Superwallet + China = Moon?

[Guido]

are we about to finally buck the downtrend and start shooting for the moon?


http://www.coindesk.com/okcoin-blueprint-mainstream-bitcoin-payments-superwallet/

superwallet bitchez!
looks great, plus from okcoin in China

may work round everything

OKCoin, the largest Chinese yuan (CNY) bitcoin exchange by volume, has announced the launch of an ambitious new wallet product it hopes will encourage the wider industry to rethink its attempts to reach mainstream consumers.

Dubbed the first 'Superwallet', the OKLink desktop wallet, currently in beta, promises to combine the best of both fiat mobile wallets and traditional bitcoin wallets. In effect, the Superwallet will allow users to spend BTC, CNY or US dollars at bitcoin-accepting merchants, converting fiat currency to bitcoin only at the point of sale as a means of transmitting the payment and settling the transaction.

The conversion will come at no additional cost to the user, who will pay a bid/ask spread on the purchase as they would when initiating a purchase with BTC. OKCoin will continue to cover mining fees, while fees for those who use its traditional exchange to access bitcoin as a speculative asset will remain unchanged.

Jack Liu, head of OKCoin's international division, suggested that the launch of the Superwallet would mark one of the first attempts to encourage the use the bitcoin protocol as a payments rail without requiring users to interface with its currency directly.

Overall, he cautioned that the release is still a beta, and that the wallet is, for now, only as strong as the wider ecosystem with which it will need to interact. However, he expressed optimism that more bitcoin companies would be encouraged to adopt a similar approach when developing future efforts.

Liu told CoinDesk:

"The Superwallet is not branded as a bitcoin currency product. It will highlight the powerful open protocol which will allow users to spend their chosen currency using the bitcoin protocol in the same way the native tokens of the protocol can be spent."

Superwallet users who wish to transact in BTC will still be able to do so, a feature Liu believes will maintain the company's appeal to bitcoin users while providing benefits to a larger pool of customers.

"It removes the need to believe in deflationary money supply, decentralization, certain political leanings or the need to stay abreast of industry trends or currency movements," Liu added.

FinTech focus

The news comes on the heels of a slew of signals that the formerly trading-focused company was seeking to enter the consumer market. CEO Star Xu first hinted the company was on the verge of shifting focus at The North American Bitcoin Conference (TNABC) this January in his inaugural US appearance.

OKCoin went on to experience a string of departures that saw CTO Changpeng Zhao and product manager Zane Tackett leave abruptly for competitors or new endeavors. However, Liu said the Superwallet concept is unrelated to the exits, reiterating that his company is still equally focused on continuing to improve its exchange product.

Liu did, however, suggest the company is on a new path forward in his comments, framing OKCoin as a financial technology company that is more broadly interested in solving problems for mainstream consumers.

"We want to show we're innovative, that we're not just about speculation," Liu continued. "Bitcoin is an important, important, important part of our FinTech company, but we're trying to solve problems."

Liu's comments suggest a frustration with an industry that he implied was too focused on onboarding consumers to bitcoin as a currency.

"This type of thinking is a little narrow, how to help bitcoin users try to avoid volatility. There's this other community that wants to have an CNY or fiat wallet and think of a bitcoin address as a zip code or payment code," he said, adding:

"I don't think the average person wants to be looking at updates from Gavin Andresen and whether he put in new block sizes."

Limitations for users

At launch, Liu sees the Superwallet as more useful to its domestic Chinese users, who can connect bank accounts directly to the product, something US users are not able to do.

Still, he said there are workarounds for those who are willing to go through the current levels of friction to initiate USD purchases on the bitcoin network.

"You would buy bitcoin somewhere, including potentially OKCoin, and move the bitcoin to your USD wallet. So you don't have to have a bitcoin wallet, just a USD wallet," Liu explained.

okcoin, oklink

From there, Liu said users can scan bitcoin QR codes with their wallet to pay with fiat at the point of sale. Such new activity, he contends, would bring added liquidity to the network in a boon for bitcoin users.

"We're not changing the network. Anyone who wants to use bitcoin can keep using bitcoin," Liu added.

