Bitstamp – a fraud or run by a bunch of pubescent teenagers? Be aware!!

[pro-trader]

Hello,

I´m a Newbie and by accident I posted my story in the wrong thread first, so obviously I cannot reply or open up a new subject somewhere else.  But I thought I should share my recent experience with this “company” so I write it here.

Before I start sharing my experience, some words about myself:
I make my living on investment and trading (mostly on Forex and stock market) since many years, and in general when I trade I do handle amounts with 5 digit sizes upwards. I bought my first Bitcoins (Ha –I was really lucky, yes in deed) a few years ago and am a fan of it since then – despite I never really traded them like I trade stocks or currencies.

OK – now, a few months ago, I opened up an account at Bitstamp as Mt.Gox is way too slow in handling cash payments and the German Bitcoin.de has much too little volume for my taste. I got a verified account  (whatever this means with Bitstamp), after providing them with a set of documents about myself.

After some time I gave it a test, sent some of my BTC from my wallet to my Bitstamp account and sold it (amount approx 20.000 USD or so). Sent the cash I got to my bank account. Well – it worked!

So after some time I decided to do it vice-versa and buy a bit more Bitcoins – and sent 60.000 USD (from the same bank I had transferred the 20k USD before) to Bitstamp´s bank, in order to fund my account there.
And then – a strange story started and my 60.000 USD are - gone? frozen? Only Bitstamp knows!

Bitstamp contacted me that they have a problem with the money I just sent, they had to freeze it because my amount is so big and they first must start their KYC (know your customer) procedure.
I fully understand AML and KYC procedures, its getting really a complicated thing and I have to deal with it all the time I open up a new account. But its never a real problem. I am fully aware of the requirements and capable to proof everything is legal etc.

Not so, however, with Bitstamp.

These guys really insist to know all(!!) my bank accounts  - and believe me, as a professional trader I have quite a few. They want to see any(!!!) financial documentation from me etc etc. before they will decide to un-freeze my money or not. And keep in mind that I sent my 60.000 USD AFTER Bitstamp confirmed me, that my account is now fully verified.

I refused to send them all this far-going information, but sent them an explanation and 2 letters from that bank where I sent my money from. I work with that bank since 15 years which the bank confirmed as well, its one of the leading and most reputable banks in Europe. However this confirmation was from last year – and these teenager @ Bitstamp replied, that they cannot un-freeze my money yet because they need a brand-new "Certificate of Good Standing" from myself (hey - I´m a private person, not a company!), they need also this and that etc.

I recalled the payment (which costs me a few hundred USD in fees) – but the Slovenian bank refuses to send me back my money because Bitstamp has blocked it. My money is not visable/credited to my account at Bitstamp either.

So – be aware! Maybe, with some luck, Bitstamp is not a fraud and just unprofessional (could be that an unexperienced person got a panic attac after seeing 60.000 USD and over-reacted?? I just hope so!). But maybe not? The story is lasting quite some time now.  I´ll wait a few more days, then I´ll likley have to give it to my lawyer. Will keep you updated here!

[Nightwatchman]

The protestations of those who favour loose or zero regulation of BTC will always be drowned out by the gravity of stories like yours.

Good luck recovering your money.

[levis_31]

60K USD would make me very nervous with the wait. I heard similar stories in BTC-e. When you deposit larger amounts of money, they usually lock it. It happened to few guys in BTC-e but they eventually released it on further verification/ documentation (BTC-e has decent support). Good luck.

[jonanon]

I've a had similar issues with Bitstamp - luckily mine came during verification stage. What this 'company' does not seem to understand is that in the country I live it is impossible to get a proof of address document. Electric and water bills are not sent in a persons name and banks don't send statements as they do in many countries - I have an address on my drivers license but no, not acceptable - avoid them like the plague!!!!!!

[sundsta]

I have never had a negative experience with Bitstamp myself.

[pro-trader]

I've a had similar issues with Bitstamp - luckily mine came during verification stage. What this 'company' does not seem to understand is that in the country I live it is impossible to get a proof of address document. Electric and water bills are not sent in a persons name and banks don't send statements as they do in many countries - I have an address on my drivers license but no, not acceptable - avoid them like the plague!!!!!!

