@Lydian, du erwähnst den Lydian-Coin.
Es gibt mittlerweile viele Projekte von goldgedeckten Stablecoins, aber nicht alle sind ernstzunehmen.
https://kinesisgoldstablecoins.com/stablecoins/gold-backed-stablecoins/


Es ist nicht so, dass Kinesis-Währungen keine Investition in physischen Edelmetalle darstellen.
Es geht nur um die Art von Eigentumstitel.
a) Dein Eigentumstitel kann darin bestehen, dass du Goldmünzen einfach besitzt.
b) Er kann auf Papierform liegen.
c) Er kann in digitalen Form existieren.
Zum Beispiel, wenn du online Edelmetalle kaufst und sie lagern lässt, dann liegt dein Eigentumstitel, salopp gesagt, in deinem Rechner, in dem des Verkäufers und in dem des Verwahrers.

Unabhängig von der Art des Eigentumstitels geht es aber immer um physische EM.

d) Der Eigentumstitel kann schliesslich auf der Blockchain existieren, wie im Fall von Kinesis-Währungen.
Das bietet einiges an Vorteilen, wie du bestimmt besser als ich weißt, unter anderem Manipulationssicherheit.

Der Punkt ist, Goldbarren und Kinesis-Währungen sind keine zwei unterschiedliche Sachen in dem Sinne, als ob man sich fragen könnte, kaufst du lieber Goldbarren oder K-Währungen.
Diese Frage macht genau so wenig Sinn wie die Frage, kaufst du lieber den Stuhl oder den Eigentumstitel an dem Stuhl?

Die Wahl bei K-Währungen (aber auch bei anderen goldgedeckten Kryptos, wie zum Beispiel Digix) ist nicht zwischen Physischem und Krypto, sondern zwischen einer Art von Eigentumstitel und einer anderen.

Kinesis to launch revolutionary new bullion-backed monetary system in Indonesia
Expansion built on close partnership and collaboration with Indonesian Government, Regulators, and key organisations, including the creation of Indonesia’s first bullion vault

Although the country holds tremendous economic potential, particularly in relation to its young and burgeoning middle-class, two thirds of its 260 million citizens don’t have a bank account. On the other hand, gold is a major part of the nation’s savings culture, and is regarded as a legal investment under Sharia law (Indonesia has the largest Muslim population in the world).


What does the Indonesian launch entail?

In order to create the right conditions for launch and develop the necessary infrastructure to make the digital gold currency a success, Kinesis has worked in close collaboration with key stakeholders including the Indonesian government, and has partnered with a number of major national organisations for delivery:

Kinesis worked closely with the Indonesian government and financial regulator to foster the regulatory environment required to allow for the implementation of Kinesis’ monetary system, culminating in new rules regarding physical gold trading in February 2019.

The new rules state that any technology for online or exchange-based physical gold trading products must be deliverable and physically located within Indonesia. To this end, Kinesis has agreed, together with OZL (part of the Liechtenstein Precious Metals Group) and the state-owned post office PT POS Indonesia to build, develop and operate Indonesia’s first purpose-built bullion vault, according to international best-in-class standards.

Kinesis has partnered with Allocated Bullion Exchange (ABX) and the national commodities exchange – Jakarta Futures Exchange (JFX) to establish the spot Jakarta Sharia Gold (JSG) contracts to enable the physical trading, vaulting, vault management and logistics of Sharia Compliant physical bullion. PT Kliring Berjangka Indonesia (KBI), Indonesia’s state-owned commodity clearing house, will have oversight responsibilities; Kinesis as the Indonesia vault facility provider, when operational and ABX and PT POS as physical bullion agent and logistics provider.

In terms of distribution and enabling widespread usage, Kinesis has partnered with PT Bullion Ecosystem International (BEI), a leading Indonesian e-commerce and financial technology company which provides mobile applications for gold trading, collateral gold finance and Sharia gold financing. BEI’s technology will allow for delivery of white-labelled Kinesis products into the hands of millions.

