extinguishing Western union

[Q7]

It's interesting to see how this will turn up and how it will affect the future money transfer business. For instance, if you look at Rebit.ph, what they are offering is considered something similar to what WU is offering and without the extra fees. Question is how many people knows how to utilize it. The biggest barrier to mass adoption might be that the bitcoin community is still dominated by the groups of people having IT knowledge and we need to over this to bring the knowledge to all the common people.

[moni3z]

Western Union cancels transactions all the time for no reason except "business decision". My last 2 xfers to Africa to pay graduate students for work were cancelled. When I went to go pick them up the girl behind me had her WU that she sent to her parents in Peru cancelled too.

They should die and bitcoin should replace them. If I can't find somebody on localbitcoins I usually then turn to Worldremit, as they have dozens of local payout methods as I need MTN Mobile Money in Rwanda/Uganda often, and MPESA in Kenya. I don't think bitpay or coinbase will allow their services to be used for remittance though or else Worldremit could accept them unfortunately.

A totally decentralized remittance method, that abstracts away all the complexities of bitcoin would be ideal. I like localbitcoins but it's centralized so if they are down everything is down, plus fees are large for small traders in the developing world, should be a free market of exchange fees.

[Amph]

Everytime I see a Western Union death thread, it fails to point out that WU has been experiencing record growth and profits over the past few years, so Bitcoin hasn't been making any sort of dent in it.

snip

Western Union share price for 5 years, massively underperforming the S&P 500 (red line).
Note that the drop at the end of oct 2013 coincides exactly with the first Bitcoin BTM at Vancouver which was a huge media event and preceded the $1150 run-up. WU claimed their share price was hit by "cost overhead from increased money transmission regulations" though it suffered in Oct 2012 too (more regulations then as well?)

not to mention that people are still making a comparison between bitcoin and big company that have a long history behind it, they were not born yesterday and skyrocketing overnight

this generation can't udnerstand bitcoin, we need to get rid of the old mentality to embrace bitcoin better

A totally decentralized remittance method, that abstracts away all the complexities of bitcoin would be ideal. I like localbitcoins but it's centralized so if they are down everything is down, plus fees are large for small traders in the developing world, should be a free market of exchange fees.

it will be possible to incorporate in on top of open bazar, therefore it will work as a decentralized market and exchange, the ultimate platform for anything related bitcoin

[Lauda]

that is the point i guess.

maybe BTC lacks adoption and proper options to remit money worldwide at the moment. BUT this has already changed and will change even more in the future.

in the future you will pay 0,xxx % and not 5-15 %
(+ instant transactions with BTC)

@LaudaM

people dont know about BTC, trust is not the problem.
+ we need more infrastructure.

Exactly. There are a lot of people who either do not know about it at all or fail to understand it/see the benefits that it provides. The infrastructure is coming along slowly with all these VC investments that we've had to date. Good job finding that image again, it clearly shows that Bitcoin isn't as tiny as some people think.
I'm guessing that in a few years (4+), the network will be ready to take over everything.

[eerygarden]

it will be possible to incorporate in on top of open bazar, therefore it will work as a decentralized market and exchange, the ultimate platform for anything related bitcoin

I think its a bit of a catch 22. You cant get low rate remittances unless you can go shopping with bitcoin. It seems it is some years away yet. Perhaps when inflation is down to 2%

[Jhacker]

1.5% is decent no?

Not decent at all, especially when you think how many users they have, and how many "1,5%"'s they take...

Aye, but there is no one out there using bitcoin to do anything like 1.5% at present.

I'm doing .5%, just in bitcoin only. If you have to pay 1% on either end to exchange into bitcoin, it's a little bit more, but if you get paid in bitcoins or buy them directly with localbitcoins.com, etc. it's cheaper.

[eerygarden]

1.5% is decent no?

Not decent at all, especially when you think how many users they have, and how many "1,5%"'s they take...

Aye, but there is no one out there using bitcoin to do anything like 1.5% at present.

I'm doing .5%, just in bitcoin only. If you have to pay 1% on either end to exchange into bitcoin, it's a little bit more, but if you get paid in bitcoins or buy them directly with localbitcoins.com, etc. it's cheaper.

Bitcoin only transfers cost a penny. How much business are you doing? Perhaps I am missing something, but isn't your service obsolete?

[glub0x]

About western union, do not forget that they started as a telegraphic company.
They evolved one time, and can probably do it again.
It would be very easy for them to add a "bitcoin transfer" offer

[Falconer]

About western union, do not forget that they started as a telegraphic company.
They evolved one time, and can probably do it again.
It would be very easy for them to add a "bitcoin transfer" offer

Why we need to use western union if we have blockchain in our side? And if they add bitcoin transfer option, what the profit they will get then? I think they can't compete with bitcoin or adopt it.

