What bitcoin businesses most fear right now... The NYDFS BitLicense

[tokeweed]

“You have to remember,” Wilson said early on in the discussion, “My first introduction to BitLicense was a subpoena from the NYDFS. Usually you don’t introduce yourself with a punch in the gut.” He added that other bitcoin businesses and venture capitalists, too, were subpoenaed by Lawsky and the NYDFS without any sort of warning ahead of time. Wilson was just one of the high-profile names present from the bitcoin community. The other people in the room included executives from Coinbase, Circle, Xapo, BitPay, Genesis Trading, Digital Asset Holdings, and the Digital Currency Group. There were also policy folks from Coin Center and MIT Media Lab, plus six reporters.

The four biggest “pain points” these people have with the most current version of the BitLicense—the version that most in the room feared will remain intact and become final—are: that the BitLicense may regulate bitcoin wallets, not just exchanges; that the BitLicense will require money-transmitters to get two different licenses in each state; that it will require licensed companies to get approval for new rounds of funding that substantively impact controlling interests; and that it appears to also require approval for every new product they launch.

https://fortune.com/2015/04/28/bitcoin-businesses-fear-regulation-bitlicense/

[minerpumpkin]

If this really materializes that exact way, it effectively is almost like a ban. True. That draft of the BitLicense always reminds me of how news of new Chinese regulations crashed the price back in early 2014 every couple days or weeks. They didn't outright ban Bitcoin, but instantiated obscure laws complicating buying BTC on exchanges.

[tokeweed]

If this really materializes that exact way, it effectively is almost like a ban. True. That draft of the BitLicense always reminds me of how news of new Chinese regulations crashed the price back in early 2014 every couple days or weeks. They didn't outright ban Bitcoin, but instantiated obscure laws complicating buying BTC on exchanges.

Yeah.  We'll see by the end of May when it takes effect.  I hope it goes through another revision.  A big revision. 

[minerpumpkin]

If this really materializes that exact way, it effectively is almost like a ban. True. That draft of the BitLicense always reminds me of how news of new Chinese regulations crashed the price back in early 2014 every couple days or weeks. They didn't outright ban Bitcoin, but instantiated obscure laws complicating buying BTC on exchanges.

Yeah.  We'll see by the end of May when it takes effect.  I hope it goes through another revision.  A big revision. 

I really wonder who is behind those regulations... I mean, sure, there are a lot of people who fear Bitcoin or rather want it gone, but you need at least some kind of influence in order to being able to push things this far! I hope the people in charge realize that this would only stifle innovation and growth in an area that could become somewhat of a "game changer" at some point in the future!

[tokeweed]

If this really materializes that exact way, it effectively is almost like a ban. True. That draft of the BitLicense always reminds me of how news of new Chinese regulations crashed the price back in early 2014 every couple days or weeks. They didn't outright ban Bitcoin, but instantiated obscure laws complicating buying BTC on exchanges.

Yeah.  We'll see by the end of May when it takes effect.  I hope it goes through another revision.  A big revision. 

I really wonder who is behind those regulations... I mean, sure, there are a lot of people who fear Bitcoin or rather want it gone, but you need at least some kind of influence in order to being able to push things this far! I hope the people in charge realize that this would only stifle innovation and growth in an area that could become somewhat of a "game changer" at some point in the future!

The institutions that pull the strings.

JPMorgan Chase

Bank of America

Citigroup

Wells Fargo

The Bank of New York Mellon   

And these same institutions are all for crypto-currencies.  They just want one that they control.

[dothebeats]

If this really materializes that exact way, it effectively is almost like a ban. True. That draft of the BitLicense always reminds me of how news of new Chinese regulations crashed the price back in early 2014 every couple days or weeks. They didn't outright ban Bitcoin, but instantiated obscure laws complicating buying BTC on exchanges.

Yeah.  We'll see by the end of May when it takes effect.  I hope it goes through another revision.  A big revision. 

I really wonder who is behind those regulations... I mean, sure, there are a lot of people who fear Bitcoin or rather want it gone, but you need at least some kind of influence in order to being able to push things this far! I hope the people in charge realize that this would only stifle innovation and growth in an area that could become somewhat of a "game changer" at some point in the future!

The institutions that pull the strings.

JPMorgan Chase

Bank of America

Citigroup

Wells Fargo

The Bank of New York Mellon   

And these same institutions are all for crypto-currencies.  They just want one that they control.

