Any critics about my portfolio?

[SebastianJu]

Maybe you'd like to look into assets that are neither of the two, like: SILVER, CIUCIU.BOND or BDT.

I checked them out but they only bring 13%, 16% and 40% of the ROI that the best BTCST brings i bought. The last one is a good chunk better than the other 2 and brings back initial investment after 7,29months. Thats better than pyramining at least. But glbse has better miner than that. Not to speak of btcst ones.

But they are not exposed to BTCST default and resistant to the mining difficulty growth.

Right. But it depends on other values outside of bitcoin that doesnt grow too much. In fact... i think that investing bitcoins in silver should at the end lead to a lower value because bitcoin value grows faster than silver value. Or am i wrong here?

Also, from the mining bonds, I can recommend MOORE, which should keep up the value while the other mining bonds are falling.

Moore has break even after 26 months only.

But after 26 weeks it gives you much better chance of selling them at the price you paid.

Ok, i dont know that. But while speaking about this... to get a real impression of the profatibility of an asset one should need to check the dividends over a timeframe and not only the actual ask-price but the ask-price at start of the timeframe together with ask-price at end of the timeframe. That would lead to a more real view. I think i will keep this in mind in future trades.

I checked out the 2 sites you mentioned and it looks like they pay 6.91% per week. At glbse you have projects with up to 7,84%. So i think when risking it to invest in btcst i would prefer the glbse ones.

Well, if you have projects at GLBSE with up to 7,84% then I'm happy for you

You dont believe me? When they pay more than btcst then this means i could buy the share under the real price. Which leads to a higher return of investment because the investment was lower. But if youre interested... i already shared my portfolio... You can proof if you wish.

My general advise: start with small amounts, see how the prices change, observe the liquidity, and after 3 months or so you will get to the same conclusions as I have.

Maybe. I saw that minerbonds are constantly losing value. So like i said above, i should calculate another way.

[SebastianJu]

BTCST is without fiat but on the other hand it maybe holds a greater risk.

BTCST is without doubt huge risk, but equally interesting is how this risk could affect the risk of other assets.
In addition to BTCST continuing for eternity, there are 2 possible outcomes:
1) Pirate defaults partially or completely.
Will this lead to a market crash as investors lose confidence in Bitcoin or the BTC securities market, or will it have little or no effect on other assets?

I think btcst is too small that it could create a bitcoin crash. And when it leads to mining bonds getting cheaper... good for me... ill buy more of them for cheap... Even when bitcoin is crashing again i could buy bitcoins cheap, buy shares cheap and i strongly believe that bitcoin is raising easily after that again.

2) Pirate does an orderly shut-down and returns alle funds to investors.
Will this lead to a asset price boom as a huge amount of capital suddenly made idle starts to chase after the other avaible assets? Or will the previous BTCST investors be content with their earnings and withdraw their BTC from GLBSE?

I doubt the shutdown will go on this way, but maybe. And i think the other assets will be bought more which means higher share-prices.

Of course it's impossible to predict what will happen, and I'm aware that I laid things out quite black and white here.
My point is that even though one is not invested in Pirate's, this does not mean that one is insulated from risk associated with the BTCST, as what happens with BTCST could very well affect the rest of the securities market, at least short-term.

Yes, i think one way or another it will have an effect. But i think on the other hand that one way or the other one could turn it to a plus. At least when owning mining shares already and have the possibility to buy more. If, then it would change the price for miningbonds and maybe the price of bitcoins but not the dividends. So when the dividends are constant and bitcoins raise in value nothing was lost. Or did i miss something?

[piotr_n]

Right. But it depends on other values outside of bitcoin that doesnt grow too much. In fact... i think that investing bitcoins in silver should at the end lead to a lower value because bitcoin value grows faster than silver value. Or am i wrong here?

It gives me 0.9%/week and I don't really care if the asset is called SILVER or WHATEVER.
Pirate also doesn't say how he actually makes the 7%/week.

Ok, i dont know that. But while speaking about this... to get a real impression of the profatibility of an asset one should need to check the dividends over a timeframe and not only the actual ask-price but the ask-price at start of the timeframe together with ask-price at end of the timeframe. That would lead to a more real view. I think i will keep this in mind in future trades.

Unfortunately the biggest disadvantage of the common mining bonds (with fixed Mh/bond) is that you usually pay significantly more while buying them, then you get when selling them back a month later. So keep that in mind, because they can really loose i.e. 20% of the market value in 2 weeks - and I saw it happening.

