  We PM'd after the ban and I could barely understand a thing he/she said.  I remember some gloating about speaking 4 languages, telling me I'll be 'picked off easily', and then being called 'sweetcheeks' a whole bunch?!  It felt like I was talking to a bad 80's AI program.

Mods shouldn't be banning people forever unless the offense truly deserves it.  I don't generally participate in forums and chat channels, but QUOINE telegram is a useful means of support.

Can you please remove this ban, and talk to your mods about proper use of authority?  People generally lack the ability to use power responsibly.  

Hi! Can you please update with your telegram username and the date you were banned?

Hey KRAUSS.  My telegram username is @Caerus7.  Not sure the precise date.  It was about a week ago.

Regarding withdrawals, has the issue been resolved?  Is it just BTC withdrawals, or all crypto, and FIAT?  I've traded at QUOINEX for a while as it always felt safe, but I deposited 20k recently so I'm a little nervous.  There's probably no need to be, but I'm kinda short on information.
6  Economy / Exchanges / Re: Official Quoine Exchange Thread on: December 16, 2017, 04:05:15 AM
I was recently banned from Telegram without a word of warning.  I spend 99% of my time there helping, answering users questions.  I've also been critical, but mostly constructive.  Pointing out bugs etc.  Nothing worth a lifetime ban.  Now I'm locked out forever by an overzealous mod with a tenuous grasp of the English language.  We PM'd after the ban and I could barely understand a thing he/she said.  I remember some gloating about speaking 4 languages, telling me I'll be 'picked off easily', and then being called 'sweetcheeks' a whole bunch?!  It felt like I was talking to a bad 80's AI program.

Mods shouldn't be banning people forever unless the offense truly deserves it.  I don't generally participate in forums and chat channels, but QUOINE telegram is a useful means of support.

Can you please remove this ban, and talk to your mods about proper use of authority?  People generally lack the ability to use power responsibly.  
7  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: 💥SOLARIS XLR💥⚡Masternode⚡Obfuscation,Seesaw⚡Zerocoin implementation soon⚡Xevan on: December 06, 2017, 01:31:47 AM
I thought I still had Dec 06 to swap?  If not, pretty bad wording.  Might've been nice to say 'You must swap BEFORE Dec 06', instead of 'UNTIL Dec 06'.

I definitely take most of the responsibility for not swapping them earlier, but still.  So I've got a bunch of worthless Solaris now?  Roll Eyes
8  Other / Meta / Re: Forum ranks/positions/badges (What do those shiny coins under my name mean?) on: November 10, 2017, 06:44:44 AM
Ok, this is a real post.  I'm not horrible at math, but it's definitely not my strong suit.  I can't figure the activity formula.  I even tried googling first, but I still don't get it.  All I could find was that commas are usually decimal separators, and sometimes used to mean AND/OR.

activity = min(time * 14, posts)

What's 'min'?  The word 'posts' is comma separated inside the brackets.  I assume it's meant to be.  Any help will be appreciated.
9  Other / Meta / Re: Forum ranks/positions/badges (What do those shiny coins under my name mean?) on: November 10, 2017, 04:06:13 AM
Are the donation numbers still up to date? I mean 50 BTC is a whole lot by now...

You beat me to it.  I appreciate the logic behind keeping it the same, but it's not practical.  Then again maybe there's actually people who've slapped down up to $400k for the cause! (and a label of course Smiley ).  At the very least there ought to be some much lower donation rewards, and perhaps a little something for time as a member.  Something for each year? I'm not overly concerned with titles and badges, but it does irk a little seeing newbie after 2+ years membership Sad.  I'd be far happier donating a small amount to help this awesome resource than posting for the sake of gaining activity.

When I post I talk and attempt to contribute more than most.  I'm just not a frequent talker.  The alternative is writing little nothing posts everywhere (case in point above) to get my activity count up.  That's not me, and shouldn't count as a post.  I imagine lots of 'newbies' do it, but if it were up to me it would result in subtraction, not reward.  They're deliberately pointless posts made just to get over restrictions, and be eligible for non newbie things like an air drop promotion.  Or whatever they feel the need is.

