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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 11:39:26 AM
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To the good listener, half a word is enough.
If you can't understand the implications of everything that was repeatedly explained here on this topic, I don't think there's much more to be said.
I'm not the one who doesn't understand the implications. Say fellows, what happens to a currency when the greatest demand for it comes not from consumers looking to purchase products or as a store of value, but instead is a bunch of people looking to speculate in the currency? But since you don't have more to say, don't let the door hit you on the way out. I don't really mind if you stay, but I guess everyone on here is a permanent bitcoin bull no matter what. To be honest, I would be very concerned if one of my assets appreciated in value by ten times in just a month. |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 11:03:10 AM
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Your original question was about accepting Bitcoin for payment. Now you seem to want to argue about investing in Bitcoin. No one is here to give you investment advice. This isn't Bitcoin Customer Service and I sure as hell am not selling any. So the only reason I'm "wasting my time" with you at this point is because you accused me of trying to rip people off. If you are concerned about "market manipulation", then you are free to create an exchange that attempts to prevent it. Otherwise, Bitcoin is backed by nothing so Caveat Emptor. quit wasting your time with this alleged troll. , but where did I accuse you of ripping people off? Please use the quote function and show me where I personally accused you of ripping people off. Go ahead. I'll wait. By the way, I like how you put market manipulation in quotations as though you've never heard of it before. |
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Economy / Economics / Re: 1 BTC = 20 USD
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on: May 20, 2011, 10:03:21 AM
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As an early investor who came across 300 BTC today, and then found a backup of his 46,850 BTC wallet, the prospect of a $20 exchange rate pleases me.
I'd like a million dollars, please.
Lets see a pic of your wallet? Are you seriously going to try to cash out? How long do you expect it to take you to liquidate a million dollars of BTC? |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 09:55:13 AM
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DERP, your question was answered three times on the first page of this thread. At this point, you're just trolling. Wash trading is regulated in some markets because of some dumb IRS rules that allow you to write-off losses and force other people (taxpayers) to bear them instead. Freedom is a much more moral system than subsidized stupidity coupled with an incompetent regulatory regime. Sorry if you think it's trolling that I don't dump my money into Bitcoin because on two production charts sans argument. |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 09:42:52 AM
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See my first two posts on this thread, please.
You linked to charts of gold production over a period of time and Bitcoin production over a period of time and inferred based on these two charts that I should buy Bitcoins over gold. Well here is a similar chart I came up with, only it projects out to a much further period of time. What do you think? Is it a good time to buy?  |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 09:32:42 AM
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Really, there's nothing immoral about trading something back and forth to try to drive up price and activity for the sole purpose of taking advantage of other market participants who don't know what you're doing?
Yes, really. There's no inherent relationship between price and volume. You take the risk by inferring one. Market data is not guaranteed by anyone. No one else can decide for you what price you are willing to pay for something, be it Bitcoins or bread at the grocery store. If the price is too high, don't buy it. I think it speaks for itself when members of the Bitcoin community think outright deception and market manipulation is not immoral. You're essentially tricking people into paying higher prices for your own benefit. Compared to the small number of stores accepting Bitcoin, how can this prosper as a currency is so many people are using not as an actual currency, but just as yet another speculative, rigged market? |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 09:28:23 AM
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What exactly do you think is driving the price up? I mean, I don't really see new bitcoin stores opening all over the place, just the small number of the list posted above.
What exactly do you think drove the price of gold up? I mean, I don't really see any stores out there accepting gold as payment... Certainly not neckbeards thinking they're going to get rich by sitting at their computers. There is an increased demand for commodities gold in particular because there has been an excess of dollars put into the economy. Is that why you think Bitcoins are going up? Because people want out of the dollar? Is that why you answered my question with yet another question? Gold didn't just pop up last week through a computer program set to "generate gold". There is definitely a confidence disparity between the two. |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 03:27:38 AM
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What is stopping from me wash trading BTC?
Nothing, since you have multiple addresses. There is nothing illegal or immoral about moving your Bitcoins between them. Really, there's nothing immoral about trading something back and forth to try to drive up price and activity for the sole purpose of taking advantage of other market participants who don't know what you're doing? |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 03:15:54 AM
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I already referred to the list, but the point was that how is it supposed to function as a currency if there are only a tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny number of stores willing to accept it. I think people forgetting that this is supposed to be a currency, not really an investment. (Or maybe to other it is supposed to be investment, but as currency it's not really good to have such a small people using it was a currency and the vast majority speculating in it.)
