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Author Topic: Remember that part of HTTP that never got built? The PAY action for that content  (Read 592 times)
BenRayfield (OP)
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April 09, 2015, 06:44:48 AM
 #1

It was forgotten.

Its clear the time has come to implement what was a planned global standard.

As I'm looking for a job, I'm considering starting a corporation whose founding document requires it to act only toward:

This corporation may be a nonprofit charity except for operating expenses collected never from users but only from money transmitters who agree on whatever fee or no fee if they negotiate well. This is to ensure there is no significant reason to create other providers of the HTTP pay action.

The HTTP Pay action will be implemented fully across the internet. We are 1 optional provider of that service, and anyone may start their own service and compete with us at no cost and no patents owned by us or transferred to others by us, so competition is unlikely to beat that, but its important for it to be effortless to keep this organization toward its purpose.

The HTTP pay action may be done a few different ways:
* Unconditional pay instantly with no possibility of money back even if you get cheated or other bad or unexpected things happen. The regulation of avoiding that causes delays and is often not a good trade, and other times it is.
* Middleman holds money until product or service is received and certified ok, or negotiated for a different more fair price. This requires a list of arbiters to be agreed on by both in the deal and maximum time they may take and default action if pass that time. Default action may be return the money or let them keep the money or some other process to be specificly named.

Maximize speed and reliability of all money transfers between anyone and anything on the Internet, as long as such transfer is legal, and the responsibility for certifying it legal is by competition of whichever money transmitter (banks, cryptocurrency, etc) first certifies it and finishes the transfer. Expected transfer times should compete with bitcoin. Banks only make you wait because you go directly through them instead of competition of whoever will send the money.

Make all websites and products across the world easier than Amazon's 1 click payments... actually 0 clicks up to some limit you define and for certain kinds of websites which you may write a javascript function to say true or false given the webpage and url and other info about it. You may also defer to an artificial intelligence for chosen websites and up to a certain amount, and this AI is your tool and its actions are your actions even if you dont understand its actions, therefore it is important to hire experts to explain how it works and what it could do and is likely to do or if you understand its (hopefully simple) code read it yourself or build it yourself. For example, if netflix or pandora wants 20 cents for viewing something, the AI just pays it so not to bother you with little things.

All transactions name a money transmitter by their short text name (like bitcoin, dwolla, paypal, wellsfargo, bankofamerica, etc or whoever may choose to join the service). Transactions also name a money receiver or multiple receivers whoever may take it first (assumed to know eachother or for some reason want to race to click HTTP pay). Transactions also name an amount and minimum and maximum time (approximate global time at sealevel accurate to at most 50 milliseconds such request occured, plus the competition time to actually move the money). Each type of currency is a different money transmitter. Transactions report those 2 names to all governments involved and optionally to a public record like bitcoin block chain. People may negotiate with eachother on a large scale to motivate the publishing of such senders/receivers, but that would be outside the scope of this corporation.

Any money transmitter which sends your money from a different bank without that banks permission is gambling that the money will come later and pays it instantly, hopefully getting it back when transferred. We have no responsibility for what deals those banks make with eachother. We are not a money transmitter, just a service of connecting people with money transmitters and eachother. We are only responsible for identifying who is sender and receiver, and any further investigations, by government for example, are directed to those money transmitters and people we identified.

All money transmitters who opt into this service agree to perform all government related obligations which would normally be the person's obligation, including paying taxes on it and other paperwork. For this service a fee may be negotiated and competed on. Many people dont find value in such paperwork and would prefer a competition for who will agree to be responsible for it, up to a maximum cost of such government interaction set by the person.

Obsolete all debit and credit cards, not the accounts just that form of sending the request to pay someone.

Prove military strength integrity of data sent, received, and people identified doing those things, especially by one of the many available crypto cards, except must have an addition that if a certain button is pushed it deactivates and person must identify again, and can be deactivated remotely. If possible, face scanning and other methods of preventing people from stealing your money would be available in such cards. Publish a list of all failures and proof it will not happen again or that it was the person's mistake or a desirable property of the system by a majority of users.

Prove that user privacy is no worse off than in the old paradigm of dealing directly with a money transmitter, by only storing the least needed data about anyone, specificly everything needed to identify them, but since we are not a money transmitter we have no responsibility to hold their social security number or anything related to goverment. Such responsibility would be contracted out by each person to any of the money transmitters they agree to include in such competition for getting money sent so fast it competes with bitcoin.

