Portfolio suggestions

[dree12]

Due to BTC price fluctuations, I'm looking into value protection by investing into the Bitcoin goods and services market (which I feel has a lot of potential). Needless to say, a browse of top assets on the GLBSE has disappointed me. Most of the highest traded companies on GLBSE are either mining companies (which I believe will crash) or abandoned Pirate passthroughs. As such, I'm having difficulty finding the appropriate companies to invest in. Does anyone have any suggestions?

What I want
Not all these conditions have to be met, but these are the general qualities of a stock I would like to own.

• Secure future^A: Probably the most important. I dislike mining stocks and Pirate-like ponzi schemes because they can fail at any moment. If a stock fails this, I won't invest in it.
• Verified^B: Having an owner that is known in the community and who has a name is very important. The more information, the better.
• Voting^C: A voting stock is better than a non-voting one, because voting stocks treat the shareholders better.
• Dividend^D: A stock that pays no dividends or erratic dividends is not acceptable. However, a company should keep enough of its profits to reinvest or invest into marketing, improvements, or expansion.
• Communication^E: If worse goes to worse, a company that leaves without a trace is unacceptable. The owners should maintain communication with its shareholders.

I realize this is picky, but in the USD stock market finding a stock with these traits is easy. I fail to understand why Bitcoin should be different.

Rejected

Ticker	Reason
BIB.PIRATE	A: Abandoned PPT
BITBOND	A: Mining
COGNITIVE	A: Mining
FOO.PPPPT	A: Abandoned PPT
FPGAMINING	A: Mining
FUTUREFUND	A: High-risk
GIGAMINING	A: Mining
PPT.A	A: Abandoned PPT
PPT.B	A: Abandoned PPT
PPT.C	A: Abandoned PPT
PPT.D	A: Abandoned PPT
PPT.DIV	A: Abandoned PPT
PPT.E	A: Abandoned PPT
PUREMINING	A: Mining
TYGRR.BOND-B	A: Abandoned PPT
TYGRR.BOND-P	A: Abandoned PPT
YABMC	A: Mining
YARR	A: Abandoned PPT

Unlikely

Ticker	Reason
BDT	ABCE: Shady operator
BIOETHANOL	Partially fails A, fails B
KRAKEN	Fails C, does not strictly meet A
MOVETO.FUND	Likely fails A due to investments in mining (not transparent)
OBSI.HRPT	Partially fails A, fails B & C
TEEK.B	Fails B & C.
TYGRR.BOT	Fails B & C, has not paid dividends recently
ZIP.A	Fails C and recently D & E

To be considered

Ticker	Reason
CHEAPERINBITCOINS-STOCKS	ABCDE: Recent troubles.
GSDPT	ABC

Accepted

Ticker	Reason
BITCOINTORRENTZ	ABCDE: Secure, no competitors
RUGATU	ABCDE

Key
Q: Fails Q
Q: Partially fails Q
Q: Partially passes Q
Q: Passes Q
Q: No comment on Q
[nothing]: Q is not relevant, not available, or there is insufficient information to determine a pass or fail

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[novusordo]

Could you explain why you think mining companies will fail? Miners should always, on average, be profitable. If mining becomes unprofitable for some, those with a low profit margin will be forced out, but those with a safer profit margin will be able to stay in and make profits.

[SNS]

How about https://glbse.com/asset/view/KRAKEN or coming Satoshi Dice pass through https://glbse.com/asset/view/GSDPT ?

[Bitcoin Oz]

 The majority of successful bitcoin companies are private and dont offer shares to the public they can buy.

[dree12]

Could you explain why you think mining companies will fail? Miners should always, on average, be profitable. If mining becomes unprofitable for some, those with a low profit margin will be forced out, but those with a safer profit margin will be able to stay in and make profits.

I believe mining is in an extended bubble. Mining companies will become forced out by ASIC and low-energy mining.

The majority of successful bitcoin companies are private and dont offer shares to the public they can buy.

