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Author Topic: Do not post SSNs, etc.  (Read 2098 times)
theymos
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April 21, 2015, 09:37:39 PM
 #1

For legal reasons, any sort of secret ID code/number that is used by the insecure legacy government/banking systems is banned from bitcointalk.org.

This includes, for example:
- US social security numbers
- Non-US government ID numbers that can cause security problems when released
- Credit card numbers

Exceptions might possibly be made if this info is absolutely essential to a scam investigation or it's very certain that you're posting secret ID codes that belong to you.

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April 21, 2015, 09:43:47 PM
 #2

Any particular reason for this sudden announcement? Is this related to the BFL subponea?

For legal reasons, any sort of secret ID code/number that is used by the insecure legacy government/banking systems is banned from bitcointalk.org.

This includes, for example:
- US social security numbers
- Non-US government ID numbers that can cause security problems when released
- Credit card numbers

Exceptions might possibly be made if this info is absolutely essential to a scam investigation or it's very certain that you're posting secret ID codes that belong to you.



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April 21, 2015, 09:58:26 PM
 #3

Have you recently received any legal notice regarding this ?

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April 21, 2015, 10:01:11 PM
 #4

Any particular reason for this sudden announcement?

Exceptions might possibly be made if this info is absolutely essential to a scam investigation or it's very certain that you're posting secret ID codes that belong to you.

Same question although I always assumed that was basic internet management
Unless someone was trying to sell false docs...
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April 21, 2015, 10:14:40 PM
 #5

I mean, this has always sort of been a policy, just probably due to recent events its worth reminding everyone. The difference between Doxing someone, and posting information such as a SSN, is that information gathered in a Dox is public info. If you go through phone books, Google, etc and find out info about someone, the fact that it was already out there and available means its not private. In that case you are just putting a compliation of info together. SSNs/Credit Card info, etc is not something you are going to find in any public record, and it can be assumed that it was gathered unlawfully.

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April 22, 2015, 12:32:41 AM
Last edit: April 22, 2015, 01:10:20 AM by Gleb Gamow
 #6

Any particular reason for this sudden announcement? Is this related to the BFL subponea?

For legal reasons, any sort of secret ID code/number that is used by the insecure legacy government/banking systems is banned from bitcointalk.org.

This includes, for example:
- US social security numbers
- Non-US government ID numbers that can cause security problems when released
- Credit card numbers

Exceptions might possibly be made if this info is absolutely essential to a scam investigation or it's very certain that you're posting secret ID codes that belong to you.

Yes. This new policy stems from BFL, an entity that loathes BCT. And, Josh Zerlan has a bullshit lawsuit against me.

So, we can no longer penned a person's SSN, i.e., 123-45-6789. But, can we juxtapose the numbers, e.g., 124-35-9867 or 123-45-6798, or is the latter too close to the original, whereas the former may be okay? And, if that's the case, exactly how and what can or can't the numbers be juxtapose so to not get in trouble? Who will be policing the SSN policy? Can we post SSN of dead people unrelated to Bitcoin? What if that person has kin folk still living that's into Bitcoin?

What if a legal document is released pertaining to some Bitcoin scam, are we allowed to post its likeness if such has a SSN on it? What if said document has the word Alzujii on it but said word offends a certain group of Bitcoiners, should that too not be shared on this forum? BTW, I made the word Alzujii up for demonstration purposes, so apologies to anybody I may have offended.

Josh Zerlan is dragging my ass to court because I posted an image of his master bathroom gleaned from the internet that was placed here long before he purchased the home its in via bitcoins. I posted the image ONCE back in December, whereupon Josh commented about it. Fast forward to April 1st of this year, he presented the image to a judge as proof that I am planning on kidnapping his wife. Take about being fucked in the head, this Zerlan asshole has lost all his fuckin' marbles.
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April 22, 2015, 01:20:14 AM
Last edit: April 22, 2015, 01:42:59 AM by ABitNut
 #7

I mean, this has always sort of been a policy, just probably due to recent events its worth reminding everyone. The difference between Doxing someone, and posting information such as a SSN, is that information gathered in a Dox is public info. If you go through phone books, Google, etc and find out info about someone, the fact that it was already out there and available means its not private. In that case you are just putting a compliation of info together. SSNs/Credit Card info, etc is not something you are going to find in any public record, and it can be assumed that it was gathered unlawfully.

In this case the the SSN was retrieved from a public court document. By your definition that would be fine, while it isn't.

There is certain information that cannot be posted (regardless on how it was obtained).

