Fake Shill Bidding in Collectables

[futureone]

Theymos are you aware of current fake shill Bidding taking place in the Collectables section of bitcointalk?
After a long read through each auction, it is clear the same users are inflating and rigging each bid so new users fall victim to the final high bid.
Its apparent that the same users are pushing the price up in each auction.
Why is there no oversight into what is currently taking place?
We also believe users are running numerous anonymous accounts to inflat the bids.
Is theymos aware of this? Are you apart of this and why is nothing being done to stop users inflating the bids to their advantage?


Shill bidding is when someone bids on an item to artificially increase its price, desirability, or search standing.

Shill bidding can happen regardless of whether the bidder knows the seller. However, when someone bidding on an item knows the seller, they might have information about the seller's item that other shoppers aren't aware of. This could create an unfair advantage, or cause another bidder to pay more than they should.

[TryNinja]

Maybe you could post some examples/evidences?

Preferably on the Reputation board.

[suchmoon]

Rambotnic, your account is bright red already, you can't possibly claim that you needed a newbie sockpuppet to avoid retribution or something.

And yeah, move this shit to Reputation and provide facts.

Also - ban evasion is frowned upon. I hope you're not doing that.

Also plagiarism: https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/selling-practices-policy/shill-bidding-policy?id=4353

[mikeywith]

or cause another bidder to pay more than they should.

how accurate is that statement ?

We also believe users are running numerous anonymous accounts

indeed.


not saying whatever you said is wrong or right, but i hope you know that theymos probably has no time for that shit, mods don't even moderate scams, let alone the bidding thing.

The "other shoppers" should use some brain to figure out the approximate price they should offer for an item, but if in case of any obvious unethical behavior done by a certain member/s then you should move that to reputation, tho i am not sure how  DT members deal with such cases.

[TECSHARE]

Just an FYI shill bidding is a crime in most places, often a felony in the US.

[TMAN]

Rambotnic, your account is bright red already, you can't possibly claim that you needed a newbie sockpuppet to avoid retribution or something.

And yeah, move this shit to Reputation and provide facts.

Also - ban evasion is frowned upon. I hope you're not doing that.

Also plagiarism: https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/selling-practices-policy/shill-bidding-policy?id=4353

He will implode soon.

[TheNewAnon135246]

Theymos are you aware of current fake shill Bidding taking place in the Collectables section of bitcointalk?
After a long read through each auction, it is clear the same users are inflating and rigging each bid so new users fall victim to the final high bid.
Its apparent that the same users are pushing the price up in each auction.
Why is there no oversight into what is currently taking place?
We also believe users are running numerous anonymous accounts to inflat the bids.
Is theymos aware of this? Are you apart of this and why is nothing being done to stop users inflating the bids to their advantage?


Shill bidding is when someone bids on an item to artificially increase its price, desirability, or search standing.

Shill bidding can happen regardless of whether the bidder knows the seller. However, when someone bidding on an item knows the seller, they might have information about the seller's item that other shoppers aren't aware of. This could create an unfair advantage, or cause another bidder to pay more than they should.

Your post is filled with assumptions and baseless allegations. Please show examples, backed up with evidence.

That aside, shill bidding is highly frowned upon and will definitely result in negative feedback. Crypto Imperator is a perfect example.

[Quickseller]

I cannot speak to "shill bidding" but there at least was rampant backing out of auctions in mid 2017 that continued even after calling out the person for doing this, and after he said he would stop.

Some of the "regulars" in collectables who trade frequently seem to think they can do whatever they want, and frequently, they do whatever they want, even when this means harming others.

Due to the anonymous nature of these forums, I would suspect it would be very difficult to prove this, but (in part considering the above) I would not be surprised to see evidence shill bidding is occurring. 

I would not expect theymos to take any kind of action on this subject. Although I do believe there should be some mechanism to prevent auction threads in collectables from being edited (to prevent the hiding/covering up of this practice), and posts deleted as is the case for the auctions sub (even though using the auctions sub for auctions is technically optional) -- perhaps a solution would be to optionally designate a thread as "editable" or non-editable" so people can choose for themselves to demand a "non-editable" thread for an auction if that is what they want.

[TMAN]

~snip~

come on QS.. why not let sleeping dogs lie? I see 0 benefit to the forum with these continued attacks against MJ.. most people are leaving you be now, why cant you do the same? sure Lauda is Lauda and will continue to be a prick to anyone they deem fit.. but the rest of collectibles seem to be leaving you alone. me included, this place is fucked up enough with Cryptocunt and all the alts spinning up from them and Thule.. how about burying the hatchet and taking up golf as a hobby instead?

the thing is your non attacking posts are becoming more insightful as you age and I am actually enjoying reading many of those, think I even merited you for the 1st time recently as well.

