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Astargath (OP)
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June 14, 2015, 07:54:47 PM |
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So right now selling bitcoins for paypal is dangerous for the seller because the buyer cand ask for a refund but what if.. You use escrow and you send the btc to the escrow, now the buyer has to send you the money to paypal and the escrow wont give him the btc until you have the money on paypal and you withdraw it to your bank account, now escrow gives buyer the btc and thats it. You have your money, he has his btc
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KWH
Legendary
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Activity: 1960
Merit: 1052
In Collateral I Trust.
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June 14, 2015, 08:02:18 PM |
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So right now selling bitcoins for paypal is dangerous for the seller because the buyer cand ask for a refund but what if.. You use escrow and you send the btc to the escrow, now the buyer has to send you the money to paypal and the escrow wont give him the btc until you have the money on paypal and you withdraw it to your bank account, now escrow gives buyer the btc and thats it. You have your money, he has his btc
Until they charge back within 180 days time frame. Your account is now negative, Paypal starts collection process. As has been stated many, many times: Escrow with Paypal is useless for the seller. |
When the subject of buying BTC with Paypal comes up, I often remember this:
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.
Albert Einstein
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twister
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June 14, 2015, 09:00:42 PM |
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Even if you transfer the paypal funds to your bank account, the sender can still say that his account was hacked and/or he didn't received the product he was to received and then your account is frozen and paypal may file a complaint against you that you stole funds and take legal actions.
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erpbridge
Legendary
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Activity: 954
Merit: 1000
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June 14, 2015, 09:48:55 PM |
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So right now selling bitcoins for paypal is dangerous for the seller because the buyer cand ask for a refund but what if.. You use escrow and you send the btc to the escrow, now the buyer has to send you the money to paypal and the escrow wont give him the btc until you have the money on paypal and you withdraw it to your bank account, now escrow gives buyer the btc and thats it. You have your money, he has his btc
Paypal will mark your account and you will not be able to use it further until you clear that amount. The only workaround I have used is buying something else like an Amazon Gift care that accepts paypal. I believe that way the other user cannot reverse it, and most of the times I use it instantly so I don't have to worry about any charge backs. |
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snarlpill
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June 15, 2015, 04:24:18 AM |
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I think the only way to really do PP to BTC safely is to small amounts traded with a highly trusted member, and growing a trading relationship with that person over time. And even that is never a guarantee of security, or some people will charge you high percentage exchange rates. Check the "Currency Exchange" section on here though and try to find a trusted member to build an honest trading relationship with.
I sell some things on eBay and occasionally look to trade small amounts of my PP for BTC at market rates, so feel free to send me a message sometime if you're ever looking to trade your BTC to PayPal. I know for a fact that I wouldn't scam anybody with a chargeback if I received their BTC, but of course the only way for someone to believe that is by trading with me over time. After all, a scammer will always say they are honest to pull off a scam, you can never blindly believe somebody on just their word.
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Astargath (OP)
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June 15, 2015, 05:23:28 AM |
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So right now selling bitcoins for paypal is dangerous for the seller because the buyer cand ask for a refund but what if.. You use escrow and you send the btc to the escrow, now the buyer has to send you the money to paypal and the escrow wont give him the btc until you have the money on paypal and you withdraw it to your bank account, now escrow gives buyer the btc and thats it. You have your money, he has his btc
Paypal will mark your account and you will not be able to use it further until you clear that amount. The only workaround I have used is buying something else like an Amazon Gift care that accepts paypal. I believe that way the other user cannot reverse it, and most of the times I use it instantly so I don't have to worry about any charge backs. I missed that, i didnt know paypal would make your account negative, its like they make everything possible for the scammers to scam, they really dont like bitcoin, it would be incredible if one day they decide to add btc as a currency. |
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sana6801
Newbie
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Activity: 39
Merit: 0
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June 16, 2015, 10:27:57 AM |
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Trading with paypal always should be careful. If you are buying bitcoin and you get bitcoin in your address, you are fine. But if you sell bitcoin, you need to find the reputaitonal paypal traders. You will have less chance to be scammed.
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GannickusX
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June 16, 2015, 07:22:14 PM |
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There should be like an option to transfer money without the option of a chargeback, that would be the easiest solution but doesnt seem like paypal cares too much about this.
If your account gets on negative you have to pay the amount back? What happens if you dont, any legal actions can be taken by paypal?
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snarlpill
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June 16, 2015, 07:46:28 PM |
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There should be like an option to transfer money without the option of a chargeback, that would be the easiest solution but doesnt seem like paypal cares too much about this.
