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Are the devs still making progress on this?
Very ... very slowly. The pressure of family life and work leave little time to work on this projects. I have several major features functionally complete but they need a few hours to really shore them up for testing on a test net, plus a backlog of support requests. I ams till hoping for help from other developers too! That would make a big difference. |
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Glad to see you're still working on it. Is there a way to check my balance without a wallet at the moment?
Not yet, but i'm just testing an online web-wallet which will be read-only, with no transfers. I'll post here once it's up. |
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So a bit of a status update on development, and that is that we are jumping straight to v0.2.0 in the roadmap and skipping 0.1.0 altogether.
What has been achieved:
1. Blockchain size and speed reduced and increased significantly.
2. Nodes will now be active for all functions, wallets and miners will connect to those local nodes and any changes to the blockchain will be broadcast to all connected nodes.
3. All nodes attempt to create and hash the blocks themselves but until 0.3.0 they will double check with the seed nodes that they have the correct data. Nodes which are not accessible from the outside world will always far and will always download block data from the swarm.
4. Generation of PoW is performed serially, so cannot be optimised with more cores/GPUs.
5. Data synchronisation is optimised to flow as fast as possible even if the nodes are underpowered, this will mean that regardless of state/stage transactions should remain atomic as all transactions are sequentially numbered and replayed.
6. Swapped to 1 min blocks to reduce the impact of a block being hashed and the time it takes.
7. Target inclusion is +30 blocks to give the network plenty of time to sync.
8. Difficulty is now super hard to reduce registration impact on the service.
What is outstanding before general release:
1. Memory leak in the sync mechanism needs resolving.
2. Transaction size when performing a transfer can become painfully huge, which is a basic design compromise of this system. This may not be resolved before release but will need to be looked into.
3. Windows wallet needs to be updated to use the new mechanism.
4. A public node will need to be made available for those unable to run Ubuntu 16/18.
5. Produce binaries for download of the wallet & miner.
6. Decide if the seed node will publish block data to a standard web server to be served up for wallets. This will avoid people having to run a node just to populate their wallet. Obviously this isn’t very de-centralised, but will offload one of the biggest
I have been struggling for time over the past few weeks, but just a few little niggles remain in the little bits of dev outstanding. Chief of which is the denominations system, which although solving some problems, causes others.
If we were to fix all tokens at `0.01` VELD, then to transfer 100 VELD to another wallet would require 10,000 new entries in the blockchain to be created. Which is quite heavy handed. Whereas if they are mixed, that transaction on average would be around 3,000 entries which is much better.
But you could also be left with a wallet full of 50.00 VELD tokens, so would be unable to transfer say 20.00 VELD to anyone.
So in that respect, the network also has to in the future (if this even becomes and issue) include some kind of “change” system/service which will be funded from the network fee collection pot.
But for the initial version it’s just something that needs to be worked around and the community members will just have to offer that service or, indeed I will if I can.
I’m looking forward to the release, if only so I don’t have to keep restarting the current service every couple of hours.
I stopped mining this a while ago. Will old coins be valid after new release? Yes, all mining activity has been transferred. |
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So a bit of a status update on development, and that is that we are jumping straight to v0.2.0 in the roadmap and skipping 0.1.0 altogether.
What has been achieved:
1. Blockchain size and speed reduced and increased significantly.
2. Nodes will now be active for all functions, wallets and miners will connect to those local nodes and any changes to the blockchain will be broadcast to all connected nodes.
3. All nodes attempt to create and hash the blocks themselves but until 0.3.0 they will double check with the seed nodes that they have the correct data. Nodes which are not accessible from the outside world will always far and will always download block data from the swarm.
4. Generation of PoW is performed serially, so cannot be optimised with more cores/GPUs.
5. Data synchronisation is optimised to flow as fast as possible even if the nodes are underpowered, this will mean that regardless of state/stage transactions should remain atomic as all transactions are sequentially numbered and replayed.
6. Swapped to 1 min blocks to reduce the impact of a block being hashed and the time it takes.
7. Target inclusion is +30 blocks to give the network plenty of time to sync.
8. Difficulty is now super hard to reduce registration impact on the service.
What is outstanding before general release:
1. Memory leak in the sync mechanism needs resolving.
2. Transaction size when performing a transfer can become painfully huge, which is a basic design compromise of this system. This may not be resolved before release but will need to be looked into.
