Critical problems with Trestor - Read before use

[skang]

Yes, Trestor is a scam in it's current form. It is not a cryptocurrency, but a centralised digital currency pyramid scheme that is trying to ride the cryptocurrency wave.

Trestor is illegal as per 'Payment and Settlement Systems Act, 2007', 'Notification No. FEMA 15/2000/RB dated May 3, 2001' and 'The Sale of Goods Act, 1930' and Customs (http://www.dov.gov.in/newsite3/section7.asp).

If you fix the value of a trest and make it country specific, you will become legal like paytm, paypal etc.

[Benson Samuel]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1064423.msg11423036#msg11423036 - May 19, 2015, 07:24:45 PM

As you can read on our website, one of our primary goals is that all the software involved will be open source. At the moment, we are still in a very early stage of development. (Our project is not a (direct or indirect) fork of the Bitcoin software (unlike the dozens of altcoins, who did nothing but change the logo in bitcoin-qt and some parameters like block generation rate). That's why it takes some time.)

http://www.ummid.com/news/2015/June/20.06.2015/trestor-partners-with-cameron.html

Currently, Trestor has recorded a global sale of $3 million trests (the currency) and an India sale of over $1 million. "India accounts for 35.6 percent of our India sales," Dixit said.

How did you'll move from 'very early stage of development' to $4mil in a month?

Yes, Trestor is a scam in it's current form. It is not a cryptocurrency, but a centralised digital currency pyramid scheme that is trying to ride the cryptocurrency wave.

BTW @skang, these things have been informally tagged as e-fiat scams. I liked the sound of that .

[BTCIndia]

Yes, Trestor is a scam in it's current form. It is not a cryptocurrency, but a centralised digital currency pyramid scheme that is trying to ride the cryptocurrency wave.

Trestor is illegal as per 'Payment and Settlement Systems Act, 2007', 'Notification No. FEMA 15/2000/RB dated May 3, 2001' and 'The Sale of Goods Act, 1930' and Customs (http://www.dov.gov.in/newsite3/section7.asp).

If you fix the value of a trest and make it country specific, you will become legal like paytm, paypal etc.

Skang I'm just playing devil's advocate here. Do you know how a pyramid scheme works like? Basically like Herbalife and other similar programs a pyramid scheme works in a way that if you sell something to someone and that someone sells something to someone else you who sold to the first person make a percentage from the first person you sold but also from the person that he sold to and so on. So the more people you sell to and the more these people sell to others you make more money.

Trestors seems like is simply selling Trests to people who are interested to buy them which can:

Buy them from Trestor directly on their website.
Buy them from a Trestor Retail Partner which could also buy them back from them.

I also assume they have a fixed price otherwise how are they going to sell them?

According to Trestor's comment here they will release more info on July 1st with their whitepaper.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1064423.msg11452045#msg11452045

So much fuss about fixed price. Does anyone here believe that Pizza event established first price parity for Bitcoin which had no "intrinsic value" and that helped to create some "intrinsic value" for commons?

Well, Trestor you should have planned some market stunts. Like, 1 Kg of Caschew mozambique sold for 10,000 trestor and perhaps it would have second costliest Caschew deal someday in future.

And death of debates about initial pricing. I hope, you know answer to chicken and egg dilemma.

[Benson Samuel]

I am done saying what I had to.

Great, so am gonna remove the tag and move this to the Alt Section.
You can lock it as well if you wish.

Am done with my questions as well

[skang]

I love all coins but I hate frauds. I don't know why Palmcoins and BTCIndia would support a scam.

I am not affiliated to any company nor do any coin & have no benefit in doing this but only wanted people to realize this scam. But rather I feel the community doesn't care.
People who understand the protocol should raise their voice about the scams otherwise it is gonna come back and bite the cryptocurrency scene in India.

To each his own.
Since I have pointed out all I wanted, I am gonna lock this thread in a day or two.

[skang]

Skang I'm just playing devil's advocate here. Do you know how a pyramid scheme works like? Basically like Herbalife and other similar programs a pyramid scheme works in a way that if you sell something to someone and that someone sells something to someone else you who sold to the first person make a percentage from the first person you sold but also from the person that he sold to and so on. So the more people you sell to and the more these people sell to others you make more money.