Edit - I was deleting that useless post before the hour.  I was simply making a point.  I see "Very helpful." still gets the prize.  So you read.. and yet.  Well, I tried.
10  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Pools (Altcoins) / Re: [POOL] YAAMP.COM multipool multialgo profit switch with exchange on: October 27, 2017, 04:18:37 PM
Yeah, timing out a lot.  I literally just moved to YiiMP after reading about zpool.  It looks promising, so hopefully I just jumped in at a bad time.  Is it, or is it usual?

@wacko - This looks to be it.  There's an IRC, but they're usually dead.  Haven't seen a thriving IRC since I was 15 Smiley.  Other than that the frontpage just has links to API, Bnechmarks & Difficulty.
11  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Service Discussion (Altcoins) / Re: Bittrex supporting Bitcoin Gold - will credit BTG on fork ! on: October 27, 2017, 07:58:53 AM
I think Bittrex will only provide support for Bitcoin Gold by crediting all Bitcoin account balances on their exchange. However, they will not support the immediate trading of BTG, so their clients still need to wait until it is live or tradable. Or, if their clients can't wait, they can just transfer it to another exchange with support for it, e.g. YoBit or HitBTC, and sell it for BTC or any other coins of their choice.

Yeah, they made it clear in the statement that they wouldn't be introducing BTG trading.  If you thought so it's your mistake.  What I'm not clear on is when we'll be credited.  It makes me nervous leaving anything on Yobit but so far they've caused me no issue, and what was essentially a frantic seesawing futures market for a few hours made me a killing.  Meanwhile, there's no hint of getting a BTG wallet on Bittrex.

I'm not really having a go at Bittrex.  Reading it back, their statement doesn't actually say a specific date.  Guess I just figured it wouldn't be too long after the snapshot.  My mistake.  The price is so low now it's not that important anyway.
12  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: bittrex is a scam website - AVOID!- WITH PROOF!! on: October 25, 2017, 08:50:11 PM
I make it a hard rule to immediately verify to the highest (regular) level before depositing a thing.  I think quite a few of these situations would be avoided if everyone did that.  Not all, but surely some.  Even if you've truly done nothing wrong, something has triggered this and now your stuck trying to do something you could have done well before putting your hard earned money on the table.  Don't you think there's at least a chance you'd better off if you'd verified first?  Anyway, unless you've deposited so much money that an exchange which makes a million a day would be tempted to steal it, it's almost certainly an erroneous system trigger.  Not a ploy to take what is probably small fry to them.  Annoying, but not a scam.

This is good advice, but in reality its not practical when you need to pick up a trade on something and don't have time to wait days/weeks to get verified before the price goes up.

When I created my account, even non-verified basic accounts could still withdraw. That changed 3 days after I joined. Interestingly, the newer your account the less you can withdraw. I can currently withdraw 0 BTC.

Regardless, doing enhanced verification was the very first thing I did. I'm not doing any shady, and using all my real info so why should I worry about being rejected or being stuck in hell? Bittrex is meant to be a reputable exchange. Through no fault of my own I was screwed by a policy change days after joining, along with a buggy verification process. They deserve to be called out until they improve their service.


I understand, but can't agree.  No trade, whether it's rational or FOMO is more important than peace of mind, or whatever you like to call it.  There will always be another good trade.  That's just me though.  I know most are used to being given a limited deposit/withdrawal amount without much verification.  Unfortunately with the boom comes a lot more thieves, hackers, scammers, launderers, pressure from government/authority to verify, and so on.  Exchanges have clearly been upping the KYC/AML ante lately.  There's a hell of a lot more at stake for them right now than most care to consider.      

I definitely agree with you about crap support.  I just got on to IC Markets (Forex exchange) live support a few hours ago as I needed them to change my email address.  An hour later it was all sorted. ASIC regulation is famously tough and basically forces that sort of immediate action.  Lots of people don't want governments to get involved in crypto, and personally I'm no fan of them either, but answering to nobody?....

Glad to hear you at least figured out the issue. @aliashraf  Am I still a newbie? Smiley

@aliashraf - What am I, invisible?  I've gone to great lengths to be abused by a mental person and I'm completely overlooked.  Damn, same post.  Still a newbie Sad
13  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: bittrex is a scam website - AVOID!- WITH PROOF!! on: October 25, 2017, 05:40:51 AM
Account also disabled and stuck in verification hell.

Been stuck for two weeks now - uploaded a perfectly good passport and selfie, absolutely nothing wrong with either, then was stuck on a verification loop for a week. Multiple support requests, no response.

