The IRS Is Encouraging Bitcoin Hoarding

[BitProdigy]

I've watched every public hearing that has ever occurred on bitcoin in the world except for the one that happened in France because there is no translation version available and I can't understand French and don't find it feasible to learn French only to watch their senators ask expert witnesses questions about the new currency.

After watching all of these conversations, it is clear that everyone understands that to tax bitcoin as a commodity or property as the IRS is doing encourages people to hold bitcoin rather than spend it. It is impractical to expect citizens to keep track of the price they bought bitcoin at and calculate capitol gains on every transaction that is ever made with bitcoin. Imagine having to keep track of every coffee, fast good, gas station, grocery store transaction you ever make and calculate capitol gains for the rest of your life for every single transaction you make.

With this tax system in place, it is easier to just hold bitcoin, or convert sums of bitcoin into fiat rather than spend the bitcoin directly. The Australian senate recognized this and recently have announced that they are going to overturn their current taxation directive requiring bitcoin to be taxed as commodity barter as they currently do. They will be taxing bitcoin as a currency instead, and the reason they list as the catalyst was the recognition that taxing bitcoin as a currency will encourage bitcoin use and business in their country giving them economic advantage over all countries who do differently.

Britain currently taxes bitcoin as "private money" as well, which is essentially like regular currency. The US now stands alone with Russia as unfriendly towards bitcoin. While Russia has made bitcoin outright illegal, the US has made bitcoin impractical with it's IRS ruling. This does not hurt bitcoin mind you, it only hurts russia and the us.

The IRS never held public comment or public hearings on their decision and thus are in direct conflict with FinCEN which has ruled bitcoin as currency in the us and a federal judge who ruled bitcoin as currency in the us.

As long as the US maintains the IRS's poor decision, the more opportunity it loses in the bitcoin space, and the further in falls behind.

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[smoothie]

link?

reference?


citation?

[cellard]

I have no idea how people get their bitcoin taxed. Not only is a headache trying to list every single purchase you do @ that particular dollar rate, but it's just insane to remember every trade you ever did specially when most of the exchanges of the past are now buried. Is it even possible to present your bitcoins to the IRS without going insane?

[tyz]

Yeap, a link or a source would be nice, otherwise is sounds just like a claim.

[Miracal]

After all the things happening around, I think that the chances of such an event might be for real. However, as long as you do not have any laid proof, I don't think people will really give a shit though. It might seem like a claim only, and I tried searching for it on google, couldn't find anything interesting as such in terms of this topic, not even other claim posts. So I have doubts, is this just your speculation or what?

[BitProdigy]

After all the things happening around, I think that the chances of such an event might be for real. However, as long as you do not have any laid proof, I don't think people will really give a shit though. It might seem like a claim only, and I tried searching for it on google, couldn't find anything interesting as such in terms of this topic, not even other claim posts. So I have doubts, is this just your speculation or what?

What claim are you referring to? My post was more of an observation than a claim. I can provide sources to back up any of the observations I have made.

[ashour]

Most people are greedy and don't like to give a piece of their cake for nothing. That's why people hoard bitcoin and don't report their coins to financial authorities , they don't want to pay taxes.

[Miracal]

After all the things happening around, I think that the chances of such an event might be for real. However, as long as you do not have any laid proof, I don't think people will really give a shit though. It might seem like a claim only, and I tried searching for it on google, couldn't find anything interesting as such in terms of this topic, not even other claim posts. So I have doubts, is this just your speculation or what?

What claim are you referring to? My post was more of an observation than a claim. I can provide sources to back up any of the observations I have made.

Everybody's asking for reference links and sources for the observation you have made in your above threat, I think it would be nice if you just include a couple links in the description about anything you think needs to be backed with sources. The more news articles people read about bitcoins, the better they understand the concept. So please share your source as well as knowledge

[BitProdigy]

Everybody's asking for reference links and sources for the observation you have made in your above threat, I think it would be nice if you just include a couple links in the description about anything you think needs to be backed with sources. The more news articles people read about bitcoins, the better they understand the concept. So please share your source as well as knowledge

As for the IRS ruling that bitcoin should be taxed as property rather than as currency:
http://www.irs.gov/uac/Newsroom/IRS-Virtual-Currency-Guidance

As for FinCEN ruling that bitcoin should be regulated as a currency:
http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/testimony/html/20131119.html

As for Texas Judge ruling bitcoin is a currency:
http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/bitcoin-currency-federal-judge-says-virtual-cash-real-money-f6C10874611