For now, though, he suggested the OKLink wallet is lacking refinement for English-language users. Translations for OKLink are still in development, Liu said, as are supporting versions of the product, such as iOS and Android editions.

Domestic market competition

While a change in the thinking of one large bitcoin exchange, it could be argued the Superwallet approaches concepts already being explored by other players in the wider digital currencies space that have attempted to move fiat currencies using open ledgers.

Pushing back against these comparisons, Liu argued that payment networks such as those developed by Ripple Labs are still centralized, meaning tokens function as IOUs.

In this light, Liu framed the Superwallet as an effort that seeks a similar usability while relying more on the bitcoin blockchain as a means to transmit fiat.

"If I send CNY via bitcoin to Circle, Circle owns this BTC and can get exactly the value of USD for that BTC. It does not owe any exposure to me or to any other party. Fiat should be transferred through a decentralized core and OKCoin has committed to that core being bitcoin," he said.

In this way, Liu suggested OKCoin could also compete in China, a market that has traditionally not be viewed as one where bitcoin can win a share of the payments space.

okcoin, oklink

Liu attacked this idea as well, contending that despite the low fees charged by Alipay or UnionPay, OKCoin can appeal to Chinese users who need to transact internationally.

"WeChat is a closed payment system. When a WeChat user arrives in a foreign country for example, he or she will need to install a new wallet," Liu argued.

Building an ecosystem

Ultimately, Liu envisions an ecosystem where bitcoin serves as the rails for international payments and companies like OKCoin act as the on and off ramp for users to convert in and out of different fiat currencies.

He stressed that the ecosystem needs to come together to enable this economic activity. For example, Liu noted that, today, OKLink users would not be able to send USD to a Circle wallet and have that user receive USD on the other end.

However, Liu did outline examples of how OKCoin's Superwallet could be useful for users of the bitcoin payroll service Bitwage.

"Now a Chinese person can get Bitwage and the bitcoin goes to a CNY wallet, and they get paid automatically in CNY," Liu explained.

Liu also indicated that he doesn't see the Superwallet as a viable consumer spending tool at present, given the limited number of merchants on the protocol. For this effort, Liu acknowledged the support of companies like Coinbase and BitPay is needed.

With this goal in mind, Liu ended by calling on the industry to join together for what he characterized as the greater consumer good, concluding:

"Everyone in this industry should be embracing this concept."

thoughts?

[1714150096]

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[nikona]

The concept of Superwallet and bitcoin would have been the most perfect if there wasn't much volatility , or maybe if bitcoin was of a constant price. But the idea does seem interesting, will wait for the consumer version to come out.

[nikona]

The concept of Superwallet and bitcoin would have been the most perfect if there wasn't much volatility , or maybe if bitcoin was of a constant price. But the idea does seem interesting, will wait for the consumer version to come out.

Why would volatility have any issue with an auto convert wallet?

So firstly, I am not sure why a merchant usually accepts bitcoin as a payment method. If its for an added payment method, then since at the point-of-sale the consumer is basically converting his Fiat to BTC, the merchant might just request for Fiat directly if its a possibility, instead of accepting bitcoin as a lot of merchants I know(not the big ones), like a couple of friends, who accepted bitcoin at a local pub, had the bitcoin during the  downride, and now are not sure if they wish to still accept it specially due to the price volatility that comes along with it.

[oblivi]

I don't see clear benefits vs what we have now. I guess those that do day trading could see some advantages. For me, someone that only keeps the coins at an exchange for the 5 minutes it takes to do my required operations then back to the local wallet, is not that relevant.

[randy8777]

don't get happy too early. it looks great at the beginning but i wonder how many people will actually use it. and will other exchanges also offer such a service.

[mercistheman]

The concept of Superwallet and bitcoin would have been the most perfect if there wasn't much volatility , or maybe if bitcoin was of a constant price. But the idea does seem interesting, will wait for the consumer version to come out.

Why would volatility have any issue with an auto convert wallet?

So firstly, I am not sure why a merchant usually accepts bitcoin as a payment method. If its for an added payment method, then since at the point-of-sale the consumer is basically converting his Fiat to BTC, the merchant might just request for Fiat directly if its a possibility, instead of accepting bitcoin as a lot of merchants I know(not the big ones), like a couple of friends, who accepted bitcoin at a local pub, had the bitcoin during the  downride, and now are not sure if they wish to still accept it specially due to the price volatility that comes along with it.