Finally, they fixed the bug and now it just says to contact support. Upload the selfie + passport again into the support ticket, Another week goes by, nothing.

2 weeks and these guys are fast to take your money, but getting it out is completely banned, and for what? it's my fucking money I deposited!

My credentials are perfect, but after complete radio silence this is just a perfect example of a very large exchange that doesn't have the will to give a fuck about its customers.

If I had a time machine i'd go back and never do business with these guys. And buy bitcoin at 3 cents ofc.


I know that enhanced verification isn't necessary to withdraw/deposit at most exchanges, including Bittrex, but why take the chance of problems?  You obviously had the required documents to get it done.  I know they use Jumio verification which is automated, so if you can't use that anymore you are at the mercy of human intervention.  

Just one thing to keep in mind.  Crypto has exploded.  I've noticed exchanges taking a LOT longer to verify.  2 weeks is far from unusual now.  It's still not good enough.  They're making more money with the boom so they can afford to hire enough support to respond in 48hrs at most.  Tether is by far the most hilarious.  Or sad... I prefer to see the funny side.  I was about 2300 in their queue ages proly 6 months ago.  I'd only move up like 2 or 3 places a day!  I had a bet with a friend whether it would go through before 2018.  I lost, they actually sent me the ok a few days ago.

I make it a hard rule to immediately verify to the highest (regular) level before depositing a thing.  I think quite a few of these situations would be avoided if everyone did that.  Not all, but surely some.  Even if you've truly done nothing wrong, something has triggered this and now your stuck trying to do something you could have done well before putting your hard earned money on the table.  Don't you think there's at least a chance you'd better off if you'd verified first?  Anyway, unless you've deposited so much money that an exchange which makes a million a day would be tempted to steal it, it's almost certainly an erroneous system trigger.  Not a ploy to take what is probably small fry to them.  Annoying, but not a scam.

Now I'm pretty much just writing/posting so I'm no longer a 'newbie'.  Only been a member for 2+ years Smiley.  I am still moderately curious about these scam claims.  History's proven it absolutely does happen, but I'm just not sure it happens much on such a small, individual basis.  
14  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: bittrex is a scam website - AVOID!- WITH PROOF!! on: October 24, 2017, 07:43:13 AM
yup
scaming on the way

It's so easy to say that given numerous complaints, but this post is just 6 pages long after nearly 5 months.  Most of the posts are general responses or people stating they have never had any problems, so even 6 pages is misleading.  I'm not saying there isn't an issue.  They could be fine, or about to crumble.  Who ever knows in crypto land?.  All I'm saying is you've seen the volume there right?  If this sort of thing was systemic we'd be well over page 100.  Posting "scamming on the way' is an alarmist comment backed, relative to the seemingly large Bittrex userbase, a small number of one sided stories.  Is the OP giving the full account?

Ok, so manshed wrote -

1. if you deposit a large amount, they will disable your account and never reply.

If you deposit a truly large amount of money without the required verification of course your account will be suspended.  It's like dumping thousands on a card.  Visa/Mastercard WILL check to make sure it's all kosher before letting you continue on. You say in point 5 "Their verification doesn't work".  So you only had basic verification before depositing this 'large sum'?  I'm not sure if you're large sum is 0.11BTC, cos that's far from large.  If that's it, what on earth would Bittrex want with your 0.11BTC?!  I did the math and they make about a USD1M a day on trading fees alone.  Then add in their cut of withdrawal fees. 0.11BTC... for real?  

2. if you contact their support they will not rely.

That sucks, and happens often in all sorts of unregulated markets.  If you got an answer and it's now resolved, not telling the people you've alarmed is bad form.

3. if you try to log in they will change your desk login details and then you are not allowed to reset your password.

If there's some issue with your account disallowing password changes is good practice.

4. You can not take your money back either!

Disabling withdrawals on a disabled account.  You're seriously surprised by this?
https://support.bittrex.com/hc/en-us/articles/115001352132-Why-is-my-account-disabled - There's your FAQ page btw.
  
5. Their verifications don't work on top of it, you are stuck in limbo.

Not sure why you think you ought to be able to do all these things on a disabled account.  I do at least agree that you shouldn't be stuck in limbo.  Having said that, I'd think someone who put so much effort in to their scam alert post would hang around a bit longer than 1 day if things were still unresolved.