[FFrankie]

~snip~

come on QS.. why not let sleeping dogs lie? I see 0 benefit to the forum with these continued attacks against MJ.. most people are leaving you be now, why cant you do the same? sure Lauda is Lauda and will continue to be a prick to anyone they deem fit.. but the rest of collectibles seem to be leaving you alone. me included, this place is fucked up enough with Cryptocunt and all the alts spinning up from them and Thule.. how about burying the hatchet and taking up golf as a hobby instead?

the thing is your non attacking posts are becoming more insightful as you age and I am actually enjoying reading many of those, think I even merited you for the 1st time recently as well.

And that's because MJ is such a nice guy and does auctions for items on behalf of other people and than those people back out or change the terms which forced MJ to change his auction terms for auctioning items for other people.

[Quickseller]

~snip~

come on QS.. why not let sleeping dogs lie? I see 0 benefit to the forum with these continued attacks against MJ.. most people are leaving you be now, why cant you do the same? sure Lauda is Lauda and will continue to be a prick to anyone they deem fit.. but the rest of collectibles seem to be leaving you alone. me included, this place is fucked up enough with Cryptocunt and all the alts spinning up from them and Thule.. how about burying the hatchet and taking up golf as a hobby instead?

the thing is your non attacking posts are becoming more insightful as you age and I am actually enjoying reading many of those, think I even merited you for the 1st time recently as well.

I am just calling things out as I see them. I don't "attack" anyone because of personal issues, I speak out because it is my firm belief someone is doing something I think they shouldn't.

What I wrote in my post is not my only concerns about MJ, far from it.

MJ is currently reflected as having the highest trust score on the forum despite doing the above, even though the above is very similar to what others have done (anduck) who have multiple negative ratings. I didn't support anduck either, and I told him multiple times he should have made the winning bidder of his auction whole, or otherwise compensated him.

[TheNewAnon135246]

~snip~

come on QS.. why not let sleeping dogs lie? I see 0 benefit to the forum with these continued attacks against MJ.. most people are leaving you be now, why cant you do the same? sure Lauda is Lauda and will continue to be a prick to anyone they deem fit.. but the rest of collectibles seem to be leaving you alone. me included, this place is fucked up enough with Cryptocunt and all the alts spinning up from them and Thule.. how about burying the hatchet and taking up golf as a hobby instead?

the thing is your non attacking posts are becoming more insightful as you age and I am actually enjoying reading many of those, think I even merited you for the 1st time recently as well.

I am just calling things out as I see them. I don't "attack" anyone because of personal issues, I speak out because it is my firm belief someone is doing something I think they shouldn't.

What I wrote in my post is not my only concerns about MJ, far from it.

MJ is currently reflected as having the highest trust score on the forum despite doing the above, even though the above is very similar to what others have done (anduck) who have multiple negative ratings. I didn't support anduck either, and I told him multiple times he should have made the winning bidder of his auction whole, or otherwise compensated him.

As many have stated before, MJ hosted those auctions on behalf of other people. There is a huge difference between  cancelling an auction because you do not like the winning bid/change your mind and being forced to end it because the item owner changes his mind. Might not have been a good idea to host those auctions but that doesn't make MJ less trustworthy. Yet you keep bringing it up for unknown reasons.

[El duderino_]

I recently have had some buyings in collectibles as with RAFFLES, like those a lot, can't be more fair as those.

I have been bidding in some collectible threads "always with my only account" and sometimes bid on many things, but if its the highest then I also buy it, so nothing is wrong, and the fact is when I want something I just set my personal price and don't cross it, so when someone would push the price, then it could lead to being stuck with it as well and not selling @all....

Its always a possibility that prices are being pushed with someones ALTaccount, but for my personal feeling and what I have seen, I have a good feeling @the collectibles section and with the collectibles members, I do think as well they are trying to make an honest section so the trading can always continue and are not to be shut down cause of penny scams that will not benefit anyone in the longterm.

Bid responsible or don't bid @all....

 

[ChiBitCTy]

Some of the "regulars" in collectables who trade frequently seem to think they can do whatever they want, and frequently, they do whatever they want, even when this means harming others.