A company that can raise money has the ability to be successful. Many large companies are public.

[Bitcoin Oz]

Could you explain why you think mining companies will fail? Miners should always, on average, be profitable. If mining becomes unprofitable for some, those with a low profit margin will be forced out, but those with a safer profit margin will be able to stay in and make profits.

I believe mining is in an extended bubble. Mining companies will become forced out by ASIC and low-energy mining.

The majority of successful bitcoin companies are private and dont offer shares to the public they can buy.

A company that can raise money has the ability to be successful. Many large companies are public.

A lot of mining companies have ASIC upgrade paths if you look closely. NASTY for instance should be one of the first to receive them from bfl.

As for companies raising money most countries now have strict rules about public offerings which is unfortunate and means only high net worth individuals are eligible to invest. It sucks. If bitinstant listed on glbse for instance the SEC would massively fine them.

[dree12]

How about https://glbse.com/asset/view/KRAKEN or coming Satoshi Dice pass through https://glbse.com/asset/view/GSDPT ?

GSDPT sounds interesting (growth low-risk company), but has no voting rights. It's the best I've seen so far. KRAKEN is too high-risk for me unless I have a hedge, and also has no voting rights.

Could you explain why you think mining companies will fail? Miners should always, on average, be profitable. If mining becomes unprofitable for some, those with a low profit margin will be forced out, but those with a safer profit margin will be able to stay in and make profits.

I believe mining is in an extended bubble. Mining companies will become forced out by ASIC and low-energy mining.

The majority of successful bitcoin companies are private and dont offer shares to the public they can buy.

A company that can raise money has the ability to be successful. Many large companies are public.

A lot of mining companies have ASIC upgrade paths if you look closely. NASTY for instance should be one of the first to receive them from bfl.

As for companies raising money most countries now have strict rules about public offerings which is unfortunate and means only high net worth individuals are eligible to invest. It sucks. If bitinstant listed on glbse for instance the SEC would massively fine them.

Yeah, at the moment GLBSE is not as legally recognized as Bitcoin. However, I assume BTC-only services and goods providers (e.g. SatoshiDice) would be capable of listing on a stock exchange.

I do not believe mining is ever going to offer the rewards they are now again. Competition is going up, subsidies are going down, and the entire industry is an arms race.

[Serge]

the thing with SatoshiDice is it's run by the same people who have FeedZeBirds (FZB.A) stock issued on GLBSE, which feels like was abandoned few weeks after IPO. I'd give SatoshiDice few month at least see how it performs before even considering it.  FZB.A's poor performance/communication greatly influenced loss of confidence in the issuer's ability to pull through.  I love reading Eric's posts but FZB.A has been disappointing.


 

[bitcoinbear]

Take a look at BitcoinTorrentz. They do not have as high a yield as some, but they have been around a while and are providing a nice service.

Other than that, you are right, there is very few GLBSE companies that deal in goods and services. I think if somebody with some business sense sets up a good business plan do some goods for bitcoin sales or services for bitcoin the GLBSE investors would jump at the opportunity to have something other than mining.

A couple to keep your eye on: CheaperInBitcoins was supposed to be a goods market but I have not heard anything for a while, Rugatu is a Q/A website with rewards in bitcoins, if it catches on the shares could be worth something, Bioethanol seems to be actually making a product but has just recently started and the profits so far have been small, Futurefund probably fails some of your criteria but I find the idea intriguing.

Hope that helped a bit.

[Bitcoin Oz]

the thing with SatoshiDice is it's run by the same people who have FeedZeBirds (FZB.A) stock issued on GLBSE, which feels like was abandoned few weeks after IPO. I'd give SatoshiDice few month at least see how it performs before even considering it.  FZB.A's poor performance/communication greatly influenced loss of confidence in the issuer's ability to pull through.  I love reading Eric's posts but FZB.A has been disappointing.


 

This. SatoshiDice is also way overpriced and you may not see any profit on your investment for 10 years.

[Bitcoin Oz]

If something like cascascius coins or bitmunchies were to IPO I could see that being very successful.