3. Windows wallet needs to be updated to use the new mechanism.
4. A public node will need to be made available for those unable to run Ubuntu 16/18.
5. Produce binaries for download of the wallet & miner.
6. Decide if the seed node will publish block data to a standard web server to be served up for wallets. This will avoid people having to run a node just to populate their wallet. Obviously this isn’t very de-centralised, but will offload one of the biggest
I have been struggling for time over the past few weeks, but just a few little niggles remain in the little bits of dev outstanding. Chief of which is the denominations system, which although solving some problems, causes others.
If we were to fix all tokens at `0.01` VELD, then to transfer 100 VELD to another wallet would require 10,000 new entries in the blockchain to be created. Which is quite heavy handed. Whereas if they are mixed, that transaction on average would be around 3,000 entries which is much better.
But you could also be left with a wallet full of 50.00 VELD tokens, so would be unable to transfer say 20.00 VELD to anyone.
So in that respect, the network also has to in the future (if this even becomes and issue) include some kind of “change” system/service which will be funded from the network fee collection pot.
But for the initial version it’s just something that needs to be worked around and the community members will just have to offer that service or, indeed I will if I can.
I’m looking forward to the release, if only so I don’t have to keep restarting the current service every couple of hours.
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Any idea when transactions will be enabled? Maybe it's too soon for this but it would be nice to at least have some otc trading available.
if in my opinion, it's better to be activated immediately so that many people have otc trading, sir. if it is too long, fear will be delayed and there will be many obstacles. of course it's very uncomfortable There has been much re-work of the codebase, transactions have been completed but as of yet we have not made a release to production. So, there will be another release, along with the much planned re-boot of the blockchain and this will be within the next 2 weeks. |
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If not a secret how many people in the team? Or do you work alone? As it seems to me it is necessary to hire more managers on work with the community otherwise there will be gaps in the answers and in communication. When there are no replies and the team disappears, there immediately appears a fool that the project has closed.
It is just me with a couple of extra devs working on things like wallets, API services and some of the P2P network design. We are always recruiting for more, but it's early days and lots to do. I think PR is a problem when you have more than a handful of miners to deal with. I am pretty active on Discord which is our main interface to the world. |
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Yes and no, I am always busy on other things, but actually this has turned out to be quite a bit of work. And since i'm in that place I decided to make other changes that would help in the future too. Fixing the build on Ubuntu 18 seemed like a good idea, removing dependencies on uncommon libs etc....
I did also contemplate a re-write into c/c++, but actually as swift support spreads the issues of deployment will go away.
Having discussed the project at great length, there are also other changes we will make. The whole "design" for exchange mentality needs to stop, as the coins provide no purpose and little benefit for humanity. The "Ore" system, provides an opportunity to change that and to have real value and reward for humanity, but will not necessarily fit with the ideals of money markets. But that is all future thoughts.
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Normally a bounty campaign should start parallel or even before ICO starts, so that you can attract more potential investors. They are still organizing the bounty campaign and the half of the ICO is already finished then.
what? wrong thread perhaps? |
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Thanks for the update dev, so I'm guessing after the update the new wallet and miner will be available this Sunday right? It will be next Sunday, it's too soon to test all the changes that are being made. |
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So, the poll posted on Discord was as follows: (This probably isn't the best place to hold a poll but hey!)
1) Should we stick with the current Fiat style of denomination or move to satoshi style? (0.00 :thumbsup: , 0.00000000 :thumbsdown: ) ?
2) There will be another Blockchain restart, no-one will loose any tokens, does everyone understand this or will I get loads of DM's and Mentions on here (Yes I Understand :thumbsup: , no I need to be banned :smiley: :thumbsdown: )
You have to think about more than just the perceived value of what you have mined so far when thinking about the next question. Because just because something is scarce does not automatically add value, there also has to be liquidity.
People HODL'ing really hurts a currency if there is not enough to have movement on exchanges, so wanting only 10MM in circulation will kill everything flat if you want this coin to succeed. But also you do not want everything to be too numerous either.