I'm not a Bittrex shill (though I would say that even if I was).  I've used them alongside numerous exchanges for the last 6 months or so and have traded/withdrawn/deposited a lot more than 0.11btc many times.  Enhanced verification was no hassle.  On the flip side, I was literally a mouse click away from sending thousands to BTC-e just days before they crashed and burned.  Though suspiciously elusive, they'd been in operation without issue longer than any crypto exchange.  I wasn't clear on a small piece of wording on my new banks online transfer form so I cancelled the deposit until I got around to clarifying.  Thank you Citibank for your crappy wire transfer form Smiley.

I'm pretty much just saying do your own research, don't just immediately take a bitcointalk scam alert post as the truth.  It's hard not to.  We're wired to believe everything we're told.  Literally.  Then we use our learned knowledge to decide, in nanoseconds, whether we know or believe it to be true or not.  In the OP's case I believe there's more to it.

FYI, writing distracts me (usually pen/paper, but any port in a storm), and I needed distraction from the frustration of being AFK for the discovery of block 491,407.... because we ran out of butter.  I thought it wouldn't take long at the shop.  It did.
15  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Mining (Altcoins) / Re: How to mine Bitcoin Gold? on: October 23, 2017, 02:24:44 PM
It's just another rubbish altcoin, but if you really wanna mine it -

It uses the Equihash algorithm.  The same as ZCash, ZClassic, ZenCash etc.  Google EWBF miner (for Nvidia), or.... I'm not really sure what the best Equihash miner for AMD is.
Step 2.  Find a pool that supports BTG mining.  I know of none atm, but I haven't looked.

If you're a complete noob and just want to get in to mining easy, Nicehash is it.  On average it's less profitable than figuring it all out yourself and finding a good pool, but that's the price you pay for convenience I guess.  I've personally found zpool calculates hashrate and earnings really accurately.  Their fee is higher than average, prolly cos they don't rip you off behind the scenes.  Just my opinion.  Lots of pools make things so vague you can't really question what you're earning.  Nanopool was decent when ETH mining was the most profitable.  I highly doubt they'll do BTG.

No-one can easily walk you through mining.  It's not hard to figure out, but you really need to do your own legwork to get the most out of it.  There's no shortage of info out there.  Good luck.
16  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Speculation (Altcoins) / Re: Bitcoin Gold, Price Speculation on: October 22, 2017, 04:24:26 PM
I think bitcoin gold will open with $ 2000. Later, it will be fixed at $ 1000 levels.

I have a few rules about conducting myself on the internet.  Or in real life for that matter.  At the top of that list, don't resort to blatant insult.  Find an intelligent way to express your opinion.  Having said that...

You're a complete f**ing retard.  

In what reality does a brand new coin with a shady background and absolutely no technical advancement just suddenly become - by a mile - the second most valuable coin in existence?  It uses equihash so it can be mined by 'the people' on GPU's?  Revolutionary.  BCH is backed by a lot of money and power and it's struggling to find relevance.  The ONLY thing BTG has going for it is that it's forked from Bitcoin, so other retards read articles with headlines like "How to double your Bitcoins" (yes there's an article with that exact title at the top of googles search for BTG.  Shame on you Sudhir Khatwani).  'Wow, if I buy some Bitcoin I'll double my money without doing a thing?".  Said retard then pops off off to check his BitConnect account Wink.  

It's just another GPU mineable altcoin with none of the advanced features of Ethereum, ZCash, ZenCash and so on.  Bitcoin is the biggest because it's the first.  That's it.  Compared to the coins I just mentioned (and many, many others) it's technically inferior.  Only with a huge amount of support and development is Bitcoin able to even attempt to keep up (eg. Lightning network) with newer coins that have learnt from Bitcoin.  That's no slight on Bitcoin.  Future efforts were bound to improve on it.  Anyway, will the 'developers' of BTG strive to achieve the same?  Cocaine benders and Lambo testing take time.... don't be selfish!
17  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Tokens (Altcoins) / Re: 🌟🌟🚀📈[ANN-ICO]ATLANT Real Estate Platform | INVEST. RENT. TRADE 📈��🌟🌟 on: October 11, 2017, 01:48:02 AM
I see the 19% bonus has remained throughout.  That's nice.  I'm waiting on a fiat deposit, but I'm not sure if it will clear before you reach your initial $5M target.  Will the 19% bonus continue beyond $5M?.
18  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] [PXC] Phoenixcoin v0.6.6.1 ~ NeoScrypt Original ~ 4 Years Old on: September 28, 2017, 09:22:29 AM
I tried withdrawing PXC from Cryptopia today.

