I'm quite surprised about the lack of discussion around this sale. This is great news for owners and the highest premium I've seen one of these coins fetch in years (in BTC terms at least)
I'll be keeping a close eye on 4K going forward
Congrats on the sale Eodguy
That’s because we haven’t seen proof the sale was 100% legitimate and those who have been around longer with a bit more knowledge know that price if legitimate was a fluke (like what happens on eBay once in a while), which happens ( I've never seen a premium this high however ), but should not remotely be expected going forward. The coin prices listed on 4k aren’t going to drive this hobby anywhere as they likely aren’t going to sell.
4k kind of reminds me of Elias (Encyclopedia author) and his team at “CryptoVice”. Not as knowledgeable as the community here (speaking of their sales service, not encyclopedia,), and actively trying to steer sales away for their own profit that’s not really going to help the hobby grow.. like Scare City has done. The website is not well established. Unless I’m missing something I don’t see 4ks fees, insurance protection proof, terms of service etc. All red flags.
NFTs are a cute idea but in theory are just that. The only true safety would come in the form of a legally drawn up agreement that could hold up in a court of law.
It’s great that we can see the team members, but that’s not really anything that’s going to make me sleep better using this service. You state in your video AnonymousMiner is an anonymous escrow. Many collectors here have met him or know his name, and he’s helped facilitate sales, but he’s not a technical forum escrow service. OGNasty. MinerJones, Krogo, HHampuz who are, have been trusted with millions of dollars worth of collectibles for years, which is a proven track record (much of which viewable via the blockchain ). OGNasty and MinerJones were BitcoinTalk treasurers for several years who were entrusted with millions of dollars in btc by Theymos (of course who Satoshi left the site to). I’d say that’s a pretty impressive track record that is easily proven.
Site misinformation claiming Casascius/Mike Caldwell created the physical bitcoin concept is false. Gavin Andresen, Satoshis former lead dev did. BitBills were first to create one, in card form, and Mike followed suit shortly after. Also stating that bitcoin maxi’s see owning a Casascius coin as a must to be a who’s who is completely false. Most of the bitcoin maximalists HATE physical bitcoins (not your keys, not your coins). So those two false statements feel like misinformation used for artificial hype/sales tactics.
I just came across your video today and realized I had forgotten this thread was made. Truth is I’m stating here what was briefly echoed to me by long time collectors in “passing”. I just never looked in to the site.
Some of my concerns can hopefully be addressed, as sites like this are helpful in expanding the hobby, but this site in current form truthfully just really isn’t. These concerns are partially why business is going to Scarce and not 4k and will continue to until things are addressed /changed. -My 2 Satoshis
Note: your future staking proposal brings up a whole other set of questions/concerns but I’ll save that for another day.
4K video -
https://youtu.be/2Q3PjFTf7eoRealized I must have missed this and wanted to respond to it since it's definitely valid. In regard to it being a fluke, hard to say. I've had three coins sell there so far, WBTC is in my wallet, can't speak for the buyers experience or motivation.
Re insurance:
https://4k.com/insuranceFor terms of service not sure, there's an FAQ and some docs to sign that were sent over to me when I deposited my coins. Since it was such a large deal I signed a contract directly with 4K but not sure what the process is like if you do smaller valued item(s).
Fees, I don't think they are currently charging fees as they are venture backed and looking to scale up the platform.
Re coin prices I listed them for not "going to drive this hobby anywhere as they likely aren’t going to sell," I guess my only response is that coins selling on this forum for under peel value because there's less than a handful of interested buyers and they're all looking to scoop up coins at or below peel value is pretty disheartening from my hobbyist perspective. A few of mine have sold at the listed price, and that gives me hope that some kind of reasonable premium can come back to these collectibles.
It's great that you personally know a lot of these individuals on the forum, and their credibility speaks for itself given their history and background but it's hard to pitch that outside of this community. I've personally arranged for Casascius sales with many of the members you stated and never once had concerns, but it took a massive amount of convincing for both counterparties to trust them. Hope you can see how the current forum process of buying and selling isn't ideal to someone who hasn't grown up on the forum.
I hear you about not stating the concept for physical crypto came from Gavin, definitely my mistake. Also yes, there is certainly disagreement within the BTC community about wanting to own one (although most of the BTC whales I know own quite a few).
Appreciate the detailed feedback, hopefully the options for this hobby continue to improve!
