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When is this Devcoin party gonna move its way over to the Devcoin forum? Some of this content could eventually be earning Devcoin some money, instead of going to this massive forum. http://coinzen.org/index.phpCurrently I cannot use it. There seems to be a googleapi for jquery running and timing out on it. All I get is time out messages. Ah just stopped I can get back on.  ThinkI |
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Open Source programmers working for free are working on projects that they choose to do not projects that some marketeer has asked them to do. It appears to me that what you are suggesting is like having a carpenter that chooses to work for free on Habitat for Humanity Homes and then someone expecting them to build a house for them at $3 per hour because they built that other one for nothing.
If we do not think outside of the box for this project it will be here`s the new boss the same as the old boss.
- Nova
Sorry I thought the point was to bring people, who want to fund open source projects, together with people, who understand how to make use of all the open source stuff already out there to make them happen. There is a big difference between the skill set and the mindset of a person who develops proprietary software for a company and someone who develops Open Source software. The latter is generally more enabled than the former as you would expect A business will still want a proprietary solution no matter how cheap the Open Source developers are. Its the intellectual property rights plus the potential for growth that gets the investment. I am trying to find a way around this issue at the moment but unless you are already well established or the software is only a facilitator like a word processor, IPRs are a big deal to conventional investors (an asset that can be sold if all goes bad). ThinkI |
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Would a task board make sense as a way to organise bounties aswell as allow people to bid on those?
Unless we start bidding on per word payment for posting to DevTome it seems very unfair, to me, to expect developers to start bidding against each other. It makes more sense to have those desiring a bounty to post what they are willing to pay in DVC to have it done. - Nova Since as of yesterday I am the only person who put anything up on the DevBank/Cyclos site I think we may assume that the average writer is not very interested in doing anything but write about their chosen subject at the moment. Of course a lack of promotion to writers may play a part in this. This is not a good situation to be in and has to change otherwise developers will be justified to complain. In any case writer bounties should go on the DevBank/Cyclos site. There is no need for a bidding war as bounties can start low and be raised if no one takes them. ThinkI |
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I think you comment about 2-way interest underestimates the advantage of something like locabitcoin. Using it anyone can create a local market if they wanted too. As long as there is some demand for the local currency conversion, there is a business opportunity for someone wanting to make a market.
We are all about creating demand for DevCoin, so LocalDevCoin should be a key piece of infrastructure. Or am I wrong?
ThinkI
I thought I was agreeing with you. Perhaps lost in translation but there are 2 different things being discussed. One is a broad devcoin fund or bank or exchange that makes an unlimited market for devcoiners and supports prices. I don't think this would work because I don't think there's enough 2-way interest to make it anything but a central-bankish entity. I'm also not sure it's a good idea even if it could work because it would give earners too easy an out without natural buyers, and avoids addressing bigger questions of distribution that maybe make it seem necessary in the first place. The other is just having more open, free-market, local exchange options for devcoin - be that work or bounties or fiat (like localbitcoin). This area is fundamental so it's not possible to underestimate it. Thanks for the clarification ThinkI |
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:::
What we need is a DVC/useful exchange. Like localbitcoins.com .
That way everyone can get involved.
ThinkI
::: I don't think there's enough 2-way interest yet to sustain an exchange. But I'm not against anyone testing ideas if I'm wrong. Something like a work/bounty exchange and something like localbitcoin would be my top picks for useful. I think you comment about 2-way interest underestimates the advantage of something like locabitcoin. Using it anyone can create a local market if they wanted too. As long as there is some demand for the local currency conversion, there is a business opportunity for someone wanting to make a market. We are all about creating demand for DevCoin, so LocalDevCoin should be a key piece of infrastructure. Or am I wrong? ThinkI |
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I like it - the idea of a dvc/$ exchange, particularly for devcoin where it makes sense for a project that appeals to non-techies to have a way to buy them without first having bitcoin.
I think everyone is to fixed on the US dollar. Even with a DVC/$ service most of the planet would need a $/useful service. What we need is a DVC/useful exchange. Like localbitcoins.com . That way everyone can get involved. ThinkI |
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That's interesting. Is there a way to copy the paragraph without the heading? Yes, however, you have to put the paragraph in a separate page and include it in both places. So if I had a page called paragraph1 containing the information I want to repeat, then if I put: {{:paragraph1}} in my document it would include the content of the page paragraph1 at that point ThinkI |
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one way to ensure quality content is what markm said about writing what had been requested by someone else. This way they get paid for writing stuff someone wants to read and is willing to pay small fee for.
I was advertising on here and Reddit, to write up Bio's for developers/artists on Devtome, (also to give me fresh material) but then I got a message from a Reddit reader saying it wasn't right to charge people to write on Devtome because Devtome pay me...so I stopped, focussing on reviews instead. Its a moral grey area I think, I didn't mean to break any rules, and to be honest wasn't sure what they were.....but easier to stop than get harassed. Is this what you mean, or do you mean something different? I think the distinction is: - If you choose to write something about someone then they have no control over the content so should not be expected to pay for it.
