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If you took the block rewards off blockchain.info, then it would include the value at time of production. Thanks for mining the data  You're welcome! I'm not sure what the first part means, so here's what I actually did. First, I downloaded .csv data from this chart: https://blockchain.info/charts/miners-revenue?timespan=all. It incorporates block rewards, transaction fees, and difficulty (actual data for the entire network). On a log scale, you can see the downward steps resulting from block reward halving. Blockchain.info logged the data in USD based on the exchange rate each day (I don't know what kind of averaging they used for that). Next, I downloaded .csv data from this chart: https://blockchain.info/charts/hash-rate?timespan=all. As I mentioned previously, this is an estimate based on block solution times. I divided the first data set by the second one in order to normalize the revenues to a constant mining hashrate and thereby get a result representing individual miners rather than the entire network. Also as mentioned previously, it's standardized to 1 TH/s. Any individual miner would see results on any particular day based on his own specific hashrate that day. And of course, individual results vary because of randomness inherent in the system That's all I did. I used the data directly from blockchain.info, and added no assumptions about pools, utility costs, depreciation, etc. The overall downward trend indicates that over long time periods, the exchange rate has failed to keep pace with increasing difficulty. There have been many intervals when the opposite occurred (bumps in the curve), but the long-term trend is undeniable. That's why it takes more and more computing power to make the same money year after year. And it's only possible to profit from increased computing power because hardware energy efficiency has improved so much. All of which ties in with Sandal_Hat's comparison to the shipping industry. |
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It did not include input costs, though that's the only place where one is able to get a competitive edge.
Thanks for confirming that. So there you go. The 'joke' chart answers your question, since it gives the full history of 'profitability' (as used in the OP). It has been somewhat worse in the past. I think it will get still worse in the future. |
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It looks like it has a static price value for BTC, but that skews it because the electric bill is due monthly
No, it's gross mining revenue in USD. Basically (block reward)x(market price)/difficulty at a constant hashrate, using published historical data. Electric bill is not in it. Did your OP involve utility or other costs at all? It looked to me like you were simply lamenting low gross revenue. Please clarify if I misread it. |
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your chart is a joke
The joke is your inability to interpret a technical chart. The 'per TH/s' is just a scaling factor. If it makes you happier, lop three zeroes off the y-axis labels and read it as 'per GH/s.' If you understand what you're looking at, it says the same thing you ranted at Sandal_Hat about. Do the mods actually buy your 'just for shock value' nonsense? |
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Alright, now factor into that the average cost of 1TH. Four years ago 1TH cost a couple thousand bucks, now it's about $100. I bet the graph gets a lot flatter if you normalize against that.
Absolutely! Hardware has also gotten more energy efficient. The graph makes no allowance for any kind of expense, but neither did the OP's question (if I read it correctly). I just tried to answer the question in the same terms it was asked. |
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I've been mining for a little over a year with my first S9 arriving in Jan 2017.
During this past year, no matter the price, it never dipped below an equivalent of $15 per machine per day. The last two months, however, the difficulty nearly doubled and daily profits have dipped down to around $8-9.
[Chop]
Has the profit ever been this low? I'd appreciate any insights.
I think you are confusing revenue with profit, but here is historical revenue data. I downloaded from blockchain.info two files: Miners Revenue (total value of coinbase block rewards and transaction fees paid to miners) and Hash Rate (estimated number of tera hashes per second). I divided the first by the second to get revenue per TH/s, et voila --- https://i.imgur.com/mjIgED9.jpgTheir 'hash rate' is an estimate based on block solution times. I also downloaded price and difficulty data and calculated expected revenue using the usual math. That gave a very similar result, but it was a lot more work. I hope this provides some insight.
(Moderator's note: This post was edited by frodocooper to remove inline image tags.) |
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Bucc5207 makes a great point: profit does not mean cash.
....