Trestor seems like is simply selling Trests to people who are interested to buy them which can:

Buy them from Trestor directly on their website.
Buy them from a Trestor Retail Partner which could also buy them back from them.

Palmcoins, A pyramid scheme is exactly what you describe. What you follow up with, is what trestor is doing practically in real life, but on paper they are posing otherwise.
The trestor network is posing as a cryptocurrency.

- If we consider them to be a cryptocurrency, the 'validators' in T-Net have no economic incentive to validate transactions. But 'validators' have to buy validating rights from trestor. Why would someone buy something with no benefit? They won't. So either they earn benefit through fees or through become retail merchants. Both of these are then pyramid schemes.

- If we consider them for what they are doing in real life, they are just a digital currency like paypal or paytm. But they are hiding behind cryptocurrency to eliminate national boundary boundations (which does not apply to a centralised currency) & fixed price boundations by Indian law and are thus a scam. Also, there is no way to 'buy'. Everything is a donation, so that the consumer is legally unprotected.

I hope you read there technical draft, then my comments in detail & I am sure you would understand that they are a scam.

There are literally more than 10 cryptocurrencies in this sub-sub-forum alone but do you see me calling them out?

[skang]

..And death of debates about initial pricing. I hope, you know answer to chicken and egg dilemma.

Way to troll! There is no debate about initial pricing. The Indian law requires fixed pricing. And since they are centralised, the Indian law requires them to be registered as pre-paid instruments. And the Indian law also requires to be nation specific to avoid money laundering.

You are free to file a PIL and get it rectified, but until then they are illegal.

All of what I wrote is not my problem. My problem is that they are scamming people, which is besides them being illegal.

[BTCIndia]

..And death of debates about initial pricing. I hope, you know answer to chicken and egg dilemma.

Way to troll! There is no debate about initial pricing. The Indian law requires fixed pricing. And since they are centralised, the Indian law requires them to be registered as pre-paid instruments. And the Indian law also requires to be nation specific to avoid money laundering.

You are free to file a PIL and get it rectified, but until then they are illegal.

All of what I wrote is not my problem. My problem is that they are scamming people, which is besides them being illegal.

Problem is state of mind.

[trestorfoundation]

Dear BTCIndia and Palmcoin,

Thank you for bringing some rationality and logic into this debate.

Technical whitepaper along with associated source code is scheduled for release tomorrow. It should help clear the fog.

Trestor Team
www.trestor.org
@trestorconnect

[skang]

Enjoy BTCIndia's rational trolling \m/

Palmcoins, however, seems intelligent enough not to be affected by your interpersonal influence through appreciative psychology.

[BTCIndia]

Dear BTCIndia and Palmcoin,

Thank you for bringing some rationality and logic into this debate.

Technical whitepaper along with associated source code is scheduled for release tomorrow. It should help clear the fog.

Trestor Team
www.trestor.org
@trestorconnect

I doubt, we'd be able to defend "rational/irrational" arguments for long.
Why don't you stop having discussions here. These people are not your target audience and customer demographic. They're experienced with digital currency that doesn't mean high receptibility from business point of view.

[xmaxbit]

They have shown in another thread a complete chat history with indian forum moderator Benson , I thought its a good company when I saw their website but soon i realised that they hadnt hit any exchange site yet .

[Benson Samuel]

They have shown in another thread a complete chat history with indian forum moderator Benson , I thought its a good company when I saw their website but soon i realised that they hadnt hit any exchange site yet .

That is not the complete history.

[pliv84]

WTF - they claim a $1 B market cap in this article?!

http://cointelegraph.com/news/113467/90-of-all-the-cryptocurrencies-today-should-cease-to-exist-within-the-next-24-months

Complete BS.

[chokho]

According to wikipedia, Market Cap is equal to the share price times the number of shares outstanding. In this case, a share is comparable to a Trest. Since, 1 Trest = 0.01 USD, and a total of 100 Bn trests are there; the market Cap is $1 B.

The next question, why does the price does not fluctuate or stays fixed?
As of right now, market price for trests does not fluctuate much because Trestor Foundation is actively engaged in market-making activities around that price. Over time, as more and more trests are out in market, our ability to make the market would go down.

