Was I scammed or did my payment really "get lost in the ether?"

[MisteredF]

Not being an "expert" wrt BTC technology I am trying to find out if I was scammed or my sent payment really just got "lost in the ether."

Long story short:  I purchased a couple "coffee cards" from a seller here.  There was a problem with one of the cards and I requested a partial refund from the seller which he agreed to. Messages "compressed" to leave out unimportant ones.

First PM from seller:

Seller writes:
My BTC address is: 1GmQFe5vhMJJ4hfMoTNaoR5HJDVdHfh8Ye
I will send the codes as soon as payment is received.

I immediately respond with my payment (a bit more than $20) and HASH.

Payment sent.  Hash:  1a885393910d03c2cfe1a42e686277db1499111ce8f876f9fdcb885b4889c3cc

Seller immediately sends codes and there is a problem with one.  I request a PARTIAL refund to which he agrees. I send him my BTC address but he replies that "he never received my payment."  It shows as complete but it is not in his wallet.

I write: Once you get my funds just send me back $13 and we'll call it even.    My BTC:  1F44338K1Uj9gAovyF8aSECAZz3jcKaaD7

The seller states HE NEVER RECEIVED MY PAYMENT:

Seller writes: Yeah, I am not quite sure of why my wallets acting up, I never had this issue before. Anyways, I will send you the $13 you asked for as soon as I get the Bitcoin, I also apologize for the issues we had. Hopefully we can build our trust again and make some future deals. And please leave a vouch, it help's greatly.

Yes, I have sent you the right BTC address. I can prove it to you if you want. It's showing on the BlockChain that you have sent the Bitcoin, but I have no access to it in my wallet. I can't send you anything if I don't have anything.

My question is, is this possible or am I being scammed?  I don't want to post the name of the seller because I don't want to accuse him if it is possible my funds could have just got "lost in the ether."  Last contact with seller was about 6 hrs after payment was sent. This happened yesterday.

Thanks.

[qwk]

Seller writes:
My BTC address is: 1GmQFe5vhMJJ4hfMoTNaoR5HJDVdHfh8Ye
I will send the codes as soon as payment is received.

I immediately respond with my payment (a bit more than $20) and HASH.

Payment sent.  Hash:  1a885393910d03c2cfe1a42e686277db1499111ce8f876f9fdcb885b4889c3cc

You can see that your payment did in fact "go through" and the Bitcoin address 1GmQFe5vhMJJ4hfMoTNaoR5HJDVdHfh8Ye received 0.085678 BTC:
https://blockchain.info/tx/1a885393910d03c2cfe1a42e686277db1499111ce8f876f9fdcb885b4889c3cc

My question is, is this possible or am I being scammed?  I don't want to post the name of the seller because I don't want to accuse him if it is possible my funds could have just got "lost in the ether."  Last contact with seller was about 6 hrs after payment was sent. This happened yesterday.

If the seller denies to have received the amount of 0.085678 BTC at the address 1GmQFe5vhMJJ4hfMoTNaoR5HJDVdHfh8Ye, that's an outright lie.

[MisteredF]

Unfortunately that is what I figured, but I don't like making direct accusations without proof.  Any time I have LEGITIMATELY posted a scam (I have been scammed a few times)  I seem to get "retribution neg trust" so I like to hold off as long as possible. I never sell anything here so I don't really care about the "trust" thing but I never like seeing red.  

I'm going to give the seller a few more hours.  Maybe he "found" the funds.  

Is it POSSIBLE his wallet is screwed up?

[Amph]

Is it POSSIBLE his wallet is screwed up?

it is, but it doesn't mean that he has not yet received the funds, so in this case he should have said, that he can't access his funds, not just lie shamelessly

i think he is trying to scam you

[qwk]

Is it POSSIBLE his wallet is screwed up?

That's definitely possible, but why should that bother you?
If you pay someone cash and he pockets the money and, later on, his purse is "broken" so that he no longer can access his cash, why should that be your problem in case of a refund?

[sgk]

Is it POSSIBLE his wallet is screwed up?

That is one possibility. If the member is trusted on forum, there is a reason to give him a few hours before calling it a lie.

But whatever his issue with his wallet is, he should not deny paying you back. If he is a regular user of Bitcoin, he should have his private keys backed up, which he can use to access his BTC using some other wallet (like online blockchain.info wallet).

And even if he does not have access to funds or private keys, that should be HIS problem and he should pay you back what you deserve.

If he does not respond after a day or so and does not repay you, you should publicly announce his name.

[DannyHamilton]

Bitcoins don't "disappear" or get "lost in the ether".   The problem is on the seller's end.