With that in mind, would you like the economic target to be (estimated) (all at 0.00 denominations, otherwise far more tokens need to be produced :
1) 100M Veldspar (around 50M Tokens)
2) 500M Veldspar (around 250M Tokens)
3) 1BN Veldspar (you get the point)
4) 10BN, Veldspar
5) 100BN Veldspar
6) 1TN Veldspar
7) Other(edited)
Oh, i missed this?! Is the poll still ongoing? I would vote to move to satoshi style denomination and for supply I guess I'm ok with 10BN Veldspar. Yes it's still open until I feel everyone has had a fair say and put their positions forward. So is that 10BN + 8dp, would be 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 units. I'd hate to think about the size of the blockchain at that point. 8dp, and 100M feels more sustainable. But I will take note of your wants. Maybe I should phrase it as how many tokens should it be likely possible to mine. Damn, I just didn't take the blockchain size into account, what you're proposing is actually a lot more reasonable then. Hey, i'm up for anything. I love a challenge! |
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So, the poll posted on Discord was as follows: (This probably isn't the best place to hold a poll but hey!)
1) Should we stick with the current Fiat style of denomination or move to satoshi style? (0.00 :thumbsup: , 0.00000000 :thumbsdown: ) ?
2) There will be another Blockchain restart, no-one will loose any tokens, does everyone understand this or will I get loads of DM's and Mentions on here (Yes I Understand :thumbsup: , no I need to be banned :smiley: :thumbsdown: )
You have to think about more than just the perceived value of what you have mined so far when thinking about the next question. Because just because something is scarce does not automatically add value, there also has to be liquidity.
People HODL'ing really hurts a currency if there is not enough to have movement on exchanges, so wanting only 10MM in circulation will kill everything flat if you want this coin to succeed. But also you do not want everything to be too numerous either.
With that in mind, would you like the economic target to be (estimated) (all at 0.00 denominations, otherwise far more tokens need to be produced :
1) 100M Veldspar (around 50M Tokens)
2) 500M Veldspar (around 250M Tokens)
3) 1BN Veldspar (you get the point)
4) 10BN, Veldspar
5) 100BN Veldspar
6) 1TN Veldspar
7) Other(edited)
Oh, i missed this?! Is the poll still ongoing? I would vote to move to satoshi style denomination and for supply I guess I'm ok with 10BN Veldspar. Yes it's still open until I feel everyone has had a fair say and put their positions forward. So is that 10BN + 8dp, would be 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 units. I'd hate to think about the size of the blockchain at that point (around 7TB). 8dp, and 100M feels more sustainable. But I will take note of your wants. Maybe I should phrase it as how many tokens should it be likely possible to mine. What were your reasons for wanting satoshi 8dp? Trading? |
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So, the poll posted on Discord was as follows: (This probably isn't the best place to hold a poll but hey!)
1) Should we stick with the current Fiat style of denomination or move to satoshi style? (0.00 :thumbsup: , 0.00000000 :thumbsdown: ) ?
2) There will be another Blockchain restart, no-one will loose any tokens, does everyone understand this or will I get loads of DM's and Mentions on here (Yes I Understand :thumbsup: , no I need to be banned :smiley: :thumbsdown: )
You have to think about more than just the perceived value of what you have mined so far when thinking about the next question. Because just because something is scarce does not automatically add value, there also has to be liquidity.
People HODL'ing really hurts a currency if there is not enough to have movement on exchanges, so wanting only 10MM in circulation will kill everything flat if you want this coin to succeed. But also you do not want everything to be too numerous either.
With that in mind, would you like the economic target to be (estimated) (all at 0.00 denominations, otherwise far more tokens need to be produced :
1) 100M Veldspar (around 50M Tokens)
2) 500M Veldspar (around 250M Tokens)
3) 1BN Veldspar (you get the point)
4) 10BN, Veldspar
5) 100BN Veldspar
6) 1TN Veldspar
7) Other(edited)
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I should say for any spectators, feedback and suggestions are always welcome. This is not a situation where one dev (who is not an economist) just arbitrarily makes decisions that affects the input people have already made, and only as a community of interested parties can we find a solution that meets the needs of many.
The reason to do things differently is to try and solve the issues facing current systems, so to that end, the best way to avoid them it to identify them early and make good decisions and that can only happen from feedback.
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As this ORE things are mineable forever, does that means the total supply of this coins became unlimited?