Next question, if Market cap is 1Bn, then why isn't it listed on Coinmarketcap.com?
Trests are not on Coinmarketcap because Trestor hasn't yet made an effort to get listed on an exchange. However, the Whitepaper, Tech-Draft, APIs and the source code is open, http://trestor.org/source. (Small parts of code are still not added there as they are being worked for some improvements.)

Here, we believe that decentralization is a process, not a final state. Trestor is on track to make Trestor network (T-Net) fully decentralized. As of right now, the entry barrier to run a full Trestor node is high. We are accepting applications from academic institutions interested in running a Trestor full node, and upon successful due diligence process, they will run Trestor full nodes (Validators).

Trestor's control over T-Net will be over in near future. By October 1, 2015, T-Net will be fully decentralized and anyone with minimal resources would be able to run a full node.  At that point, we will be far more decentralized than Bitcoin or any other cryptocurrency.

For Further discussion, please post to main thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1106047.0

This thread has already been reported for inaccurate and misleading content and the moderator should take action soon.

[Benson Samuel]

This thread has already been reported for inaccurate and misleading content and the moderator should take action soon.

This thread has no proof of trestor being scam, and it is outdated too. It is more of a personal opinion. As a moderator to build a healthy cryptocurrency community, please look into it ASAP.

This has been marked as a bad report as there are many personal opinions on this thread, along with newer ones coming up as well from multiple people. And now that there are posts all over the forum, I cannot remove something because you'll have cross answered and posted and anyone reading needs to take comments from this post into their judgements as well.

I saw this thread under a CoinTelegraph article and it's misleading for the public. In my opinion Trestor has been answering questions on other threads and being actively providing feedback. This looks like an organized attack, I also found that the mod (benson) and skang are working together: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tj5LNkUQKy0. It doesn't seem fair and the title of the thread is misleading.

Another bad report, as skang and myself do not work together.


Note: I won't be handling anymore of these trestor reports - will be marking as ignore. And someone else should be able to pick them up.

[chokho]

This has been marked as a bad report as there are many personal opinions on this thread, along with newer ones coming up as well from multiple people.

Yes, exactly that is why this thread is misleading.

The title of this thread says what exactly Trestor is not. It tries to defame the foundation. Trestor Foundation and team members have been able to answer all the questions put up by community members. Now everyone knows that this project is not a scam but a project which is in process of doing a number of things and in that process sometimes things get miscommunicated too.

Also, it's not required to remove the thread, but it the title should be not be misleading, and should be summarizing the discussion. It can be : "Questions for Trestor" or something on the lines, but not accusive.

I hope you understand. I respect you and as you are the moderator, I seek help from you on this.

[skang]

Dear Chokho,

None of the questions have been answered by Trestor & this thread is accurate. Their stance is to act dumb & pretend they did not understand.
Even the whitepaper released does not address the few questions they said it would.

With personal allegations, this is getting too dirty & so I stopped replying. Read everywhere, I have even offered suggestions how they can become legal etc. but it is evident from their ignorance that they clearly understand their nature.

I don't care about bitcoins. I am programmer with interest in algorithms associated with cryptocurrency.

Yes, I am defaming them by exposing their scam & my intention was to save my fellow Indians.
But most people are ignorant to not care so its fine. Go buy trests & enjoy.

Dear Palmcoins,

Go watch that video. Especially the part where I ask Benson about altcoins & notice him getting uncomfortable.
I have been opposing him ever since I joined here because he is bullish on bitcoin.
Me however, being a programmer, am only concerned with the algorithms of various coins.

As for the proof, none of the questions in this post has been answered but ignored.

All of this, if we pretend to forget that Trestor is illegal

[skang]

Very logical statements PalmCoins. I read the whitepaper.

Yes, I am not a legal expert & I take back my judgement for it to be illegal - very likely a personal opinion.
I have nothing against people in Trestor but against 'this' business model. They could make changes in their model & I would welcome & even advertise them like I promote all other Indian cryptocurrency businesses.
I would have been more cordial had they not been taking people's real money.

Here is how my though process started regarding legality - Can you send money from Canada to India using Trestor? Yes.
Is sending money to India & holding it allowed, as per Indian or Canadian laws?









Bandhu. I don't even have a reason to take up this fight. This was just a PSA. I fear rich people & I am changing the title of this thread.
Peace.

[skang]

This thread will be locked on 8th July. Post your final statements or anything by then.
This is not my fight & I am not taking it up.