You dont believe me? When they pay more than btcst then this means i could buy the share under the real price. Which leads to a higher return of investment because the investment was lower. But if youre interested... i already shared my portfolio... You can proof if you wish.

I'm just answering your questions - I don't need you to prove me anything.

There is no BS&T pass throgh that can give you more than 7% because BS&T does not give more than 7%.
If you did manage to buy underpriced PPT bonds - this should also give you a hint that one day you may have problems of selling them back at the price you are expecting now.

[SebastianJu]

Right. But it depends on other values outside of bitcoin that doesnt grow too much. In fact... i think that investing bitcoins in silver should at the end lead to a lower value because bitcoin value grows faster than silver value. Or am i wrong here?

It gives me 0.9%/week and I don't really care if the asset is called SILVER or WHATEVER

I think its a hint whats done and if it sounds like the owner knows what he does. But at the end, your right, it all depends on the risk and the real performance over all.

Ok, i dont know that. But while speaking about this... to get a real impression of the profatibility of an asset one should need to check the dividends over a timeframe and not only the actual ask-price but the ask-price at start of the timeframe together with ask-price at end of the timeframe. That would lead to a more real view. I think i will keep this in mind in future trades.

Unfortunately the biggest disadvantage of the common mining bonds (with fixed Mh/bond) is that you usually pay significantly more while buying them, then you get when selling them back a month later. So keep that in mind, because they can really loose i.e. 20% of the market value in 2 weeks - and I saw it happening.

Hm. That could be bad. Ill have to think about this tomorrow if there is a protection against this.

You dont believe me? When they pay more than btcst then this means i could buy the share under the real price. Which leads to a higher return of investment because the investment was lower. But if youre interested... i already shared my portfolio... You can proof if you wish.

I'm just answering your questions - I don't need you to prove me anything.

There is no BS&T pass throgh that can give you more than 7% because BS&T does not give more than 7%.
If you did manage to buy underpriced PPT bonds - this should also give you a hint that one day you may have problems of selling them back at the price you are expecting now.

Possible. But on the other hand... as long as the bond pays out it wouldnt be justified to have an underpriced bond.
But then... it could mean that customers lost trust in btcst in total. But i doubt this because there are less performing btcst-bonds that are overprized too.

I hope to get out of them anyway before something is crashing...

[piotr_n]

I hope to get out of them anyway before something is crashing...

That was exactly what I meant while referring you to non GLBSE bonds based PPT services.

Investing in BS&T is only about:
1) depositing your money into pirate's wallet
2) earning weekly interest
3) being able to withdraw the exact deposited amount, at any time you like

And these GLBSE bonds - they don't give you the last part.
I mean, be PPT bond issuers usually provide you with some kind of buy-back procedure, but only the fact that you were able to buy underpriced bonds should give you an idea of how reliable/profitable/convenient these procedures actually are.

[Bitcoin Oz]

When the block reward halves mining shares will lose half their dividends and mining bonds will always lose value with bitcoin difficulty rising. The best mining related stock to me is MOORE.

Theres probably at most 6 months left of pirate investment before he closes down or significantly reduces returns.

[GeoRW]

BTCST is without fiat but on the other hand it maybe holds a greater risk.

BTCST is without doubt huge risk, but equally interesting is how this risk could affect the risk of other assets.
In addition to BTCST continuing for eternity, there are 2 possible outcomes:
1) Pirate defaults partially or completely.
Will this lead to a market crash as investors lose confidence in Bitcoin or the BTC securities market, or will it have little or no effect on other assets?

I think btcst is too small that it could create a bitcoin crash. And when it leads to mining bonds getting cheaper... good for me... ill buy more of them for cheap... Even when bitcoin is crashing again i could buy bitcoins cheap, buy shares cheap and i strongly believe that bitcoin is raising easily after that again.

Number of bitcoins Pirate is operating with is huge in comparison to market depth at the biggest BTC exchange. Bitcoin could easily drop to 5 USD or lower. Pirate does not even have to default for that to happen, just closing down his operation could trigger large panic sells  I personally think that  for this last bitcoin price bubble is Pirate largely responsible. He's selling and buying large amounts of bitcoins each week and promising insanely high dividends. And when bitcoin price crashes don't expect mining bonds to get cheaper. Mining bonds are getting cheaper because difficulty is rising and difficulty is rising in part beacause of bitcoin price is rising and  more equipment is coming online.

[SebastianJu]

I hope to get out of them anyway before something is crashing...