Kinesis partner BEI has an exclusive agreement with Indonesia’s state-owned postal office company, PT POS to provide multiple gold and collateral financing mobile applications. With a reliable and comprehensive distribution system across Indonesia covering over 58,700 point-of-sale service points, PT POS, the world’s third largest postal service, offers a wide range of financial services and is Indonesia’s largest non-bank financial institution, serving an active customer base of 10 million and facilitating over US$10 billion in cross-border remittances alone annually. PT POS is going to integrate the Kinesis Monetary System, together with BEI, to permit Kinesis digital gold (KAU) as an accepted method for sending and receiving cross-border value for its customers, including migrant workers.

In order to further promote uptake, Kinesis has partnered with the Nobel-prize-nominated Muslim organisation Nahdlatul Ulamsa (NU), which has agreed to support Kinesis products as a Shariah-compliant option for its members. With over 100 million active members, NU will act as an investor base, facing millions of downstream users.


Gilarsi Setijono, President Director at PT POS Indonesia comments:

“Gold is a very important investment and savings asset class in Indonesia across all segments of society and the first and only purpose-built vault facility will give significant access and confidence to the market. This vault project together with Kinesis and OZL, as well as other government-related gold savings initiatives, will be of long-term benefit to Indonesia and Indonesian citizens.”

Stephanus Paulus Lumintang, President Director at Jakarta Futures Exchange, comments:

“JFX is committed to providing the best solutions and services in the futures and derivatives industry. It’s increasingly become clear to us that the benefits of distributed ledger technology, or ‘blockchain’ will unlock tremendous amounts of value for Indonesia and Indonesian people. Blockchain regulation in Indonesia is currently in progress, and it is quite an important, yet difficult task. However, JFX is ready to be a blockchain exchange company in Indonesia, in compliance with any legal and regulatory requirements. Our future partnership with Kinesis and ABX will enable us to not only tap into these advantages but to create a secure and transparent blockchain network that provides a credible alternative to existing systems of exchange.”

https://kinesisgoldstablecoins.com/kinesis-to-launch-revolutionary-new-bullion-backed-monetary-system-in-indonesia/

Kinesis to launch revolutionary new bullion-backed monetary system in Indonesia

Expansion built on close partnership and collaboration with Indonesian Government, Regulator, and key organisations, including the creation of Indonesia’s first bullion vault.

The need for such a currency is particularly acute in a country such as Indonesia. Although the country holds tremendous economic potential, particularly in relation to its young and burgeoning middle-class, two thirds of its 260 million citizens don’t have a bank account. On the other hand, gold is a major part of the nation’s savings culture, and is regarded as a legal investment under Sharia law (Indonesia has the largest Muslim population in the world). Kinesis’ monetary solution is well-tailored to these circumstances.

KINESIS ENGAGES CONTIS GROUP TO LAUNCH UK AND EUROPEAN DEBIT CARD FOR ITS DIGITAL GOLD AND SILVER CURRENCIES

Today, Kinesis Money announces the initiation of its UK and EU debit card program with Contis Group, the award-winning platform as a service (PAAS) that provides end-to-end banking and payments solutions. Kinesis has selected Contis for its European and UK debit card solutions and has officially started developments, scheduled for release in Q4 2019.

The release of these EUR and GBP-denominated debit cards will cement Kinesis’ position in the market as a formidable global fintech player. The Kinesis debit card will allow Kinesis’ clients in the UK and Europe to easily and efficiently use their Kinesis currencies to make purchases anywhere that has a merchant facility, as well as withdraw funds via global ATM networks.

The new debit card is to be powered through a partnership between Kinesis Money and Contis which enables customers to leverage their extensive partner network. Contis Financial Services Ltd is authorised by the Financial Conduct Authority.

The Kinesis debit card is set to be integrated into the highly anticipated Kinesis Monetary System, scheduled to launch in Q3 2019, providing seamless spending and management of the Kinesis, blockchain-based, gold and silver-based currencies.