No credit card fees or chargebacks

[Ingatqhvq]

Don't forget China has banned bitcoin as a payment ways. So there is no way make a merchant accepts bitcoin as a payment method in China, it's just forbidden.

[jonald_fyookball]

Don't forget China has banned bitcoin as a payment ways. So there is no way make a merchant accepts bitcoin as a payment method in China, it's just forbidden.

I wasn't aware of this.  Do you have a reference?

[Kprawn]

Don't forget China has banned bitcoin as a payment ways. So there is no way make a merchant accepts bitcoin as a payment method in China, it's just forbidden.

Not sure if this is accurate....  

What I do know is, China has a obsession to control it's people... and by linking the Bitcoin address with a persons bank account, would identify him/her to the government. This will be more acceptable for them, if Bitcoin had less annonymity.

It goes against the principles of the general use of Bitcoin, but it enables more people to use it. {So for them, it's a WIN-WIN situation}

It's the same with Coinbase and Circle .... The USA will allow people to use it, just as long as they adhere to all the KYC/AML regulations. {Nothing new here}  

[Amph]

Don't forget China has banned bitcoin as a payment ways. So there is no way make a merchant accepts bitcoin as a payment method in China, it's just forbidden.

I wasn't aware of this.  Do you have a reference?

they banned the trading only(the exchange) not the bitcoin itself, despite this there are still numerous traders there

we can say that is semi-banned

[fox19891989]

Don't forget China has banned bitcoin as a payment ways. So there is no way make a merchant accepts bitcoin as a payment method in China, it's just forbidden.

I wasn't aware of this.  Do you have a reference?

It is confirmed, I am a Chinese, I have Chinese reference, I can show you the link of this annoucement.  http://www.gov.cn/gzdt/2013-12/05/content_2542751.htm

It is a long passage so I can't translate for you here, but you can use google translate.

A key sentence I can translate English for you: 比特币是一种特定的虚拟商品，不具有与货币等同的法律地位，不能且不应作为货币在市场上流通使用。 - bitcoin is a specific virtual goods, does not have legal status of fiat currency, can not and should not be used as currency in circulation in the market.

So Ingatqhvq is correct, China bans bitcoin as a payment way.

[fox19891989]

Don't forget China has banned bitcoin as a payment ways. So there is no way make a merchant accepts bitcoin as a payment method in China, it's just forbidden.

I wasn't aware of this.  Do you have a reference?

they banned the trading only(the exchange) not the bitcoin itself, despite this there are still numerous traders there

we can say that is semi-banned

Yes. It is semi-banned. But trading is not banned, China bans fiat deposit to exchanges, but exchange have new ways to deposit.

And China bans bitcoin as a payment way, can't directly buy goods from the markets.

[sandy47bt]

Most people in china use bitcoin for mining & investment only
And China has banned bitcoin

Also, volatility is the next problem
People could lost a lot of money

So, Superwallet + China = fail

[shulio]

Most people in china use bitcoin for mining & investment only
And China has banned bitcoin

Also, volatility is the next problem
People could lost a lot of money

So, Superwallet + China = fail

Investment? no you are very wrong in this. Chinese is well known as a trader across any country since hundreds years ago and it is still now. It seems like bitcoin there only serves the purposes as a tool for trading to gain more profit, not as investment as there are better investment in there

[nextblast]

I am also a native Chinese. I don't agree those saying China ever "banned" bitcoin. It is pure FUD.
If China truely "banned" btc as they said, why does this country hold largest coin trading volumn and owns biggest mines and hash rate?

Gov only said it is not a currency issued by the country, and investment should only be made with caution due to volatility.
Banks are, however, very negative towards cryto currency related business.
This is understandable because bitcoin is by defination MONEY WITHOUT BANKS.

So, BTC is deemed as normal goods by the government.
Nobody is arrested for owning or trading btc in China.

In fact there are quite a lot of creative and hard working people trying to innovate with bitcoin technology. OKLink is just an example.