[gentlemand]

Why we need to use western union if we have blockchain in our side? And if they add bitcoin transfer option, what the profit they will get then? I think they can't compete with bitcoin or adopt it.

People will still need their local currency at the other end for a long time to come. If WU set themselves up as more of a currency conversion business via BTC they could stay relevant whatever develops. They have all the infrastructure set up already. I'm not sure they could give up those big fat fees.

[Slark]

About western union, do not forget that they started as a telegraphic company.
They evolved one time, and can probably do it again.
It would be very easy for them to add a "bitcoin transfer" offer

Western Union could evolve and embrace bitcoin, but then how they are gonna explain high fees of each bitcoin based transaction?
Maybe they would try to capitalize on exchange fee - Fiat->BTC. But then again what would the point of using them if you could send someone BTC and he/she could exchange it directly.

[Daniel91]

I have friends in Africa and Asia and know very well, from personal experience, how difficult is to send money to them.
They usually can't get even simple Visa card for example, or paypal account, and often have problems with losses of electricity and internet access.
Western Union fees are very high, it's true, but in such third world countries this is often only way to send or receive money.
Bitcoin is great solution for them, but before that they have to solve their infrastructure problems, otherwise they will have difficulties to use bitcoin.
WU may also add bitcoin as their additional currency, sooner or later. 

[NewLiberty]

About western union, do not forget that they started as a telegraphic company.
They evolved one time, and can probably do it again.
It would be very easy for them to add a "bitcoin transfer" offer

I've been proposing this to them for years.
They have all the licensing they would need, they could buy an exchange or several with cash on hand, especially one in a jurisdiction that is cracking down on licensing stuff.  They could get some of those very cheaply.

As a company it is afraid to eat its own children, but if they don't, someone else will.  It is just a matter of time and time is not on WU's side.

[Falconer]

People will still need their local currency at the other end for a long time to come. If WU set themselves up as more of a currency conversion business via BTC they could stay relevant whatever develops. They have all the infrastructure set up already. I'm not sure they could give up those big fat fees.

I think most bitcoin user prefer to use blockchain than WU in case for transferring money, no doubt about it. They just depend on non bitcoin user then to survive and compete with blockchain.

I have friends in Africa and Asia and know very well, from personal experience, how difficult is to send money to them.
They usually can't get even simple Visa card for example, or paypal account, and often have problems with losses of electricity and internet access.
Western Union fees are very high, it's true, but in such third world countries this is often only way to send or receive money.
Bitcoin is great solution for them, but before that they have to solve their infrastructure problems, otherwise they will have difficulties to use bitcoin.
WU may also add bitcoin as their additional currency, sooner or later.  

Yeah we almost forget this infrastructure issue, which no internet access then no bitcoin. Maybe its the advantage of using WU than blockchain.

[Mickeyb]

Every time I see a Western Union sign or a commercial, I just smile and think, guys enjoy this time while you still can, because Bitcoin will get you and shut you down!

No seriously, WU is used heavily by the immigrants who are sending money back home to their families etc.. They are essentially being ripped off by the 15+ percent fees, these poor people. Just wait until all these people don't get more familiar with BTC!

[knowhow]

they will be the first company to allow bitcoin as an option on the next years, otherwise they will loose several users as bitcoins gets more interest daily they would close their doors,they must play together otherwise they will loose these war without fight

[Hollingsworth]

The point of this thread is rendered moot when you consider that Western Union is trial testing blockchain technology with various fintech companies including Ripple Labs. Remittance companies will have adopt some form of blockchain technology if they want to compete.

[melody82]

The point of this thread is rendered moot when you consider that Western Union is trial testing blockchain technology with various fintech companies including Ripple Labs. Remittance companies will have adopt some form of blockchain technology if they want to compete.

Interesting, I didnt know that.  Do you have a good article you can link please?

[TrueBeliever]

The point of this thread is rendered moot when you consider that Western Union is trial testing blockchain technology with various fintech companies including Ripple Labs. Remittance companies will have adopt some form of blockchain technology if they want to compete.

exactly.

The blockchain is open source.  it is not unexpected that companies like Western Union leverages blockchain technology to streamline its own operations thereby bringing down its costs.  Cost savings can be passed on as lower prices to customers as the market heats up.

so in the end it is likely to be Blockchain vs Blockchain.  the point is how will Bitcoin fare in this market?

[MicroGuy]

Please, please, please, ...quit drinking Andreas' Koolaid, then sober up and read the fine print! He gets paid generous speaking fees to serve up that sweet beverage.

If this type of legislation (the stuff nobody actually reads, below) continues rolling across America, the only thing getting extinguished is Bitcoin. You do understand that the costs of complying with this type of regulation will handicap bitcoin companies in terms of competing with the Western Unions of the world.

http://www.ncleg.net/Sessions/2015/Bills/House/PDF/H289v1.pdf

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^^^^^^ Notice how the banks are explicitly exempt from every single provision in the bill! ^^^^^^