Edit: Is it just me, or does it seem that Theymos/this forum is getting more attention from authorities recently?
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April 22, 2015, 02:03:25 AM
Last edit: April 22, 2015, 02:18:09 AM by Gleb Gamow
 #8

I mean, this has always sort of been a policy, just probably due to recent events its worth reminding everyone. The difference between Doxing someone, and posting information such as a SSN, is that information gathered in a Dox is public info. If you go through phone books, Google, etc and find out info about someone, the fact that it was already out there and available means its not private. In that case you are just putting a compliation of info together. SSNs/Credit Card info, etc is not something you are going to find in any public record, and it can be assumed that it was gathered unlawfully.

In this case the the SSN was retrieved from a public court document. By your definition that would be fine, while it isn't.

There is certain information that cannot be posted (regardless on how it was obtained).



The image above may or may not have embedded in it dozens of SSN of members of this forum.

If the above practice doesn't violate the new policy, does converting a person's SSN via quater-imaginary base and posting such a violation?

311030110303210302103011020010302 is my SSN, and I could do the exact same thing for anybody else's, but would somebody be breaking policy is if they penned the following: Bruno Kucinskas and 311030110303210302103011020010302 are synonymous. It'll be left to the reading to decode it if they have the key, but once such practice becomes the norm in relaying this particular vital, most all will know how, and have the means readily available to decipher the SSN. Then, this practice would be halted, whereupon another practice would be put in place. At this point, we're fighting a system within a system that was designed to communicate to others in the world how to fight the fiat system via a free monetary system - Bitcoin.

That said, am I know breaking the new policy via penning 65j00ye2 of which is Josh Zerlan's SSN encoded but I'm the only one with the key to unlock it but may sell the key if requested? Clearly, I didn't post JZ's SSN nor am I selling it, but I am selling the key used to convert the SSN for only $100. The key can be used to convert any series of letters and/or numbers.
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April 22, 2015, 02:11:11 AM
 #9

Edit: Is it just me, or does it seem that Theymos/this forum is getting more attention from authorities recently?

 Honestly can't say I'm surprised, given his anarcho-capitalist learnings. A lot of bad shit has gone down on these forums, and Theymos has arrogantly shirked his responsibility at being a good steward of this community, IMO.

 Lost all respect for him during the BFL 65nm shit-storm.

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April 22, 2015, 02:23:39 AM
 #10

I did not know that this lunatic Inaba is more important than Obama. Obama's SSN is in the internet. This is bullshit! Cry baby Josh, cry. You are not going to get your way.

WARNING! SLok is a known user of SilkRoad and SilkRoad 2.0 who used to moderate BFL's forums. Can't get your refund? Email FTC attorney Helen Wong at: hwong [at] ftc.gov Follow the FTC vs. BF Labs court docs: http://tinyurl.com/ftcvsbfl
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April 22, 2015, 02:33:27 AM
Last edit: April 22, 2015, 03:04:32 AM by Quickseller
 #11

I mean, this has always sort of been a policy, just probably due to recent events its worth reminding everyone. The difference between Doxing someone, and posting information such as a SSN, is that information gathered in a Dox is public info. If you go through phone books, Google, etc and find out info about someone, the fact that it was already out there and available means its not private. In that case you are just putting a compliation of info together. SSNs/Credit Card info, etc is not something you are going to find in any public record, and it can be assumed that it was gathered unlawfully.

In this case the the SSN was retrieved from a public court document. By your definition that would be fine, while it isn't.

There is certain information that cannot be posted (regardless on how it was obtained).



The image above may or may not have embedded in it dozens of SSN of members of this forum.

If the above practice doesn't violate the new policy, does converting a person's SSN via quater-imaginary base and posting such a violation?

311030110303210302103011020010302 is my SSN, and I could do the exact same thing for anybody else's, but would somebody be breaking policy is if they penned the following: Bruno Kucinskas and 311030110303210302103011020010302 are synonymous. It'll be left to the reading to decode it if they have the key, but once such practice becomes the norm in relaying this particular vital, most all will know how, and have the means readily available to decipher the SSN. Then, this practice would be halted, whereupon another practice would be put in place. At this point, we're fighting a system within a system that was designed to communicate to others in the world how to fight the fiat system via a free monetary system - Bitcoin.

That said, am I know breaking the new policy via penning [REDACTED] of which is Josh Zerlan's SSN encoded but I'm the only one with the key to unlock it but may sell the key if requested? Clearly, I didn't post JZ's SSN nor am I selling it, but I am selling the key used to convert the SSN for only $100. The key can be used to convert any series of letters and/or numbers.
LOL.

I can't speak for theymos, however I would say a good rule of thumb would be that if an arbitrary third party (with medium to high technical/mathematical knowledge/abilities) would reasonably be able to convert what you posted to a piece of restricted information (a SSN, account number, Unique Identification number, PIN, ect.) then it is probably not allowed.