Quickseller, you're a moron. First off, look at your trust score..how can anyone take you seriously? Sure, I am always going to be known as the guy who plagiarized a couple posts one single day (not tons of posts like you incorrectly stated once), which didn't even benefit me what so ever. But, at least I'm a somewhat respected member here, unlike yourself.

I know the collectibles sub way better than you do, and you're wrong. First, I know the first and last name to MANY of the people there. So no, we don't all stay anonymous. Secondly, regulars don't just think they can do whatever they want. There are many members (like TeeGumes for ex.) who will call anyone out for any sort of shenanigans.

I take this stuff seriously, and there is ONE person that I believe is shill bidding often atm..and I can't prove that. So I simply don't bid on their items. So how does yourself or OP know this to be certain?  I can't speak for OP, but I know you just like to hear (or see) yourself talk. Even if it's babbling nonsense.

Edit: Also, and more so for OP, you need to realize how collectible markets work for any kind of collectible. We will often bid in auctions having no intention of actually wining the item. That is because we are more than willing to buy the items at the low price, but knowing that we are highly unlikely to have the winning bid because the items "market" tends to be set around a certain price range. This is the same on ebay, auction houses, or whatever for many types of collectibles whether it be baseball cards or artwork. This doesn't mean we are trying to inflate the price so newbies have to pay more, it's simply getting the auction off and going (often at least getting the price up to it's original cost) if we happen to win, while not expecting to...it's a bonus! I won a lot the other day I had no faith in winning but was pleasantly surprised! There is nothing wrong w/any of this. Maybe this is not what you meant by your post, but sure seems like it.

[hilariousetc]

The forum doesn't moderate scams so I don't think this is something the forum administration would get involved with, but there's also probably nothing anyone can do to prevent this. This sort of behaviour will happen in any scenario of auction whether it be on eBay or Sotherbys (or any other auction house). I would suggest those who partake in shill bidding instead just not bother with auctions and sell the item for the price they actually want rather than waste everybodies time in a scummy fashion.

[The Sceptical Chymist]

Rambotnic, your account is bright red already, you can't possibly claim that you needed a newbie sockpuppet to avoid retribution or something.

Wait, what?  Are you saying OP is an alt of Rambotnic?  And did Rambotnic actually get banned?  I don't recall hearing about that, but I'd be very pleased if it's true.

As far as the shilling goes, OP really needs to provide concrete examples of what he thinks is wrongdoing.  I tend to just browse the collectibles auctions and see the same members bidding for things, but I've always assumed that's because they're the ones who are interested in what's up for sale.  It is a relatively small but tight-knit community in that section, so it's not surprising to me that the same bidders show up time and time again.

And as hilariousandco said, Theymos isn't likely to get involved in any of this even if OP gave actual evidence of shill bidding. 

[suchmoon]

Rambotnic, your account is bright red already, you can't possibly claim that you needed a newbie sockpuppet to avoid retribution or something.

Wait, what?  Are you saying OP is an alt of Rambotnic?  And did Rambotnic actually get banned?  I don't recall hearing about that, but I'd be very pleased if it's true.

Likely. Possibly.

Definitely alt of someone. Style matches Rambotnic. He got a lot of posts deleted by mods about a month ago and disappeared afterwards.

[wheelz1200]

I've been over in the collectable for some years now and most of that gets sniffed out and users appropriately tagged.  There are some people like kialara that has a big outside of the forum presence and following so when they host auctions you will see some newbies come in hard.  But for the most part auctions generally go for less than most [wts] threads.  Auctions on this forum are some of the cheapest ways to collect these physicals.  They are much more expensive on other outlets as well.  Do some get crazy action, yeah but those are mostly on highly sought after high priced collectables.  You can go over there right now and see some really cheap buys. 

[FFrankie]

I've been over in the collectable for some years now and most of that gets sniffed out and users appropriately tagged.  There are some people like kialara that has a big outside of the forum presence and following so when they host auctions you will see some newbies come in hard.  But for the most part auctions generally go for less than most [wts] threads.  Auctions on this forum are some of the cheapest ways to collect these physicals.  They are much more expensive on other outlets as well.  Do some get crazy action, yeah but those are mostly on highly sought after high priced collectables.  You can go over there right now and see some really cheap buys. 

Like the bitcoinpenny gold 2019 that went for a steal at 0.08 btc, it was originally listed at 0.10 btc and sold out in presale if memory serves me correct. Or within the first week either way it sold it reaaaallly fast.


I was gonna place a bid but after I saw who bid, I realized I didn't have a chance to win so no bid for me.