Well - I sent all that to Bitstamp and Bitstamp confirmed me that my account is fully verified. Only after this confirmation I started to "deal" with Bitstamp. And after Bitstamp confiscated my 60.000 USD, they received 2 reference letters from my bank, one of it as a notarized & apostilled copy. And their reply was that this reference letter was from last year, they cannot un-freeze my money, they need a brand new "certificate of good standing".....

I wonder why there are quite a few good experiences to be read about Bitstamp, but none of those obviously is dealing with a bit larger amounts. More and more I have the feeling that Bitstamp is a fraud, they just don´t cheat on small amounts in order not to attract too much attention, and rip users off as long as they can on larger volumes. As I wrote, I will wait until mid of next week, then I´ll take legal actions.

[Holdaaja]

Look like there is no place for trade

[Lethn]

I managed to get myself verified on Bitstamp literally just a couple of days ago, the only thing they got me for was the documents not being in full view but after that they happily let me in. I noticed you said Slovenian bank, unfortunately I don't think this is necessarily Bitstamps fault because due to regulations with financial groups and companies like theirs they're going to immediately discriminate against people from countries like that. Yes it's a shitty situation but bear in mind that when you go to these exchanges they're still linked to paper and unfortunately, the moment a company links themselves to paper that's when they're subject to all kinds of bullshit and they have no choice but to comply or get shut down.

There are two possible things you can do to get round this:

. Mine coins, it doesn't necessarily have to be Bitcoin because it's extremely easy to sell cryptographic currencies, just not paper cash, it will take a long time to get Bitcoin if you mine it directly anyway but it's a fairly safe if slow way of getting cryptocurrencies and guaranteed

. Another faster but slightly riskier way, buy Gold/Silver on the open market from a dealer you know, this will mean you'll likely need an escrow and such but you'll get your Bitcoins right away because people are usually more than happy to take precious metals off your hands for Bitcoin and you'll get it right away without any exchange bullshit, as far as I'm aware, there are no current laws governing what I suppose they'd call 'barter' of Bitcoins for goods so it should be an easier path than going to an exchange

[analytics]

I have a similar situation with a very large sum (60K).  I am in the US and already verified at Bitstamp.  Each day of delay is costing me money.

This is a link to the post from pro-trader on a Bitstamp thread, I replied there.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=38711.1100

(fixed link)

[pro-trader]

As I started here in the Newbie thread I should also give an update here. So everybody is informed who might not be aware of the other thread.

Copy-Paste from:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=38711.msg4541617#msg4541617

Update: Money released from Bitstamp!

It is not yet on my account as of today, but I have access to the SWIFT system and can already see it, its at the intermediary bank now and should arrive during the next overnight batch at the very latest.

All in the fees to send & recall my 60.000 USD has been 127,83 USD + 69,02 Euro (Those fees are charged by the involved banks & intermediary banks to handle a non-SEPA payment recall, not by Bitstamp, just to make it clear).

A cheap price for education, I do really not complain as I learned a hell of a lot: I hold Bitcoins since about 3years, and so far had very rarely touched my wallet. Now due to this experience and insight-look on who and how is handling exchanges etc., I have received an interesting look to review my opinion on the short- and medium-term outlook of BTC.

Just a bit of a funky sidenote here:
Yesterday I sent about double the amount to Unicredit Ljubljana (same bank Bitstamp uses) to a new Slovenian broker which I will use to buy some shares on the stock market there and in Macedonia. Went very smoothly but we finished KYC before, and the required docs where all reasonable, do-able and according to the usual industry-standard. So 2 payments actually crossed between the same 2 banks – no problem with any EU authority or bank. Just a sidenote.

Good luck to everybody here, a great forum and thanks to hazek for looking into the subject!

[Lethn]

That's great to hear! I found it odd because people always seem to like Bitstamp, it must be just because you were handling such a large amount it took awhile to get through, the exchanges and governments out there are definitely paranoid about a large amount of money ( from their view ) coming into a bank account out of nowhere.