And to think that they want to control bitcoins is just way over the limits. I mean, come on, aren't they contented on what they control right now? Why don't they just create another crypto that they can control and put some kind of regulations and see if it will be successful like bitcoins? Good thing that those regulations aren't affecting my country YET. But as soon as those names coordinated with the small players and major institutions here in our country, I don't think it's safe to own bitcoins as bitcoins per se.

[tokeweed]

Yeah it sucks.  But there's still hope though. 

There is big pressure on New York because it is the first state to launch its own set of regulations specific to digital currency. The only other states even working on such policy right now, said Jerry Brito of Coin Center, are California, Pennsylvania, and New Jersey. Most other states are expected to simply copy what New York does, and so, if New York comes out the gate with something too strict, it runs the risk of losing innovative bitcoin companies to other states that are less tough. Wilson went so far as to say that New York could lose “the next Wall Street” to Silicon Valley, or Estonia, or North Carolina.

A part of me is hoping that they pass it as is.  If they don't want innovation, so be it.

[Amph]

they must be joking about bitcoin wallets, unless they are referring to online wallet only, they can't regulate local wallet, there is no way

i hope this licence shit, does not come to other countries, it may be good for large companies/merchants, but it's the worse thing ever for casual bitcoiners,

[LiteCoinGuy]

the good part is: BTC has no border

[RussianRaibow]

No. BitLicense is NOT what bitcoin businesses most fear right now. It is applicable for a minuscule part of the world. What bitcoin businesses most fear right now is to be labelled as a SCAM instead of operating transparently. There is a scamofobia among bitcoiners right now.

[itsatarp]

I don't understand how you can regulate a bitcoin wallet lol.

Make new address send coins from some obscure exchange and surely it's not tied to any particular name / individual.

[SpanishSoldier]

I don't understand how you can regulate a bitcoin wallet lol.

Make new address send coins from some obscure exchange and surely it's not tied to any particular name / individual.

Regulation is possible only when bitcoin meets FIAT. Not otherwise...

[tokeweed]

I don't understand how you can regulate a bitcoin wallet lol.

Make new address send coins from some obscure exchange and surely it's not tied to any particular name / individual.

Maybe close the users' accounts and ban them in the exchanges unless they only use Coinbase or some other commercial wallet service.  So basically, you can only send BTC to your Coinbase wallet, to a regulated exchange and to a legal merchant.

Hasn't Coinbase started doing this?  They close your account when you deposit to a gambling site right?  

Edit:  That's why I am all for altcoins.  To give the regulators one giant headache.

[yayayo]

NYC regulating itself out of progress. Corruption at its best.

Btw.: The Mellon clan (Matthew Mellon) is also behind the coInvalidation blacklisting-project introduced some months ago.

But bitcoin businesses don't have to fear the BitLicense crap. They can simply relocate worldwide to a more Bitcoin-friendly jurisdiction. That's the nice thing with Bitcoin: You can transact without borders and NYC dictators can't freeze your funds.

ya.ya.yo!

[ensurance982]

I don't understand how you can regulate a bitcoin wallet lol.

Make new address send coins from some obscure exchange and surely it's not tied to any particular name / individual.

You may not be able to regulate the use of Bitcoin itself, i.e. stop someone from using the technology, but you can effectively stop the people form using Bitcoin in real-world applications, or using an exchange to exchange their coins to USD/EUR or other FIAT currencies!

[WhatTheGox]

I don't understand how you can regulate a bitcoin wallet lol.

Make new address send coins from some obscure exchange and surely it's not tied to any particular name / individual.

You may not be able to regulate the use of Bitcoin itself, i.e. stop someone from using the technology, but you can effectively stop the people form using Bitcoin in real-world applications, or using an exchange to exchange their coins to USD/EUR or other FIAT currencies!

That might happen in china/russia but people will find a way but yeah that would mean it never really grows to what it truly can.  In the west i think will be a different story, will just take some time so the gov has everything controlled probably.

[LFC_Bitcoin]

Surely businesses will just move out of NYC.

Simple?

[tokeweed]

Surely businesses will just move out of NYC.

Simple?

Sure.  But that's an oversimplification, and New York is where the money is.  It's where a BTC start up could make a big impact.  Also what's scary is most states might copy NY's Bit License.  What would that make the US as a market for a Bitcoin based start up?  (Almost) Non-existent?  That's like losing your biggest market.  So it's really important that the NYFDS revise those rules and make it encouraging for Bitcoin start ups.