[ensurance982]

This is very interesting in so far as a lot of people prefer to spend some coins when they buy something. They do this in order to support BTC and encourage other merchants to accept BTC as well. This reminds me of that integration project that one German online bank is trying at the moment. What was the name again?

[1Referee]

Can't see this "Super Wallet" having a significant impact on the price, if any. I'm sure it will be useful for some people, but it's not big enough.

[ensurance982]

Can't see this "Super Wallet" having a significant impact on the price, if any. I'm sure it will be useful for some people, but it's not big enough.

Well, it is just another technology and another piece of software that may be useful for using BTC. We have to wait and see whether this proves to be of any use and facilitates transferring BTC instead of holding them in a regular wallet. I find the aspect of it being integrated into the exchange very interesting.

[minerpumpkin]

This is a good initiative. We need to try out as many technologies as possible in order to find out which ones really make sense and which don't. This is another example where BTC is being used as a backbone technology and not a currency per se, I believe there will be many other experiments like this.

[Icardi09]

I don't think this superwallet project will make big impact on bitcoin price
especially if tht wallet only good for Chinese people
but this one is good project for bitcoin

[AtheistAKASaneBrain]

I am also a native Chinese. I don't agree those saying China ever "banned" bitcoin. It is pure FUD.
If China truely "banned" btc as they said, why does this country hold largest coin trading volumn and owns biggest mines and hash rate?

Gov only said it is not a currency issued by the country, and investment should only be made with caution due to volatility.
Banks are, however, very negative towards cryto currency related business.
This is understandable because bitcoin is by defination MONEY WITHOUT BANKS.

So, BTC is deemed as normal goods by the government.
Nobody is arrested for owning or trading btc in China.

In fact there are quite a lot of creative and hard working people trying to innovate with bitcoin technology. OKLink is just an example.

Well that must suck. If they see BTC as goods and not as a foreign currency it just means you are forced to pay VAT for conversions. They should learn from Spain and make it VAT-free.

[minerpumpkin]

I am also a native Chinese. I don't agree those saying China ever "banned" bitcoin. It is pure FUD.
If China truely "banned" btc as they said, why does this country hold largest coin trading volumn and owns biggest mines and hash rate?

Gov only said it is not a currency issued by the country, and investment should only be made with caution due to volatility.
Banks are, however, very negative towards cryto currency related business.
This is understandable because bitcoin is by defination MONEY WITHOUT BANKS.

So, BTC is deemed as normal goods by the government.
Nobody is arrested for owning or trading btc in China.

In fact there are quite a lot of creative and hard working people trying to innovate with bitcoin technology. OKLink is just an example.

Well that must suck. If they see BTC as goods and not as a foreign currency it just means you are forced to pay VAT for conversions. They should learn from Spain and make it VAT-free.

The way people interpret the Chinese regulations changes every day, I believe. I also think that the Spanish or also German approach to taxing and classifying Bitcoin is the best way to go. But maybe some governments don't actually want to help Bitcoin but rather want to keep it down or destroy it?(!)

[Amph]

I don't think this superwallet project will make big impact on bitcoin price
especially if tht wallet only good for Chinese people
but this one is good project for bitcoin

if they are smart enough they should provide a translation for it, and making it good for china only will bring anyway a crazy adoption because they are many there

anyway if they can provide an in-build conversion witht the wallet, i would be happy(it seems so by the article), so you don't need to use any exchange

[tokeweed]

are we about to finally buck the downtrend and start shooting for the moon?


http://www.coindesk.com/okcoin-blueprint-mainstream-bitcoin-payments-superwallet/

superwallet bitchez!
looks great, plus from okcoin in China

may work round everything

OKCoin, the largest Chinese yuan (CNY) bitcoin exchange by volume, has announced the launch of an ambitious new wallet product it hopes will encourage the wider industry to rethink its attempts to reach mainstream consumers.

Dubbed the first 'Superwallet', the OKLink desktop wallet, currently in beta, promises to combine the best of both fiat mobile wallets and traditional bitcoin wallets. In effect, the Superwallet will allow users to spend BTC, CNY or US dollars at bitcoin-accepting merchants, converting fiat currency to bitcoin only at the point of sale as a means of transmitting the payment and settling the transaction.