I would also say that it is probably not a good idea to advertise that you are posting something that can be converted back to a third-parties piece of restricted information, as it will likely attract unwanted attention towards both you and the forum

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April 22, 2015, 02:37:20 AM
 #12

Quickseller, while in a way you're right, in this particular case, the conversion is irrelevant and Bruno's clearly joking. I mean, I could give you a number and say with another number I could convert it to something else. It just doesn't really hold water. But that's all besides the point. theymos has clearly been threatened by BFL (Josh Zerlan) and is now bending over to avoid legal costs. In other words, that is the only party with which anyone should be concerned regarding this anyway, because their ship is sinking and they have GOT to make the maximum number of targets go down with them.

.























Federal Trade Commission vs Butterfly Labs













Made ya look. ; )



























brush242 ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=199652 ) aka TheBitcoinimist aka Rush Reid aka Ken Hunlenton aka Steve Reid aka perfectlycromulentword aka Stephen Mark Reid says: "BFL is fucked" READ THE EARTH-SHATTERING COMMENTARY AT >>>> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=150803.msg9614841#msg9614841 <<<<
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April 22, 2015, 02:39:58 AM
 #13

I am thinking it was because someone posted Josh Garza's income tax return that he and his wife's SSN numbers on it. He has pissed off a lot of people and insiders/disgruntled employees/contractors have been going to town releasing his private information.

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April 22, 2015, 02:44:17 AM
 #14

theymos has clearly been threatened by BFL (Josh) and is now bending over to avoid legal costs.

When has cost ever been an issue for Theymos ?

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2mcdb4/thermos_is_spending_100000_worth_of_his_donated/cm367gr?context=3

"If you think that $100,000 per month for 4 highly-skilled full-time developers is a completely ludicrous rate, then you don't know anything about this business. It would be fair to argue that it's a high rate, though I'm not even sure that this is true. You probably walk past a dozen cheaper developers every day, but their skills/experience would be very different, so it's difficult to compare."
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April 22, 2015, 02:44:27 AM
 #15

Quickseller, while in a way you're right, in this particular case, the conversion is irrelevant and Bruno's clearly joking. I mean, I could give you a number and say with another number I could convert it to something else. It just doesn't really hold water. But that's all besides the point. theymos has clearly been threatened by BFL (Josh Zerlan) and is now bending over to avoid legal costs. In other words, that is the only party with which anyone should be concerned regarding this anyway, because their ship is sinking and they have GOT to make the maximum number of targets go down with them.
I agree that he probably is joking regarding that string of numbers/letters being Josh's SSN, however it is probably still not a good idea to say that it is his SSN (or say that you will sell the key to determine what the SSN is) because anything that happens as a result of it will be a headache for Bruno at best. This is especially true if Bruno is actually facing some kind of litigation regarding a picture he posted years ago (I am not sure if he is joking about this or not)

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April 22, 2015, 02:50:34 AM
Last edit: April 22, 2015, 03:02:55 AM by Gleb Gamow
 #16

Quickseller, while in a way you're right, in this particular case, the conversion is irrelevant and Bruno's clearly joking. I mean, I could give you a number and say with another number I could convert it to something else. It just doesn't really hold water. But that's all besides the point. theymos has clearly been threatened by BFL and is now bending over to avoid legal costs. In other words, that is the only party with which anyone should be concerned regarding this anyway, because their ship is sinking and they have GOT to make the maximum number of targets go down with them.

Dude, you're interfering with myself trying to make $100 per sale with your pseudo-logic. Pirateat40 once penned that his Ponzi scheme was not a Ponzi scheme and that his loyal followers were well aware how he was able to pay 12% ROI per week with his non-Ponzi schem. In the same vein, I WAS NOT "clearly joking" when I penned that 65j00ye2 equates to Josh Zerlan's SSN via a key I'm now selling. I repeat, 65j00ye2 WAS NOT derived via typing pseudo-random keys on the keyboard.  Roll Eyes Roll Eyes Roll Eyes

That said, do you wish to purchase the key?  Grin Grin Grin

Quickseller, while in a way you're right, in this particular case, the conversion is irrelevant and Bruno's clearly joking. I mean, I could give you a number and say with another number I could convert it to something else. It just doesn't really hold water. But that's all besides the point. theymos has clearly been threatened by BFL (Josh Zerlan) and is now bending over to avoid legal costs. In other words, that is the only party with which anyone should be concerned regarding this anyway, because their ship is sinking and they have GOT to make the maximum number of targets go down with them.
I agree that he probably is joking regarding that string of numbers/letters being Josh's SSN, however it is probably still not a good idea to say that it is his SSN (or say that you will sell the key to determine what the SSN is) because anything that happens as a result of it will be a headache for Bruno at best. This is especially true if Bruno is actually facing some kind of litigation regarding a picture he posted years ago (I am not sure if he is joking about this or not)

It wasn't years ago, but last December, and Josh just brushed it off, my post not being a threat to him at the time. Here's the post in question: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=150803.msg9754840#msg9754840.