So here are two scenarios:
***
Equity of 4000 to start the business with 3600 for a mining rig (depreciated over a year):
100 a month in electricity
800 a month in profits from mining
300 a month in depreciation of the rig
_________________________________
$700 cash in the company bank account monthly after paying electricity
Only $400 of that is taxable (after depreciation on your machine)
***
Debt of 4000 loan to start the business with 3600 for a mining rig (depreciated over a year):
100 a month in electricity
800 a month in profits from mining
300 a month to pay back the loan for the rig
300 a month in depreciation of the rig
_________________________________
$400 cash in the company bank account monthly after paying electricity
$300 back in your bank account after your loan being repaid
Only $100 of that is taxable (provided you didn't make interest on the loan)
Sorry to contradict after your kind vote of confidence. Both scenarios result in $400 of taxable income. You don't get a tax deduction for repaying principal on a loan. Unless the loan is interest-free, the debt scenario results both in lower net income and less cash. |
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I am treating it like a business. I was told to pay off the mining rig and then pull out at at least enough usd to cover electricity costs and then a little more on top of that so the business is not working at a loss. I don't know if its the right way but it seems reasonable to me. People who know more than I do please feel free to shred me to pieces.....
Not quite sure what you're saying, but it sounds a bit backwards to me. I don't mean to shred you, because you might have just gotten some bad advice. Profit is either there or not there, regardless of whether you take any of it out as cash. If the business were not operating at a profit (ignoring equipment depreciation, which is not a small 'ignore'), there wouldn't be enough USD available to cover the electric bill. Will it still cover the power bill tomorrow, when the difficulty goes up another 8-10%? How about later this month, when it bumps up again? |
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You can spend 1 hour + on a killer post and get a few upvotes worth .40... Yep. Steemit's motto should be "A penny for your thoughts."  |
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How long does it take to get one's account approved, because I registered over a week ago and still nothing
Mine took about a week, after the e-mail asking me to confirm my e-mail address. |
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I've been on steemit for about a month (as mountainherb). It has some flaws, maybe not fatal but serious:
- It's more a platform for content creators than a social media site. Unlike FB or Twitter, for example, you really can't post a brief thought and start a conversation with friends/followers/the universe.
- There is an enormous amount of junk, with no good way to filter it out AFAIK.
- There is no mechanism for contacting another steemer directly.
- They separated the actual conversational aspect into steemchat, which is even worse for junk and lack of filtering.
Overall, I like the idea of it, but I don't find it very useful, user friendly or valuable. Just my .02.
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Here is an example how much you can earn daily depending on your hardware specs
average daily earnings (Desktop pc )
NVIDIA TITAN V 0.00049044 BTC
NVIDIA GTX 1080 Ti 0.00025656 BTC
average daily earnings 0.00188198 BTC (ASIC Mining Hardware very expensive )
Where did you get these numbers? Your last figure requires about 22.5 TH/s and free electricity. What ASIC hardware can do that? |
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Oh! There's a lot of really good information in these articles. If you ever need any infographics, let me know! I'd love to help out.
Thanks, I might take you up on that. Mine are pretty bare-bones. |
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Your sharing will be very effective for me. Thank you
Glad you found it helpful! Thanks! |
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to throw this all into a ditch.. the above only makes sense if you solo mine.. if you pool mine then you are providing work and the pool is then paying you for a service... so slap them with all kinds of employer taxes while we are at it and demand healthcare!! Most miners never mine ANY bitcoins since they never find a block. What legal papers/contract were signed between the miner and the pool?? Just proof of work/shares that isn't on any radar of the IRS. It is like a bunch of guys pooling their money for lottery tickets.. only when things get big do the IRS start sniffing around for their cut
Should we all spam the IRS with millions of pages of records of $hitcoin mining and trading?? List billions of mined and traded dogecoin or the hundreds of worse coins?
And to take it further.. if you don't have autopayouts set, then you never got paid yet for your work at the pool until you do.. that could be years until you claim it just like if you were a contractor and did a bunch of work on house but never got paid until 3 years later. You suppose to pay taxes on the work you provided without getting paid??? And then what value was the BTC then? When the pool operator allocated into his ledger to eventual pay his debt to you or when you actually get it?
Income tax ran its course this 100 years and it is time to switch to VAT or whatever.
Tax law often doesn't make sense. Logical or not, it's the law. When they send you a bill for taxes, penalties, and interest, "That makes no sense" is not a defense. It pays to educate yourself. |
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Thanks, Avaemily and chulos!
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