[dree12]

Take a look at BitcoinTorrentz. They do not have as high a yield as some, but they have been around a while and are providing a nice service.

Other than that, you are right, there is very few GLBSE companies that deal in goods and services. I think if somebody with some business sense sets up a good business plan do some goods for bitcoin sales or services for bitcoin the GLBSE investors would jump at the opportunity to have something other than mining.

A couple to keep your eye on: CheaperInBitcoins was supposed to be a goods market but I have not heard anything for a while, Rugatu is a Q/A website with rewards in bitcoins, if it catches on the shares could be worth something, Bioethanol seems to be actually making a product but has just recently started and the profits so far have been small, Futurefund probably fails some of your criteria but I find the idea intriguing.

Hope that helped a bit.

Thanks for the suggestions!

RUGATU and BITCOINTORRENTZ are excellent for my purposes (low-risk growth to deter further BTC value loss). CHEAPERINBITCOINS-STOCKS hasn't paid dividends in a while, so I'm suspicious. I still have to look into Bioethanol, as I'm unsure of the industry. Futurefund fails A flat for my purposes here, but if the owner is better-respected I would throw in a few coins as a charitable donation, if anything.

[bitcoinbear]

Futurefund fails A flat for my purposes here, but if the owner is better-respected I would throw in a few coins as a charitable donation, if anything.

If it is what he says it is, Futurefund would qualify under A. But yeah, it pretty much fails B and C, and leaves room for healthy skepticism on point A.

[Namworld]

Might be mining, but still voting shares. Might want to review the terms on it still:
https://glbse.com/asset/view/BTC-MINING

A poorly known loan bond which has extensive backings:
https://glbse.com/asset/view/BTC-BOND
Public accounting for BTC-BOND: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/pub?key=0AvwwyRGyc1WgdGFKVlAtZVAzOGNqS1Brd05MUlFlT2c

*Disclaimer: I'm the issuer of BTC-MINING, BTC-BOND and the KRAKEN passthrough*

[Lethos]

Good luck in filling your criteria, their is a lot of securities out their, not many that fill all of those.
I admit I have a few favourites, but they would fail at least one of those, so I won't suggest them.

Guess I just like the high risk rewards too much and I didn't even lose anything investing in pirate based bonds.

[rxw]

How about https://glbse.com/asset/view/KRAKEN or coming Satoshi Dice pass through https://glbse.com/asset/view/GSDPT ?

GSDPT sounds interesting (growth low-risk company), but has no voting rights. It's the best I've seen so far. KRAKEN is too high-risk for me unless I have a hedge, and also has no voting rights.

Could you explain why you think mining companies will fail? Miners should always, on average, be profitable. If mining becomes unprofitable for some, those with a low profit margin will be forced out, but those with a safer profit margin will be able to stay in and make profits.

I believe mining is in an extended bubble. Mining companies will become forced out by ASIC and low-energy mining.

The majority of successful bitcoin companies are private and dont offer shares to the public they can buy.

A company that can raise money has the ability to be successful. Many large companies are public.

A lot of mining companies have ASIC upgrade paths if you look closely. NASTY for instance should be one of the first to receive them from bfl.

As for companies raising money most countries now have strict rules about public offerings which is unfortunate and means only high net worth individuals are eligible to invest. It sucks. If bitinstant listed on glbse for instance the SEC would massively fine them.

Yeah, at the moment GLBSE is not as legally recognized as Bitcoin. However, I assume BTC-only services and goods providers (e.g. SatoshiDice) would be capable of listing on a stock exchange.

I do not believe mining is ever going to offer the rewards they are now again. Competition is going up, subsidies are going down, and the entire industry is an arms race.

And someone will be selling miners those arms, right? 

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=99497.0
ASICMiner doesn't really fit your criteria of not being a mining company, but it doesn't look like you considered them in your OP. They plan on selling ASIC hardware- I think they could be a viable competitor to BFL, but do your own research :]