There are two possibilities here:

• He has scammed you.  He intentionally sold you codes that he knew were crap, and now is pretending not to have received the bitcoins so that he can avoid giving you anything back.
• He is inept.  He didn't know that the codes he was selling you were bad, and he doesn't know how to operate his own bitcoin wallet.  He has therefore either been hacked, has malware running on his computer, or simply screwed up by giving you the wrong address.  He honestly can't access the bitcoins because he's got no idea what he's doing.

In the first case, people need to be warned so they aren't also scammed by him.

In the second case, people need to be warned so they don't do business with someone who is incapable of managing his own operations.

Either way, it is unlikely that you will get anything back, you should not do any business with him ever again, and if you are a "good citizen" of the community then you will warn others of the risks they would be taking by engaging in transactions with him.

- snip -
Any time I have LEGITIMATELY posted a scam (I have been scammed a few times)  I seem to get "retribution neg trust"
- snip -

Send me a PM with his userID.  I'll leave the neg trust.  I don't mind the retribution (take a look at my trust feedback, you'll see I've received plenty of "retribution" feedback).

The community needs to be warned about him, or he's going to take advantage of others as well.

[MisteredF]

Thank you all for your replies.  As it turns out this (as rarely happens) turns out to have a happy ending.  He "found" the funds and I just got paid back.  It wasn't the $13 (between here and A.C. I've lost a lot more so I am not "risk averse") it was understanding what had happened.

He provided me with a "technical" explanation of what happened so whether it was this thread or just his honesty (I prefer to believe the latter as I am an eternal optimist) all was resolved so this issue can be closed. 

Thanks again for your replies.

[virtualx]

Good thing you got it! it shows he moved them , so it's after you got t! so, all seems good.
BTW by coffee cards you mean , starbucks right ?
It's illegal to buy /sell them
Be aware

Do you mean starbucks gift cards? Where did you hear that is illegal?

[MisteredF]

Good thing you got it! it shows he moved them , so it's after you got t! so, all seems good.
BTW by coffee cards you mean , starbucks right ?
It's illegal to buy /sell them
Be aware

That's totally not even close to being true.  There are dozens of "real" gift card exchange web sites that sell and buy them.   You probably don't mean "illegal."  ILLEGAL means against the law.  There is no local, state or federal law that prohibits sales of "pre-owned" gift cards.  You probably mean "against Starbucks (or whoevers) terms of service."

How they might be obtained is another story but has nothing to do with your general statement that it is "illegal to buy/sell them."

 If so, please provide a link to a local, state or federal law prohibiting resale of ANY giftcards be it SBX or any others.  STARBUCKS terms of service states that only cards purchased from them can be used or they might be shut down but quite obviously they don't (and can't) enforce that.  THAT would probably fall under "restraint of trade" laws (again we are assuming the cards were initially obtained through legitimate means of course).

Edit:  Just for the record, NO, this incident didn't involve SBX cards.

[Vod]

Good thing you got it! it shows he moved them , so it's after you got t! so, all seems good.
BTW by coffee cards you mean , starbucks right ?
It's illegal to buy /sell them
Be aware

You'll find many people on this forum will turn a blind eye to illegal activities as long as it benefits the bitcoin economy or themselves directly.   

[MisteredF]

Good thing you got it! it shows he moved them , so it's after you got t! so, all seems good.
BTW by coffee cards you mean , starbucks right ?
It's illegal to buy /sell them
Be aware

You'll find many people on this forum will turn a blind eye to illegal activities as long as it benefits the bitcoin economy or themselves directly.   

This is true, but his generalization that "buying/selling (SBX card) is illegal" is totally ridiculous.  Buying selling STOLEN MERCHANDISE of any kind is another issue.

[bitbaby]

Another thing I'd add to this is OP if you're dealing with members you have not dealt with before it is always advised to use a trusted escrow. You were lucky this time that the seller was not a scammer and refunded your money for the bad gift card but it won't happen everytime.

The thing about Gift codes is that you can't check them whether they're used or not prior to buying (that's the case with AGCs not sure about starbucks) and it also happens sometimes people buy these codes use them and then claim that they don't work.

[wakka622]

Check bitcoin address you sent exactly or not ?
Send him txid
If he not respond so yes you got scammed

[Muhammed Zakir]

Check bitcoin address you sent exactly or not ?
Send him txid
If he not respond so yes you got scammed

Bother to read posts?

Thank you all for your replies.  As it turns out this (as rarely happens) turns out to have a happy ending.  He "found" the funds and I just got paid back.  It wasn't the $13 (between here and A.C. I've lost a lot more so I am not "risk averse") it was understanding what had happened.

He provided me with a "technical" explanation of what happened so whether it was this thread or just his honesty (I prefer to believe the latter as I am an eternal optimist) all was resolved so this issue can be closed. 

Thanks again for your replies.