That was exactly what I meant while referring you to non GLBSE bonds based PPT services.

Investing in BS&T is only about:
1) depositing your money into pirate's wallet
2) earning weekly interest
3) being able to withdraw the exact deposited amount, at any time you like

And these GLBSE bonds - they don't give you the last part.
I mean, be PPT bond issuers usually provide you with some kind of buy-back procedure, but only the fact that you were able to buy underpriced bonds should give you an idea of how reliable/profitable/convenient these procedures actually are.

There are overpriced Bonds too of course. Its volatile at glbse.

And you dont really think that, when pirate is taking the bitcoins and run you still can sell your bitcoins at the sites you mentioned dont you? The purpose of these websites are gone then. And why should the owner pay out money that he doesnt have either? Or did i miss you here?
If insured or not, thats the same at glbse, why should the owner pay out then when this would mean that he maybe has to pay out more than he earned? I really arent so sure that its safer to invest at these sites.

[SebastianJu]

Yes, i see now that miners have a bit of a problem regarding price and dividend over time. I think i have to find another way to value bonds. More in a way like a look in the future taken from the past.

[piotr_n]

And you dont really think that, when pirate is taking the bitcoins and run you still can sell your bitcoins at the sites you mentioned dont you?

Of course I don't.
That wasn't my point.
I meant that if the pirate doesn't run, you can withdraw the exact initial deposit (plus interests) from bitcoinmax/hashking.
While selling the GLBSE pass-through bonds will most likely affect your final income from the investment.

[puffn]

You don't know much about investing. You have more pirate risk than anyone I know of (except CPA). You should put your money in my ETF, and let me do the hard work for you. Current dividends are around 2% per week, in about 1 month, that will be 3% then with some luck up to 3.5%. All in stocks that are very low risk, have proven business models, and have good growth prospects.

[bitcoinbear]

You don't know much about investing. You have more pirate risk than anyone I know of (except CPA). You should put your money in my ETF, and let me do the hard work for you. Current dividends are around 2% per week, in about 1 month, that will be 3% then with some luck up to 3.5%. All in stocks that are very low risk, have proven business models, and have good growth prospects.

Going around insulting people is not a good way to get them to invest in your fund.

Does forum policy allow posts like this in other peoples threads?

[puffn]

Going around insulting people is not a good way to get them to invest in your fund.

Does forum policy allow posts like this in other peoples threads?

He admits he needs help. You guys give him tips, I show him how he can hire an agent to do it for him. CPA does have a lot of pirate risk. I then showed him how he could avoid this same risk by hiring an agent.

If you are talking about my comments to Obsi earlier, I don't really think any of that was unwarranted.

Edit: I am editing this in as I feel the matter is over. I apologize to bitcoinbear.

[bitcoinbear]

Going around insulting people is not a good way to get them to invest in your fund.

Does forum policy allow posts like this in other peoples threads?

He admits he needs help. You guys give him tips, I show him how he can hire an agent to do it for him. CPA does have a lot of pirate risk. I then showed him how he could avoid this same risk by hiring an agent.

If you are talking about my comments to Obsi earlier, I don't really think any of that was unwarranted.

I was reffering to the way your comment reads like an advertisement for your investment fund, which might be off topic?

I was only refering to this comment, your comments to Obsi earlier were just fine from my point of view.

[BitcoinINV]

Read down below invest there LMFAO I enjoy commenting on posts its free ad space

[SebastianJu]

And you dont really think that, when pirate is taking the bitcoins and run you still can sell your bitcoins at the sites you mentioned dont you?

Of course I don't.
That wasn't my point.
I meant that if the pirate doesn't run, you can withdraw the exact initial deposit (plus interests) from bitcoinmax/hashking.
While selling the GLBSE pass-through bonds will most likely affect your final income from the investment.

Ok, youre right. Its not said that the price will be met again. At least i bought last time at lowest bid-price. Maybe in future i will set my own price and safe the fee and get a lower price. At least i managed to sell 3 of the 8 shares for a higher price than i paid for + fee after the first dividend was paid. One share will be sold the next days and the last 4 shares are with bonds whose price is lower now. But its not a big gap. BTCST-Bonds seems not to go down constantly like the miningbonds do. So i think there is a good chance to sell them for the same or better price in some days. If not i will sell them some time anyway to cut the risk. But till now it looks like they dont automatically go down over time. Yes, it isnt always the exact price like with the websites you mentioned but this way you have the chance to trade. And it looks to me that trading could be another way of earning there.