Publish a list of causes of slowness in sending of money, including things like governments requiring long delays in some cases, and any threatening of such money transmitters to keep the real reasons for things secret, or whatever may be the cause. This corporation is obligated to look for such problems and improve them if possible or find who caused them and publish this information.

Through organizing fair and honest competition, cause money transmitter fees to reduce and delays to shorten and excuses to result in some other money transmitter doing it faster usually. The expected use of this is that everyone, every website, every device, can send and receive money, through existing paradigms whichever works best at the moment, as fast as internet packets, and it just works.

The HTTP pay action needs to be built. Is anyone interested in helping to start such a corporation?

If we dont build HTTP pay action, cryptocurrencies may lead to wars with the central bank system. I and many others have problems with how central banks do things, and I think this paradigm would solve most of them. Keep the paperwork on the money transmitters side (up to maximum cost risked by user) and upgrade the internet to send and receive money from anywhere to anywhere really fast and automatically and with the option of any system doing it for you for certain kinds of transactions. Money is a number we send to eachother and agree on who has how much, a tradable perception of value. It shouldnt be a bottleneck to progress.

This corporation will try to get the world talking about what should be the rules on who can create their own money type, how that money can be created, destroyed, frozen, sent and received, anonymous vs identified, and what the people of Earth should do if the central bank system acts against whatever people overall think should happen. For example, USA's congress claims, in the constitution, the authority to regulate the value of money. I define money as "any tradable perception of value", so to regulate the value of money is to regulate perception, to regulate our thoughts on what is more or less valuable in the world. I would hope that people find competition works better than monopoly.

This corporation will attempt to split monopolies in any isolated location which has only 1 main currency, because monopolies create unfair trading prices and rules. For example, in USA maybe it would be better if each state created its own currency and all those states accept most of the others. Its good for people to think in terms of multiple measures of value, maybe they would understand corporations better and use them through prediction markets, or create their own new kinds of markets. It is damaging to peoples minds for their goals to be so strongly tied to a single measure of value despite their protests for more competition. This corporation will attempt to cause every location to use at least 3 main currencies whose majority influence are very different. Some country may own lots of value predicted for the future of dollars, but they dont own those who choose to use dollars. Only if dollars are the best value should we use them in each case.

This corporation does not support law breaking through use of other currencies not known or understood by any agreements each person has made, but competition must be restored, and the HTTP pay action is just the convenience and market for money transmitter competition to motivate the world to get it done. This wasnt my idea. Its something the world wanted but couldnt figure out how to do it.

This corporation will seek help of experts across the world to evaluate the security of each money transmitter and negotiate for inspection of their systems and practices and for them to publish the results of it, and to motivate others to compete by publishing their better security and practices.

This corporation will not send or receive money between any government organization who will not identify to the standards everyone else is held to the source, destination, and amount of each transaction. Everyone should transact by the same agreed on rules, or be obsoleted. While this corporation is not obligated to investigate any money laundering since it is not a money transmitter, only connecting them to people through HTTP pay action etc, this corporation will publish and keep updated a list of all government departments suspected of laundering more than 1 billion dollars, and by laundering I mean devaluing the dollars in our pockets without us knowing about it, secret accounts for secret plans, which many people may prefer not to be connected to through those specific currencies or money transmitters.

This corporation recognizes central bank system and its members as a sovereign country, not by land but effectively in our interactions with them, and since they are international organizations. Similarly this corporation recognizes cryptocurrencies as not a member of any land specificly except between those who may choose to use them. This corporation is obligated to investigate possible compromises between cryptocurrencies and the central bank system toward the purpose of avoiding a possible war or other bad events. Take this seriously, that control of the world through "tradable perception of value" aka money, has motivated many people in dangerous ways, and this needs to be talked about by many people and figure out some solutions. This corporation will start with implementing the HTTP pay action as widely across the internet as possible, and to maximize possibility of the world accepting HTTP pay action, this corporation claims no special privilege or being the default provider of HTTP pay action, except in browsers which may choose such default provider, but this corporation must not accept any accounts from money transmitters who also offer a service of being an HTTP pay action provider, since that defeats the purpose of a competition of money transmitters if one of them also owns where your money is stored, a conflict of interest that this corporation will with the strongest legal resistance prevent and not have any deals with. HTTP pay action providers can not be money transmitters or own any money transmitters as recursive child corporations etc. They can only send a request from somewhere to somewhere, for them to do or not do as they choose, and to contact arbiters if named in such transmission of money. Like Wikipedia, unbiased is best.