Worked smooth and fast without any problems...

Heh, wish it were quite so easy the other way round Smiley.

I tried to withdraw about 8000PXC today, but got a transaction failed error in phoenixcoin qt.  Most of my deposits (@1100) are before I solo mined.  AFAICT there's just too many unspent outputs for the standard 0.01 fee.  Even the solo mined blocks need to be sent in fairly small batches.  Anyway, I saw the coin control setting and did some googling to figure out how it works.  I selected all 1303 deposits, which apparently comes to 19.3PXC in fees.

Is there an easy way to move my balance into another wallet cheaply with far fewer tx's?  Sweeping is it?  I'm not hard up enough to worry about a couple of thousand satoshi in fees, I'm just a scrooge.  I figured I'd ask here first, and just go ahead and let someone mine a 44.3PXC block.  Will that be a record?  I've never mined one over 25.50  Maybe I'll mine it.  Problem solved Smiley

I'll know from now on to consolidate regularly to avoid the cost of trying to move buckets of pennies.

Update - PC reboot and qt now accepted a send of the whole first walllet (250 or so) with a fee.  Happy to pay a few PXC than transfer 100+ times.  I'm sure someone who knows what they're doing could sort it out more efficiently.  Aint me. not me.


19  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Mining (Altcoins) / Re: [Awesome Miner]- Powerful Windows GUI to manage and monitor up to 5000 miners on: September 25, 2017, 10:07:39 AM
Hey patrike,

I've finally got a profit switching miner going nicely, and it truly is 'awesome'.  I love it, except for one thing.  I can't see a way to change GPU clock/mem settings before each algo switch.  

The hashrate difference between the least and most optimal GPU setting can be quite big, or a setting will run fine with one miner/algo, but crash with another.  I don't need MSI Afterburner integration or any of the extra features that come with the expensive versions.  All I need is a way to run a few batch commands before each miner & algo starts.  Like -

nvidiaInspector.exe -setBaseClockOffset:0,0,140 -setMemoryClockOffset:0,0,600 -setPowerTarget:0,75 -setTempTarget:2,0,83

I can see the option for batch commands with managed miners, but not with a profit switching miner.  It would be nice if there was an option in the Algorithms section to run batch commands before each algo.  Without this function I have to either run the GPU's at lower clock settings and lose profit, or manually run a batch file with optimal settings every time AM switches algo's.  Most miners have options to set clocks, but they can't query 10 series cards.  I'm happy to pay for this program, but I'm mining mostly for fun with just 4 cards.  I don't need all the features that come with the expensive versions.  Just a way to change GPU settings.  

Cheers.
20  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN] [PXC] Phoenixcoin v0.6.6.1 ~ NeoScrypt Original ~ 4 Years Old on: September 19, 2017, 04:20:46 PM
Quote
As far as I'm aware, my PXC p2pools are working well. The front end may display odd things sometimes, but all valid shares are accounted for and the payouts are fair. TBF used to charge 1.5% for PXC in the past, but we have what we have now.

Yup, that 6 hour period 'stuck' turned out ok.  Further blocks found were accounted for.  While we have you here, do you mind helping with a small problem?

I thought I'd try solo mining now.  The config sugestion works fine, but I get this error logging in to 127.0.0.1:9554 - {"result":null,"error":{"code":-32700,"message":"Parse error"},"id":null}
I'm prompted to log in, which works. I've forwarded the port and made sure it's open.  I actually have no idea what I'm supposed to be seeing from this 'portal'.  I assume general info about the wallet/blockchain.  Balance, blocks, difficulty etc.  I've searched for hours (I try to do my best before asking questions), and the closest I can get to an answer is it's a JSON format issue?  Or a problem calling the JSON info?  There's heaps of posts about that error from the old days of btc cpu mining, but no real answer.  One guy wrote his own little piece of code to retrieve the info, but I'm no programmer.  It doesn't effect mining obv.  I'd just like to log in and check the the various stats occasionally.  I'm on windows.

Thanks in advance for cluing me in.  I find this all really interesting, but I definitely need to learn a lot more though.  Phoenixcoin may be old, but it's a good opportunity to learn.
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