3 Reasons Bitcoin Is Turning Into A Global Safe-Haven For Investors

1) Every fiat currency is devaluing itself on purpose

2) Bitcoin increasingly non-correlated with traditional markets

3) Bitcoin can provide asymmetric returns

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-08-08/3-reasons-bitcoin-turning-global-safe-haven-investors

... actually these reasons are valid for gold too.
That shows the similarity between gold and Btc as safe heaven investment

According to Reuters, French finance minister Bruno Le Maire told a news conference on July 18 that the G7 “cannot accept private companies issuing their own currencies without democratic control.”

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-07-18/libra-will-upset-world-economy-if-it-isnt-regulated-tightly-g7-warns



What kind of "democratic control" are central banks subject to?

 

Facebook's Fake 'Crypto' Is "A Fiat-Money Clone"


The critical question, however, is this: Is the Libra really good — or sound — money?

Unfortunately, this question cannot be answered in the affirmative. The reason is this: The quality of the Libra depends on the quality of the underlying fiat currencies — and fiat currencies do not make for good money, as should be well known by now.

Fiat currencies are inflationary; they enrich some at the expense of many others.

The issuance of fiat currencies causes distortions in the credit markets, which provokes speculative bubbles and triggers booms and busts, and last but not least, fiat currencies lead the economies into over-indebtedness.

Against this backdrop, it becomes evident that the Libra will suffer from all the economic and ethical deficiencies that come with its underlying fiat currencies. For instance, the Libra will be inflationary money to the extent that the US dollar, the euro, and all the other underlying fiat currencies are subject to inflationary measures by central banks, resulting in the Libra losing its purchasing power in step with the fiat currencies.

In extreme cases, if the official currencies were to go under, the Libra would follow suit. The Libra is, therefore, not a real alternative to official fiat currencies, but rather a more straightforward and more cost-efficient way to use them.

So anyone who thinks that the Libra might offer an escape from the bad fiat currencies is mistaken. The Libra is a fiat money clone; just like fiat currencies the Libra is fake money.

https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2019-07-19/facebooks-fake-crypto-fiat-money-clone

You are 100% right.
That's why, if we want to compare Bitcoin and Gold, it makes only sense if we compare Bitcoin with gold-backed cryptocoins

@ TH24EVER,
after having been postponed a couple of times, the launch of the Kinesis Monetary System is planned for 1st September.
I guess all team members are working for that and don't have time to come here.
The sale period of the Kinesis Velocity Tokens will end on 31 August.
As far as I know, ETH distribution will take place after that.

Maybe,
or maybe Central Banks decide to store the gold reserves of a country in the US and London because over there it is easier for them to manage those reserves for currencies manipulation purposes

Good question
This is something that struck me too: among the members of the Libra Association there are no megabanks.
JP Morgan, Goldman Sachs etc., they are all developing their own Stablecoins

Good thread opening

"- Libra coin will be a stable coin, price will not fluctuate providing users in 3rd world countries with a medium to store their wealth."
Libra's value will be stable just as long as the currencies' value backing it up will be stable.

Don't underestimate the monetary disruptive power of the Central Banks! 

Yes, because Libra has a weakness that those cryptos don't have: it is backed up by fiat money.
The value of Libra coins is the value of fiat money.
As soon as trust in the fiat currencies backing up Libra start decreasing, trust in Libra coins will start to decrease.

Bitcoin, and later all other cryptos, were born as an alternative to fiat money, that's why there is a negative correlation between cryptos and fiat money in terms of trust.
When you look at this negative correlation as a weighing scale, Libra lies on the fiat money plate.

Libra's weakness is the same weakness of what backs Libracoins up: Fiat currencies and Gov bonds.

"The European central banks have sniffed out the danger and have just decided, at France's initiative, to create a "taskforce" on stablecoins within the framework of the G7.

The concern is real, especially as their credibility is dangerously eroding these days: the Fed has just interrupted its rate hike, the ECB admits that it could continue its zero-rate policy, and the BoJ remains stuck in a massive EQ.

Economic players are beginning (at last!) to question the credibility of central banks (and moreover the price of gold is starting to rise...).