There is an option available for transferring money without a chargeback, it is called Bitcoin.   But yeah, I don't think PayPal would ever do that, because they are all about their "Buyer Protection" services they provide. The best way to transfer PayPal in a P2P trade though is to send the money through Friends & Family. Doing it this way the person receiving it doesn't have to pay any fees, and there is less chance of a chargeback occurring, but I've heard it can still be done. Best option is to only trade with a trusted trading partner who wouldn't pull some unnecessary chargeback BS. If your account gets on negative you have to pay the amount back? What happens if you dont, any legal actions can be taken by paypal?
I'm sure they have the right to take legal action if your account gets in the negative and you owe them money. I'm almost 100% sure this is one of the terms you have to agree to in their "Terms and Conditions" in order to be able to use PayPal. |
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erpbridge
Legendary
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Activity: 954
Merit: 1000
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June 16, 2015, 08:48:59 PM |
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There should be like an option to transfer money without the option of a chargeback, that would be the easiest solution but doesnt seem like paypal cares too much about this.
If your account gets on negative you have to pay the amount back? What happens if you dont, any legal actions can be taken by paypal?
There is something known as Mass payments by Paypal which is sort of not reversible. The only reason these payment processors have to let the transactions be reversible is the credit card chargebacks they face as well by the users. If you consider the friends and family option, it is said to be the option without the chargeback, but it isn't only because when someone blocks payment to them, they have to do that to the receiver as well. |
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brendanjhwu
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June 18, 2015, 03:05:39 AM |
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Can't you send the money as family or friends? I believe that will require him/her to contact paypal to get the money back. To prevent them from doing so, you could tell them to sign the transaction under your terms in the box above the "send" button.
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kralle
Newbie
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Activity: 42
Merit: 0
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June 18, 2015, 08:11:56 AM |
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Can't you send the money as family or friends? I believe that will require him/her to contact paypal to get the money back. To prevent them from doing so, you could tell them to sign the transaction under your terms in the box above the "send" button.
Some countrys does not even offer the option to send it as family or friends, but even that one is not safe from chargeback |
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bounst
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June 18, 2015, 09:35:03 AM |
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so we need a third-party hosting provider, exchange??
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Amph
Legendary
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Activity: 3248
Merit: 1070
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June 18, 2015, 09:59:41 AM |
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so we need a third-party hosting provider, exchange??
pretty much yes, it is better to avoid shitty paypal and its clone, just use exchange of any kind, or trade with trusted members only if you don't want an escrow(which can slow down your trade some time) |
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GannickusX
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June 18, 2015, 11:34:36 AM |
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so we need a third-party hosting provider, exchange??
There are exchanges that offer paypal withdraw like btc-e but the fees are always a bit too high, for instance on btc-e the fees are 7% and a minimum of 500 dollars, you would get 465 which is a significant loss if you ask me |
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AccountStore.biz
Newbie
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Activity: 22
Merit: 0
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June 18, 2015, 11:47:07 AM |
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There is no solution. PayPal suck at preventing fraud and will make the seller pay for it whenever they can. Plus PayPal have rules forbidding currency trades in their TOS and will suspend your account if you do that.
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XinXan
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June 18, 2015, 12:47:09 PM |
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There is no solution. PayPal suck at preventing fraud and will make the seller pay for it whenever they can. Plus PayPal have rules forbidding currency trades in their TOS and will suspend your account if you do that.
If paypal has rules forbidding currency trading how would the other user appeal to them to get a refund? What is he going to tell them? And how come they dont make any kind of investigation about it? |
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erpbridge
Legendary
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Activity: 954
Merit: 1000
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June 18, 2015, 07:56:20 PM |
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If paypal has rules forbidding currency trading how would the other user appeal to them to get a refund? What is he going to tell them? And how come they dont make any kind of investigation about it?
If a person does currency trading on paypal, then they usually don't ban the account right away but leave them with a warning aand point them towards the TOC. They don't however entertain requests for chargebacks by users involved in currency trading and they will usually just declare them to have lost the case since they were involved in it, and they do this without doing any investigation. So basically its always the person who sends bitcoin for paypal, who will lose the case most of the times as the case will be won by the person who sent funds using paypal. |
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CryptoTrout
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June 18, 2015, 11:51:58 PM |
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paypal is worthless, they freeze funds whenever they feel like it and you have no control. as a buyer they are fine but i stopped selling through them years ago
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Amph
Legendary
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Activity: 3248
Merit: 1070
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June 19, 2015, 06:06:23 AM |
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paypal is worthless, they freeze funds whenever they feel like it and you have no control. as a buyer they are fine but i stopped selling through them years ago
it is good for one thing though, when you want to purchase on soem shady/fishy site, that has something that you can't find elsewhere, if they accepte paypal your ass is fully covered, with debit and credit card i would not be very comfortable in using this kind of website |
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