The conversion will come at no additional cost to the user, who will pay a bid/ask spread on the purchase as they would when initiating a purchase with BTC. OKCoin will continue to cover mining fees, while fees for those who use its traditional exchange to access bitcoin as a speculative asset will remain unchanged.

Jack Liu, head of OKCoin's international division, suggested that the launch of the Superwallet would mark one of the first attempts to encourage the use the bitcoin protocol as a payments rail without requiring users to interface with its currency directly.

Overall, he cautioned that the release is still a beta, and that the wallet is, for now, only as strong as the wider ecosystem with which it will need to interact. However, he expressed optimism that more bitcoin companies would be encouraged to adopt a similar approach when developing future efforts.

Liu told CoinDesk:

"The Superwallet is not branded as a bitcoin currency product. It will highlight the powerful open protocol which will allow users to spend their chosen currency using the bitcoin protocol in the same way the native tokens of the protocol can be spent."

Superwallet users who wish to transact in BTC will still be able to do so, a feature Liu believes will maintain the company's appeal to bitcoin users while providing benefits to a larger pool of customers.

"It removes the need to believe in deflationary money supply, decentralization, certain political leanings or the need to stay abreast of industry trends or currency movements," Liu added.

FinTech focus

The news comes on the heels of a slew of signals that the formerly trading-focused company was seeking to enter the consumer market. CEO Star Xu first hinted the company was on the verge of shifting focus at The North American Bitcoin Conference (TNABC) this January in his inaugural US appearance.

OKCoin went on to experience a string of departures that saw CTO Changpeng Zhao and product manager Zane Tackett leave abruptly for competitors or new endeavors. However, Liu said the Superwallet concept is unrelated to the exits, reiterating that his company is still equally focused on continuing to improve its exchange product.

Liu did, however, suggest the company is on a new path forward in his comments, framing OKCoin as a financial technology company that is more broadly interested in solving problems for mainstream consumers.

"We want to show we're innovative, that we're not just about speculation," Liu continued. "Bitcoin is an important, important, important part of our FinTech company, but we're trying to solve problems."

Liu's comments suggest a frustration with an industry that he implied was too focused on onboarding consumers to bitcoin as a currency.

"This type of thinking is a little narrow, how to help bitcoin users try to avoid volatility. There's this other community that wants to have an CNY or fiat wallet and think of a bitcoin address as a zip code or payment code," he said, adding:

"I don't think the average person wants to be looking at updates from Gavin Andresen and whether he put in new block sizes."

Limitations for users

At launch, Liu sees the Superwallet as more useful to its domestic Chinese users, who can connect bank accounts directly to the product, something US users are not able to do.

Still, he said there are workarounds for those who are willing to go through the current levels of friction to initiate USD purchases on the bitcoin network.

"You would buy bitcoin somewhere, including potentially OKCoin, and move the bitcoin to your USD wallet. So you don't have to have a bitcoin wallet, just a USD wallet," Liu explained.

okcoin, oklink

From there, Liu said users can scan bitcoin QR codes with their wallet to pay with fiat at the point of sale. Such new activity, he contends, would bring added liquidity to the network in a boon for bitcoin users.

"We're not changing the network. Anyone who wants to use bitcoin can keep using bitcoin," Liu added.

For now, though, he suggested the OKLink wallet is lacking refinement for English-language users. Translations for OKLink are still in development, Liu said, as are supporting versions of the product, such as iOS and Android editions.

Domestic market competition

While a change in the thinking of one large bitcoin exchange, it could be argued the Superwallet approaches concepts already being explored by other players in the wider digital currencies space that have attempted to move fiat currencies using open ledgers.

Pushing back against these comparisons, Liu argued that payment networks such as those developed by Ripple Labs are still centralized, meaning tokens function as IOUs.

In this light, Liu framed the Superwallet as an effort that seeks a similar usability while relying more on the bitcoin blockchain as a means to transmit fiat.

"If I send CNY via bitcoin to Circle, Circle owns this BTC and can get exactly the value of USD for that BTC. It does not owe any exposure to me or to any other party. Fiat should be transferred through a decentralized core and OKCoin has committed to that core being bitcoin," he said.