Public hearings on bitcoin in which senators explicitly acknowledge that taxing bitcoin as commodity or property encourages hoarding and discourages use:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE5cW5K5ziE
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/VirtualCu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgdEwv381Z0
http://www.onlinevideoservice.com/clients/cftc/video.htm?eventid=cftc-20141009&status=archive&format=wmp

As for Austrialia overturning it's taxation policy to tax bitcoin as currency not bartered commodity:
http://www.rt.com/business/311572-australia-bitcoin-ruling-currency/


If you watch the senate hearings on bitcoin in Australia you will see why they have decided to overturn their stance on how to tax bitcoin, i find these hearings, especially the Australian senate ones, actually quite entertaining:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE5cW5K5ziE

[Swordsoffreedom]

Everybody's asking for reference links and sources for the observation you have made in your above threat, I think it would be nice if you just include a couple links in the description about anything you think needs to be backed with sources. The more news articles people read about bitcoins, the better they understand the concept. So please share your source as well as knowledge

As for the IRS ruling that bitcoin should be taxed as property rather than as currency:
http://www.irs.gov/uac/Newsroom/IRS-Virtual-Currency-Guidance

As for FinCEN ruling that bitcoin should be regulated as a currency:
http://www.fincen.gov/news_room/testimony/html/20131119.html

As for Texas Judge ruling bitcoin is a currency:
http://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/bitcoin-currency-federal-judge-says-virtual-cash-real-money-f6C10874611

Public hearings on bitcoin in which senators explicitly acknowledge that taxing bitcoin as commodity or property encourages hoarding and discourages use:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE5cW5K5ziE
http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/VirtualCu
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgdEwv381Z0
http://www.onlinevideoservice.com/clients/cftc/video.htm?eventid=cftc-20141009&status=archive&format=wmp

As for Austrialia overturning it's taxation policy to tax bitcoin as currency not bartered commodity:
http://www.rt.com/business/311572-australia-bitcoin-ruling-currency/


If you watch the senate hearings on bitcoin in Australia you will see why they have decided to overturn their stance on how to tax bitcoin, i find these hearings, especially the Australian senate ones, actually quite entertaining:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oE5cW5K5ziE

Not a bad list at all looking at it seen a few of them myself particularly on C-Span
Adding one from the Canadian Senate Series to make it a bit more comprehensive there are a few others from the senate but I forgot where they are located.
Bitaccess Cavirtex
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-aBJm9SerE
Andreas
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUNGFZDO8mM

June report on Bitcoin Canadian Senate committee
http://www.parl.gc.ca/Content/SEN/Committee/412/banc/rep/rep12jun15-e.pdf

[eerygarden]

Lots of good stuff there. Thank you to the two posters above me.

[BillyBobZorton]

Most people are greedy and don't like to give a piece of their cake for nothing. That's why people hoard bitcoin and don't report their coins to financial authorities , they don't want to pay taxes.

Even if you wanted to pay taxes and be a law abiding citizen it's pretty much impossible to do it because it's too difficult to tax Bitcoin, im sure im not the only here that literally has no idea how to tax BTC has bought and converted to other alts so many times that it's just chaotic to try to keep track of everything.

[Mikestang]

After all the things happening around, I think that the chances of such an event might be for real. However, as long as you do not have any laid proof, I don't think people will really give a shit though. It might seem like a claim only, and I tried searching for it on google, couldn't find anything interesting as such in terms of this topic, not even other claim posts. So I have doubts, is this just your speculation or what?

What claim are you referring to? My post was more of an observation than a claim. I can provide sources to back up any of the observations I have made.

Rather than saying you can provide sources, why don't you just provide them the sources they're after?

[BitProdigy]

Rather than saying you can provide sources, why don't you just provide them the sources they're after?

I can't very well provide them the sources they are after if I don't know what sources they are after now can I? Thus the question. But in case you missed it if you would have scrolled a few posts down you would have seen that I provided sources for everything.

[MasterYii]

why would the IRS encourage bitcoin hoarding... since bitcoin itself is a off-short mechanism..

wouldnt they want money from any source.. theres no way to get taxed money from bitcoin though unless people report it on their income tax form lol.

[Beefcake]

why would the IRS encourage bitcoin hoarding... since bitcoin itself is a off-short mechanism..

wouldnt they want money from any source.. theres no way to get taxed money from bitcoin though unless people report it on their income tax form lol.

OK what you guys are missing here, is that the usa government is an appendage of goldman sachs.  New thesis, GO!

[Miss Fortune]

how would one even report this on their tax form?

oh yeah I own "22 btc" now tax me fairly?  I doubt people would come forward about how much they have..