It's new. Stores aren't going to all start accepting Bitcoin immediately. Some might want the exchange rate to settle down. Some might not have the technical know how. Some haven't even heard about Bitcoin yet. Etc. It is growing though. So, we shall see. Well is there a place that actually does showcase NEW stores? I mean, yeah, I can look through that list every week, but I won't necessarily notice when new shops pop up. It would be cool to date new merchants so we can see growth easily. I'd guess the number of new this month is the same as the number up until this month. Each one used to be news and get me excited, but now they just keep coming. Yeah second this. I want to see growth. Just having a list of 30 stores or whatever for your new currency is pitiful, but it might not look that way if there is rapid growth. |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 02:16:48 AM
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I already referred to the list, but the point was that how is it supposed to function as a currency if there are only a tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny number of stores willing to accept it. I think people forgetting that this is supposed to be a currency, not really an investment. (Or maybe to other it is supposed to be investment, but as currency it's not really good to have such a small people using it was a currency and the vast majority speculating in it.)
It's new. Stores aren't going to all start accepting Bitcoin immediately. Some might want the exchange rate to settle down. Some might not have the technical know how. Some haven't even heard about Bitcoin yet. Etc. It is growing though. So, we shall see. Well is there a place that actually does showcase NEW stores? I mean, yeah, I can look through that list every week, but I won't necessarily notice when new shops pop up. |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 01:51:47 AM
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As with any investment, there is a certain amount of risk involved. Most here believe bitcoins will appreciate in value and would advise in favor. Then again, if we felt otherwise, we probably wouldn't be here.  What risk could there possibly be? One guy in here told me that BTC will have a better return than gold! it already has! For you maybe, but not necessarily for the new coming. What exactly do you think is driving the price up? I mean, I don't really see new bitcoin stores opening all over the place, just the small number of the list posted above. look at the btc wiki for a list. i've also come to the conclusion that a large economy might not necessary for btc to grow in value as long as the algorithm stays as is. I already referred to the list, but the point was that how is it supposed to function as a currency if there are only a tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny number of stores willing to accept it. I think people forgetting that this is supposed to be a currency, not really an investment. (Or maybe to other it is supposed to be investment, but as currency it's not really good to have such a small people using it was a currency and the vast majority speculating in it.) |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 01:45:48 AM
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i agree, the dark pools should be eliminated. still, btc is not a manipulated mkt like the USD or pm's
You know, I was asking about this yesterday in a few different places and basically what people told me was "yeah, it can be used to manipulate the market, but the liquidity it provides more than makes up for it" now gee where have I heard that before? |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 20, 2011, 01:42:44 AM
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the btc economy has exploded and is moving much quicker that pm businesses. much faster and easier than pm's.
the exchange price of pm's is hardly realistic with all the manipulation by JPM and GS as u know. huge distortions with all the paper pm's like SLV/GLD. we do have an active mtgox exchange. not perfect but not bad.
If the BTC economy has exploded wouldn't there be more than like 30 places on the internet that accept it? Is there a central place where we can go to new show stores opening up or accepting BTC showcased? How often do no BTC accepting stores become available? |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 18, 2011, 11:59:35 PM
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Excellent post goatpig, thank you very much for your reply. I may ask you more questions about what you said later, but I want to talk more about this Mt. Gox website and dark pool trading.
Do you or does anyone know a lot about Mt. Gox and BTC trading, specifically in dark pools for large amounts of BTC? Basically is there anything from stopping me and some other large volume BTC traders (if any exist and I can contact them) from allowing reciprocal access to our dark pool trading information and localizing liquidity during certain market conditions? This seems to be a bit unfair to everyone else, but if there are no rules preventing this then why not?
Anyone who is interested in colluding or knows more about this subject please do not hesitate to contact me privately.
There's the OTC (over the counter) channel on IRCfreenode with a web of trust application attached to it. Some of the most trusted traders over there have a lot of BTC on their hands. It's probably the second best place after MtGox to get ahold of BTC and it's definitaly further away from the spotlights than Gox. What is the channel name? I tried #OTC, but there is just one person in there. |
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Economy / Economics / Re: Can someone please explain to me WHY I should accept BTC over gold or silver?
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on: May 18, 2011, 11:52:59 PM
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Excellent post goatpig, thank you very much for your reply. I may ask you more questions about what you said later, but I want to talk more about this Mt. Gox website and dark pool trading.
Do you or does anyone know a lot about Mt. Gox and BTC trading, specifically in dark pools for large amounts of BTC? Basically is there anything from stopping me and some other large volume BTC traders (if any exist and I can contact them) from allowing reciprocal access to our dark pool trading information and localizing liquidity during certain market conditions? This seems to be a bit unfair to everyone else, but if there are no rules preventing this then why not?
Anyone who is interested in colluding or knows more about this subject please do not hesitate to contact me privately.
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