In this way, Liu suggested OKCoin could also compete in China, a market that has traditionally not be viewed as one where bitcoin can win a share of the payments space.

okcoin, oklink

Liu attacked this idea as well, contending that despite the low fees charged by Alipay or UnionPay, OKCoin can appeal to Chinese users who need to transact internationally.

"WeChat is a closed payment system. When a WeChat user arrives in a foreign country for example, he or she will need to install a new wallet," Liu argued.

Building an ecosystem

Ultimately, Liu envisions an ecosystem where bitcoin serves as the rails for international payments and companies like OKCoin act as the on and off ramp for users to convert in and out of different fiat currencies.

He stressed that the ecosystem needs to come together to enable this economic activity. For example, Liu noted that, today, OKLink users would not be able to send USD to a Circle wallet and have that user receive USD on the other end.

However, Liu did outline examples of how OKCoin's Superwallet could be useful for users of the bitcoin payroll service Bitwage.

"Now a Chinese person can get Bitwage and the bitcoin goes to a CNY wallet, and they get paid automatically in CNY," Liu explained.

Liu also indicated that he doesn't see the Superwallet as a viable consumer spending tool at present, given the limited number of merchants on the protocol. For this effort, Liu acknowledged the support of companies like Coinbase and BitPay is needed.

With this goal in mind, Liu ended by calling on the industry to join together for what he characterized as the greater consumer good, concluding:

"Everyone in this industry should be embracing this concept."

thoughts?

I can't see how this is better than the Ripple concept.

[Mrpumperitis]

This is a good initiative. We need to try out as many technologies as possible in order to find out which ones really make sense and which don't. This is another example where BTC is being used as a backbone technology and not a currency per se, I believe there will be many other experiments like this.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=997356.0  made by ICM , prob the best crypto dev ive seen in years   

[trotter55]

I am also a native Chinese. I don't agree those saying China ever "banned" bitcoin. It is pure FUD.
If China truely "banned" btc as they said, why does this country hold largest coin trading volumn and owns biggest mines and hash rate?

Gov only said it is not a currency issued by the country, and investment should only be made with caution due to volatility.
Banks are, however, very negative towards cryto currency related business.
This is understandable because bitcoin is by defination MONEY WITHOUT BANKS.

So, BTC is deemed as normal goods by the government.
Nobody is arrested for owning or trading btc in China.

In fact there are quite a lot of creative and hard working people trying to innovate with bitcoin technology. OKLink is just an example.

Well that must suck. If they see BTC as goods and not as a foreign currency it just means you are forced to pay VAT for conversions. They should learn from Spain and make it VAT-free.

The way people interpret the Chinese regulations changes every day, I believe. I also think that the Spanish or also German approach to taxing and classifying Bitcoin is the best way to go. But maybe some governments don't actually want to help Bitcoin but rather want to keep it down or destroy it?(!)

The European banks seem more interested in destroying bitcoin than the governments. They often close bitcoiner's accounts without giving any reason. It demonstrates how anti-bitcoin the banks are.

[techgeek]

All this ban bitcoin in china is more a PR price move, and most of those news were told again a couple years back.

Look what they are doing now again?

My friends in china and he talks about bitcoin all the time there, it aint being banned anytime soon esp when they tried to advertise it on T.V for people to use.

[lay785]

The concept of Superwallet and bitcoin would have been the most perfect if there wasn't much volatility , or maybe if bitcoin was of a constant price. But the idea does seem interesting, will wait for the consumer version to come out.

Why would volatility have any issue with an auto convert wallet?

So firstly, I am not sure why a merchant usually accepts bitcoin as a payment method. If its for an added payment method, then since at the point-of-sale the consumer is basically converting his Fiat to BTC, the merchant might just request for Fiat directly if its a possibility, instead of accepting bitcoin as a lot of merchants I know(not the big ones), like a couple of friends, who accepted bitcoin at a local pub, had the bitcoin during the  downride, and now are not sure if they wish to still accept it specially due to the price volatility that comes along with it.

Lets say you travel overseas and dont have local currency.

This would actually be amazing for such a situation.

Also I would hope that there would be discounts offered to people who pay via this method since there wont be any credit card fees or risk of payments getting reversed.