- If You are commissioned by someone to write something then they will expect control of the content and they should pay for this control.
- If the content is published under the Open Source license then you can put it on DevTome.
The fact that DevTome also pays you is irrelevant. However in the future I expect DevTome to pay less for the word count of content you were paid to produce. So yes this is the intention: to help authors get paid in DevCoin for work and so get people using DevCoin. Does anyone see this differently? ThinkI |
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So here is flam's data dump: http://pastebin.com/FDmGKHmDAll I did was scrape the pages. Then Sort alphabetically and take out anything devtome puts on the page. I tried to remove the majority of your copy & paste titles (in fact I removed the majority of them) but I got fed up and moved on. When I run wc on the alphabetized dump file it returns 32,580 words. When I hit it with uniq it goes down to 30359 (NOTE: This means you have 2000+ words that, when broken in to their own lines, are identical). That was a big catch but still felt low, especially with all the copy & paste I manually removed. So I got creative. I took the alphabetized list and I looked at just the first 10 characters of each line. My belief was that your "template" is actually the majority of your word score. I think I was right. Line count is: 2972, uniq line count is: 2256. A difference of 700+. That means at least 1400 of lines I broke out of the data dump start the exact same way, saying the exact same thing. Either you have OCD or you are just copying and pasting, changing enough wordage to make it appear unique at first. If anyone has a problem with this, admittedly, rudimentary analysis I invite you to take a look at the data set I included in the beginning of the post and check for yourself. (As a LoL player since beta I'm going to go out on a limb and say the majority of abilities/gains per level and descriptions you include are copy & paste too.) I had a quick look at this and I think some of the duplication you are measuring is due to the type of content. i.e. There is a lot of identical data, shared between the characters, being described. This is a failure of the Game not the author. I do not play the game and so I could be wrong here. Similarly the titles of sections will tend to be the same since the documents are about the same thing (I guess). These issues may be more obvious because the other content is not easily accessible to a native English speaker. I have had a lot of experience reading English work by non-native English speakers and it can be quite painful to unravel. Typically the same bad sentence structure is repeated over and over because the author only knows a few ways of expressing themselves. Given the content I would expect this to be painfully obvious to someone who knows what they are looking at. So yes there is evidence of templates but they are a product of the language skills of the author as much as anything else. Combine this with the subject matter which seems to have large amounts of identical data in it and I can understand why you would complain. If this were a native English speaker then I would suggest they work more on the differences between characters in order to give each document some originality. Since it is not a native English speaker I would suggest they also pick up some story books for an age range they are comfortable reading and look at how the author changes the sentence structure to make the story flow in a more interesting way. In this way they can increase the number of ways they have of expressing themselves and reduce the template feel of the documents. I would also suggest they read their work aloud, as if they were talking to a friend about the subject, and changing it to improve the flow and pick up their enthusiasm for the subject matter. So the question is, should we penalize people because they are not native English speakers or should we help them improve there English? This fellow seems willing to improve. ThinkI |
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I think the general consensus at the moment is: 'don't buy hardware unless you like playing with hardware'. I ignored that advice and regret it now. The reason is that buying hardware makes little business sense at the moment, unless your electricity is free. So the only benefit is the fun you get playing about with stuff. You could instead join a cloud mining setup. Buy some hardware in the cloud at the best price per GHS you can (which is cheaper than buying hardware direct) and then mine until the price per GHS goes up and sell the hardware back into the cloud. Repeat this and you profit by mining, trading and holding BitCoin. See the link in my signature for more details. The final alternative is to hold the BitCoin and wait. Whatever you chose, if mining is part of it then do make sure your pool is merge mining with other altcoins. That's extra coins for free. In my opinion DevCoin (DVC) would be a good one to merge mine. It looks like it will be producing a lot of useful stuff (that has nothing to do with altcoins) in the future, so you may find that you have a use for it. Of course that is just my opinion ThinkI |
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I have created categories for Free Open Source and for Proprietary, that seems a more useful distinction.
-MarkM-
Good move. ThinkI |
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Re over-thinking it: Not at all. On the contrary, maybe others are under-thinking it. A science article that contains false statements of fact is thereby fictional. Also, writing lies and writing truths both require the same writing skills, it is only the journalistic/research skills or application of those skills that differ. Given the fictional facts or the nonfictional facts, writing about them is still just writing about them. So maybe a better distinction would be reporting versus coming up with ideas / facts / topics to report. So the distinction isn't really in the writing, it is in who you interview or what source material you consult in order to come up with the "facts" (or fictions) that you are to write about. -MarkM- On that analysis most of the scientific knowledge of mankind is fiction. Very useful fiction, but fiction all the same. In any case, if its going to cause problems then, lets stick to writing and skip the Fiction/Non-fiction distinction. ThinkI |
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hey man i just read your "earn devcoins by doing things you enjoy" article and it was great! i've had a devtome link in my sig for a while now, but did not know i could get shares from it. Can you explain how i would do this please?