HTTP pay action...

(this could use some rewriting, but I think the core concept is solid and could boost the global economy with many smaller transactions from many websites and people. The world is demanding some kind of change. Here's what I think we should do about it, and I know how to build it).

Also, wasnt the Ripple money system similar to this? Maybe they would be interested in helping to debate and create the HTTP pay action, what the people asked for but it never happened.

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According to NIST and ECRYPT II, the cryptographic algorithms used in Bitcoin are expected to be strong until at least 2030. (After that, it will not be too difficult to transition to different algorithms.)
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BenRayfield (OP)
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April 09, 2015, 08:45:43 AM
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UPDATE... A way to avoid all direct interaction with governments (if each money transmitter opts in and does that for us) and publish anonymous random-appearing number instead of sender and receiver's plaintext names and money amount. All transactions guaranteed to publish to public record but in a form nobody can understand except if they already know it and check if they are right, and some personal salt (random bits) may be a good addition but would complicate the responsibility of a HTTP pay action provider, so maybe everyone could have a hashname that depends on which minute it is and the other info, so you cant know who else sent or received at that hashname unless they did it in the same minute, and you'd have to know their new hashname too. Digital signatures are the normal way, and would be somewhere in the crypto process, but governments would still have to get the original from someone if they come demanding it on occasion. The public record would be used as events for anyone to see something happened on a hashname. Maybe thats not what people would want, but theres no way around sending the plaintext to each relevant government... Leave it to the money transmitters. Things to figure out...

----

Really its overkill for just protecting names and amount, but people insist on that level of privacy. Nobody cares you shop at the porno store, but it will be SHA512ed so nobody except those who get a copy of the original names/amount can verify it and prove it to others who know that exists in the public record. Ask any news reporter to tell the world about it and see how much we care, or how much you'd have to pay us to watch such a news report. How about 50 cents for 2 minutes? Your crypto card, wherever it may be, wireless connects to whatever device (or finds some path to you) and gives it a number that could have only been created at that fraction of a second, claims which exact time it was created (to accept late by maybe 2 seconds for slow transmitters, but they'll learn not to cheap out on the computers and cost you time, or they'll lose that transaction to the competition)... and something asks "pay 50 cents to ..." You nod your head or say ok or however its approved, and you just saved 28 of the 30 seconds that would have been used with a card reader. If your bank is 186 miles away, and the network goes back and forth 5 times to finish it, they have no excuse to take more than 15 milliseconds for that money to be delivered and done, 1 millisecond at lightspeed in optical internet wires and 5 milliseconds for 10 million compute cycles (on a 1 ghz) in case its overly complex code.

Also about slowness, Kinect lags on screen, a common problem in computing today. It makes gaming feel like you're not really there. Cant get into it. Brains dont work that way if it doesnt sync. In terms of brain theory, I estimate that people would pay at least double for a similar device that puts what it sees of you moving on screen in 1/200 of a second, which is max of how fast neurons update, most of them much slower. In 1/200 of a second, a 1 ghz computer does 5 million compute cycles. It sees near 1 million pixels, so thats not enough, but specialized hardware for graphics or body detection could easily be 1000 times faster and take not much more energy. What Kinect has done to gaming is insulting, that they didnt care enough about making a good product to make it work even half as fast as a mouse or keyboard or even an ancient 8bit nintendo controller reacted instantly, but as the world works today products are made as cheaply as people will accept without too many complaining. Cameras are often similarly slow to finish delivering video to the software layer. Could it be related to those many millions of unemployed people who know how to design better video game controllers or cameras, but they didnt know how to get started without a business as a middleman for the money etc?

Who would build a device produced by just some guy who thought he could beat Kinects annoying screen lag, even if it passed simulations? I think unemployed people should work and get paid anyways if the paradigm of businesses continues to have this problem. In legal terms, everyone can instantly be a corporation by calling yourself a contractor, if governments ask where taxes were reported, but that doesnt get someone to build it for just some guy.

emrebey
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April 09, 2015, 09:29:09 AM
 #3

Did you checkout HTTP 402 - Payment Required?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_HTTP_status_codes#4xx_Client_Error
BenRayfield (OP)
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April 09, 2015, 03:16:49 PM
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I knew it was in there somewhere, but as someone who has been around the global infrastructure, I rarely see it used. Its mostly the GET (download) and POST (put data in). We would of course use the existing variable name and its number.

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