This type of competition has already occurred in history: in the Middle Ages, the Florentine Florin and the Ducat of Venice circulated throughout Europe. Their guaranteed gold content made them trusted currencies in relation to national currencies that were too often manipulated.

However, Libra does not play into this category and it is its weak point, which has not yet been sufficiently measured: the asset that will support it will be "the debt from stable governments with low default probability that are unlikely to experience high inflation" as stated in its White Paper. Precisely, in the event of a "2008 but worse" crisis, there may not be any... If the yen, the euro, the dollar collapse and experience a wave of inflation, the Libra will be swept away in the same turmoil, and savers will suffer severe losses."

https://www.goldbroker.com/news/facebook-libra-will-accelerate-the-loss-of-credibility-of-central-banks-1570

FACEBOOK LIBRA WILL ACCELERATE THE LOSS OF CREDIBILITY OF CENTRAL BANKS

in addition to competing with the traditional banking sector, Libra risks accelerating the loss of credibility of central banks. Because this time, it is not just about new payment services, but a new international currency in its own right.

Indeed, the Libra will be what is called a stablecoin, i.e. a stable cryptocurrency because it is based on a basket of several major international currencies (dollar, euro, pound sterling, undoubtedly yen and yuan). This stability is an essential difference with bitcoin, whose high price volatility discourages many users.

With nearly 3 billion members, Facebook (as well as its subsidiaries Whatsapp and Instagram) has a strike force that no company has ever before had in history. As a result, its cryptocurrency can compete with the world's sovereign currencies.

Emerging countries with an inflationary currency and exchange controls can legitimately see Libra as a direct competitor. Their population will have an interest in switching to the new currency to free themselves from the inflation that is eating away at their savings. Central banks in emerging countries must be seriously concerned and it is to be expected that many of them will simply want to ban it.

https://www.goldbroker.com/news/facebook-libra-will-accelerate-the-loss-of-credibility-of-central-banks-1570

That's not the point Gaulois.
The question was, will Govs block Libra or not.
You say yes, I say no, and explained why


As per Whitepaper, Libracoins will be backed by the major currencies and by gov bonds of countries "known for their financial stability".
Let's say, 1 Libracoin = 1$
It works like this:

Gaulois buys 1LC for $1 --> Libra's management buys $1 of currencies and Gov bonds --> 1 LC get issued to Gaulois.
Will Libra's management buy 0,5 $ and 0,5 Treasuries?
0,3 €, 0,3 $, 0,3 German bonds, and 0,1 Treasuries?
0,2 Yen, 0,2 Japanese bonds, 0,4 French bonds, 0,2 Euros?
Libra's management will decide.

Point is, with your $1 they will buy a basket composed of currencies and Gov bonds.
With a portion of your $1 they will finance some Govs.

The countries debt doesn't get reduced, it get financed.

It wasn't done a decade ago because a project like Libra didn't exist a decade ago.


Most EU countries are hunting FB because they don't get any money out of it.
Up until now, FB taxes --> USA.

Did you think EU Govs care about the rights of their citizens?


Yes, as long as they will get assured that Libra will finance them in a substantial way.

Well, not all countries are free to choose the storage location.
For example, Italy isn't, as Central Banks are so powerful that they decide about it, and not only about it but in general about how to manage the gold reserves of a country.
That's the reason of the Italian Gov's motion

Libracoins will be backed by currencies and Gov bonds.
Libra will take users money and buy currencies and Gov bonds, in order to back up Libracoins.
Through Libra people (without knowing it) will finance Govs.
And you think that Govs are going to stop Libra?
Do you take always so seriously what politicians say? 

Usually I don't care about hearsays, but in this case I'm almost ready to believe it, as it would make sense (if the computers were easy to get moved and not of the cheap kind  )

Tradition

When Sen. Ron Paul asked B. Bernanke "Is gold money?", Bernanke answered no.
"Then why central banks keep gold reserves?"
... "Tradition!"

Pinocchio Bernanke...


Gold reserves storage too doesn't need to be outsourced...