EDIT: i think i figured it out
I'm glad you found it useful, makes it worth the effort. But really for that link to be worth anything you have to contribute to threads that talk about other coins. Spread the word ThinkI |
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I don't even recall what default ad-categories it came with.
What categories do we need?
-MarkM-
Some basic categories to start with: Writing: Fiction Writing: Non-Fiction Art Then just look through DevTome and use the categories there to create sub categories. Anyone got any better ideas? ThinkI |
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Just added an advert for writing user guides on Cyclos aka DVCbank. I suggest everyone else who has signed up, do something similar (for the types of work they are interested in ). We need some (more?) categories added to help organize things. Who's going to be admin? Can adds be moved? ThinkI |
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Two, you want a particular article for some other site or some other use, but do not mind if the author also places it on Devtome. Since any article placed on Devtome becomes free open source, this is really the same as number one above. You might be thinking well I need this article and yeah I do not care if they also put it on Devtome but really, if they do make such an article on devtome as in number one above you can then grab the article anyway, so this number two option is really just a different way of thinking about that same old number one option. You have to realise that everything on Devtome is up for grabs so maybe you don't need to commission an article for yourself, maybe you can commission one for Devtome and then, like any/every other Devtome article, grab it for your own use.
I like this one for user guides and similar. No-one cares about copyright, in fact copying is good, and DevCoin can do the hosting for the guide. If the whole open source community used DevCoin for user guides then publicizing DevCoin would no longer be necessary. But there still has to be some payment from the person commissioning the work. This is to get the editors role (so you can make changes before publishing, ask for a redraft etc) and to make it worth the writers time compared to writing something else and publishing that on DevCoin. ThinkI Plus we want people to buy DevCoin with their coin... |
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Two, you want a particular article for some other site or some other use, but do not mind if the author also places it on Devtome. Since any article placed on Devtome becomes free open source, this is really the same as number one above. You might be thinking well I need this article and yeah I do not care if they also put it on Devtome but really, if they do make such an article on devtome as in number one above you can then grab the article anyway, so this number two option is really just a different way of thinking about that same old number one option. You have to realise that everything on Devtome is up for grabs so maybe you don't need to commission an article for yourself, maybe you can commission one for Devtome and then, like any/every other Devtome article, grab it for your own use.
I like this one for user guides and similar. No-one cares about copyright, in fact copying is good, and DevCoin can do the hosting for the guide. If the whole open source community used DevCoin for user guides then publicizing DevCoin would no longer be necessary. But there still has to be some payment from the person commissioning the work. This is to get the editors role (so you can make changes before publishing, ask for a redraft etc) and to make it worth the writers time compared to writing something else and publishing that on DevCoin. ThinkI |
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I think adding material to devtome that has been requested is a pretty sweet idea.. not only would writers be
getting paid ALOT MORE because they are paid twice and shares wouldnt be as diluted initially but I wouldnt mind devtome at all then.. its what people want to read amd useful.. I would read on there then and im sure others would.. and we wouldnt have all the shares going to devtome opening up other project funding or bounties.
Good to hear that we can change your point of view Sidhujag. My account is now active and I can login so all appears well. I received an email about the activation by the way. We will need some redecorating of the site so that should be one of the first jobs listed. How to arrange a Bounty for this? I'm not sure what user material there is but I am guessing an edit is required as minimum. So that's the first writing job. We will need something to show in a press release. An example of what can be done with this new resource. Anyone got any preferences on subject matter. The press release goes to publishers who are potential buyers of content so it should be something that catches their imagination. For web developers the fact that all the upgrades were commissioned trough the service should be sufficient proof of the value of the service. We need a Bounty for DevCoin sponsored work. Not large but large enough to make it worth doing compared to some other writing that the author could be doing. We need to consider how to reduce the current writer payments to fund the Bounty and the impact of that. We need to ensure every writer signs up We need some guidelines for writers so we keep standards up to an acceptable level. We need a way of linking to an authors work in DevTone so potential buyers can see the standard they will get. That should help keep the standards up without too much enforcement work. Anyone doing a Cut and Paste for 'free' DevCoin will live to regret it. We also need to consider the effect of double payments one from the person commissioning the work and one from DevCoin. Since DevCoin is effectively subsidizing the content for another organization as long as its Open Source. Should DevCoin payments be lower for externally commissioned work? Any thoughts? ThinkI |
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Just signed up (using same name as here). Pending approval.
::: P.S. I see a new user with handle of "ThinkI" on the DVCbank already, might that be anyone here? Or is it someone trying to impersonate someone who is here? -MarkM- I only ever impersonate myself Ranlo, whats your area of interest? ThinkI |
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