I'll offer the key to you for only $50, but better act fast before I change my mind.  Tongue
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April 22, 2015, 02:52:46 AM
Last edit: April 22, 2015, 03:04:07 AM by leeroyjenkins
 #17

@Quickseller, when the number is one found publicly, does it even matter? And the picture in question, if I'm not mistaken, is one of Josh Zerlan's bitcoin house bathroom. Josh my-legal-efforts-will-dominate-your-face Zerlan (nice riff, VFT!) is hellbent on making his litigious presence known to all over the most ludicrous bullshit. But I agree, Bruno is perhaps making himself a target intentionally. I'm sure he knows what he's doing. By the way, Quickseller, you might not want to quote someone's post if you truly believe it contains sensitive info. That could give YOU problems. Wink

.























Federal Trade Commission vs Butterfly Labs













Made ya look. ; )



























brush242 ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=199652 ) aka TheBitcoinimist aka Rush Reid aka Ken Hunlenton aka Steve Reid aka perfectlycromulentword aka Stephen Mark Reid says: "BFL is fucked" READ THE EARTH-SHATTERING COMMENTARY AT >>>> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=150803.msg9614841#msg9614841 <<<<
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April 22, 2015, 02:57:54 AM
 #18

When has cost ever been an issue for Theymos ?

Point taken, but have you seen the price of btc lately? Where's another gox to pump the price when you need it?  Grin

.























Federal Trade Commission vs Butterfly Labs













Made ya look. ; )



























brush242 ( https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=199652 ) aka TheBitcoinimist aka Rush Reid aka Ken Hunlenton aka Steve Reid aka perfectlycromulentword aka Stephen Mark Reid says: "BFL is fucked" READ THE EARTH-SHATTERING COMMENTARY AT >>>> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=150803.msg9614841#msg9614841 <<<<
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April 22, 2015, 03:08:22 AM
 #19

@Quickseller, when the number is one found publicly, does it even matter? And the picture in question, if I'm not mistaken, is one of Josh Zerlan's bitcoin house bathroom. Josh my-legal-efforts-will-dominate-your-face Zerlan (nice riff, VFT!) is hellbent on making his litigious presence known to all over the most ludicrous bullshit. But I agree, Bruno is perhaps making himself a target intentionally. I'm sure he knows what he's doing. By the way, Quickseller, you might not want to quote someone's post if you truly believe it contains sensitive info. That could give YOU problems. Wink



3157265 is the first 7 digits of my SSN. Those exact digits are found in Josh's SSN, albeit arranged differently plus two digits that are identical.

Let's open a can of worms. Wait till you see my next thread in this, Meta, section. (after a fetching a fresh cup of coffee)
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April 22, 2015, 03:21:13 AM
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@Quickseller, when the number is one found publicly, does it even matter? And the picture in question, if I'm not mistaken, is one of Josh Zerlan's bitcoin house bathroom. Josh my-legal-efforts-will-dominate-your-face Zerlan (nice riff, VFT!) is hellbent on making his litigious presence known to all over the most ludicrous bullshit. But I agree, Bruno is perhaps making himself a target intentionally. I'm sure he knows what he's doing. By the way, Quickseller, you might not want to quote someone's post if you truly believe it contains sensitive info. That could give YOU problems. Wink
From a forum rule point of view, I know that dox's can only be posted if information was discovered from public sources, however the rule above does not mention a public source exception, it does however say that it is acceptable to post it in the course of an investigation of a scam accusation. From a forum rule point of view, I really can't say if using a public source is allowable or not when posting restricted information.

From a "is this a good idea" point of view, I know that most attorneys will advise their clients not to discuss pending litigation nor the people they are in pending litigation with anyone besides their attorney, publicly or privately. I would say that it is likely that no harm will untimely come of it if Bruno were to post Josh's SSN with a source referenced however it will probably also cause him (or his lawyer) a headache.

Bruno had mentioned that the picture were gotten from some public source, and I have no reason not to believe him, so I really don't see what the problem is. IMO the litigation is probably just a way of showing the FTC that he is willing to litigate over small things in the hopes that the FTC lets him off easy and/or makes a slap-on-the-wrist type offer to settle.

Edit: thanks on the warning about quoting restricted information. I edited/redacted the quote

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