If that how it is, then how do you maintain the price of this coins?
The interesting part if you read the original post is that it has "No fixed reward and no fixed supply", depending on mining power it will adjust accordingly if I understand correctly. There is no calculable supply. Only a likelihood: So for instance there are about: 1.206*10^24 possible ore positions: On average only 1 in 830k positions yields a hash starting in the range fff4->ffff, which is only the gateway condition, so that reduces the probability to: 1.45*10^18 Then, there are only 9000 magic beans of Unsigned 32 Bit Integer which have to be exactly matched within the hash. Those obviously have a combination of 4,294,967,295 possible values, and the key has 60 chances to match one of only 9000. This drops the possibilities to (and i've just roughly tried to work this out so please forgive some rounding): 182,306,394,022,900 Now these on average may have a value of around 0.48 veldspar (based on running some numbers this morning). But, as depletion takes hold an exponential chance of finding ore which has already been mined occurs. Making, the emission not a straight forward line. ANDThe ORE & Hashes are all incalculable and random. Which makes a straightforward calculation exceptionally difficult. It could be that some sets of bytes yeild many results and some absolutely nothing. Thanks for the very well detailed explanation, and so like you mentioned in the medium article this is also going to make it very hard to get it listed on an exchanges but do you think p2p trading would be possible once transactions are working? Yes, I think it would be possible. It is more about getting good feedback from the exchanges as to how they might need to operate. So far the Exchange i have contacted has not responded. But I have talked to lead developers from other coin systems to try and establish what kinds of interfaces they need and how wallet arrangements would work in practice. I don't think the economics will necessarily make it difficult to get listed, that would be more a choice for the investors to make. I am not looking to make any sweeping changes to the way the coin operates, but, there will be a point where some decisions would have to be made about wether we take everything we have learned so far, and start again, run with modifications to the existing blockchain etc. We are still alpha, and we would not have found these issues without significant input from miners, allowing us to work out how this concept worked in reality. I will be posting another medium article within the next day detailing my thoughts and probably have a community poll to work out where to go from here, because the next formation (based on what we know), will be the final major structural change as we move into Beta/Release. But I do want to make this absolutely clear, no-ones effort so far will be wasted, if we decide to shrink the ORE to reduce the supply then I will be converting existing tokens over to the newer, shorter format tokens and I will do that in an open and transparent way that is easily audit-able. Then the community will need to decide if the wish to remain with the current fiat style denominations, or go for crazy satoshi numbers (which makes no difference but somehow make people more comfortable dealing with incomprehensible fractions). As I say, the next major upheaval will kind of be the last hurrah before it gets more serious and starts to form an actual viable product. |
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When can we expect token distribution?
As in transfers? That is currently being worked on. It is not far off, but it has fallen behind making the node software stable. I will be writing a medium post on the progress and other issues later on. |
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As this ORE things are mineable forever, does that means the total supply of this coins became unlimited?
If that how it is, then how do you maintain the price of this coins?
The interesting part if you read the original post is that it has "No fixed reward and no fixed supply", depending on mining power it will adjust accordingly if I understand correctly. There is no calculable supply. Only a likelihood: So for instance there are about: 1.206*10^24 possible ore positions: On average only 1 in 830k positions yields a hash starting in the range fff4->ffff, which is only the gateway condition, so that reduces the probability to: 1.45*10^18 Then, there are only 9000 magic beans of Unsigned 32 Bit Integer which have to be exactly matched within the hash. Those obviously have a combination of 4,294,967,295 possible values, and the key has 60 chances to match one of only 9000. This drops the possibilities to (and i've just roughly tried to work this out so please forgive some rounding): 182,306,394,022,900 Now these on average may have a value of around 0.48 veldspar (based on running some numbers this morning). But, as depletion takes hold an exponential chance of finding ore which has already been mined occurs. Making, the emission not a straight forward line. ANDThe ORE & Hashes are all incalculable and random. Which makes a straightforward calculation exceptionally difficult. It could be that some sets of bytes yeild many results and some absolutely nothing. |
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My miner keeps crashing and I'm getting "core dumped" error on linux does anyone know of any compiling options to fix this?
If you can get us that dump or indeed some kind of crash backtrace then we can try and work out where the crash is and how to stop it. |
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