2012-10-01 wired.com - 3-D Printer Company Seizes Machine From Desktop Gunsmith

[julz]

Single Bitcoin mention.

3-D Printer Company Seizes Machine From Desktop Gunsmith


Robert Beckhusen
2012-10-10

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2012/10/3d-gun-blocked/

...
Initial attempts at raising $20,000 through crowdsourcing website Indiegogo was stymied after the company pulled the fundraiser. Indiegogo cited company policy regarding fundraisers for the sale of firearms. The group managed to raise $2,000 before Indiegogo pulled the fundraiser. Wilson and the Wiki Weapons team — which includes developers across the United States and Europe — eventually raised the full amount using the Bitcoin electronic currency.
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[TraderTimm]

I bet this is an 'aha!' moment for other people who would like to raise funds for projects that aren't politically correct. Love how bitcoin routes around obstacles.

[kokojie]

Why the fuck they are printing a one time use plastic gun, when metal 3D printing is readily available?

[LoupGaroux]

And why make it a one-timer? Polymer frames are a reality today.

[Foxpup]

And why make it a one-timer? Polymer frames are a reality today.

Polymer frames are easy. Designing polymer barrels that don't instantly disintegrate from the combination of heat, pressure, and friction is a slightly harder engineering challenge.

[kokojie]

And why make it a one-timer? Polymer frames are a reality today.

um the problem would be the barrel, polymer framed guns still use metal barrel.

[casascius]

The word "seizes" seems a little hyped up: the company simply exercised an option it apparently gave itself in a lease to discontinue the lease, and then repossessed it.  Sort of more like evicting a tenant from your own property, rather than evicting a homeowner from theirs and moving in.

Perhaps they could just find a way to buy the printer, and then nobody would have the right to repossess it.  Or else, someone else could buy it and lease it to them.

[dissipate]

These guys seriously think they can meander their way through the regulatory landscape? It's obvious that as soon as they piss off the BATF for whatever reason, they will go to jail on some charge. I'm sure there are plenty of regulations to nail them on. They are in a legal grey area alright. That legal gray area is going to get them 4 gray walls and some bars pretty soon.

They should have set up their site behind TOR and they should not have revealed their identities.

[ArticMine]

The word "seizes" seems a little hyped up: the company simply exercised an option it apparently gave itself in a lease to discontinue the lease, and then repossessed it.  Sort of more like evicting a tenant from your own property, rather than evicting a homeowner from theirs and moving in.

Perhaps they could just find a way to buy the printer, and then nobody would have the right to repossess it.  Or else, someone else could buy it and lease it to them.

The company had every right to cancel the lease and take the printer. Now if the printer is sold and the drivers, software and operating system are Free Software / Open Source then these kind "seizures" cannot happen. If the printer is sold but either the drivers, software or operating system is propriety then one of the copyright holders could also prevent the printer from being used for a purpose not authorized by their EULA.

So to be safe buy the printer, and use it with Free Software / Open Source drivers and software on GNU/Linux.

[casascius]

I am curious why, in a nutshell, someone would want to 3D-print a relatively poor quality gun.  Where in the world does this make the most sense?

Here in Utah, I can buy all of the high quality guns I want just going to a retail store.  If I wanted to fill a shopping cart with big guns, the people selling them would be enthusiastic to let me.  I'd undergo a background check, but that would be no problem, and then the only thing standing between me and a giant arsenal is just the lack of desire to acquire one.  So for me, since big high quality manufactured guns are just a shopping trip away, a 3D-printed gun wouldn't make sense.

Meanwhile, I value the fact that those convicted of violent felonies and those with certified mental illnesses can't do the same.  Many of these people really are unpredictable and dangerous when armed, keeping guns out of their hands serves a relatively undisputed purpose, and I am not convinced of the value of creating an open-source weapon solution that would circumvent this control and arm this group of people.  Even the most rabid gun freaks aren't asking for this.  Can someone give me the tl;dr on why they believe this would be a good idea in the interest of society?

[ArticMine]

I am curious why, in a nutshell, someone would want to 3D-print a relatively poor quality gun.  Where in the world does this make the most sense?

Here in Utah, I can buy all of the high quality guns I want just going to a retail store.  If I wanted to fill a shopping cart with big guns, the people selling them would be enthusiastic to let me.  I'd undergo a background check, but that would be no problem, and then the only thing standing between me and a giant arsenal is just the lack of desire to acquire one.  So for me, since big high quality manufactured guns are just a shopping trip away, a 3D-printed gun wouldn't make sense.

Meanwhile, I value the fact that those convicted of violent felonies and those with certified mental illnesses can't do the same.  Many of these people really are unpredictable and dangerous when armed, keeping guns out of their hands serves a relatively undisputed purpose, and I am not convinced of the value of creating an open-source weapon solution that would circumvent this control and arm this group of people.  Even the most rabid gun freaks aren't asking for this.  Can someone give me the tl;dr on why they believe this would be a good idea in the interest of society?

Because there are many parts of the world where otherwise law abiding citizens cannot easily obtain guns. Now if one considers having law abiding citizens armed as a way to keep the government honest and democratic then this does make sense.

[Richy_T]

But guns would be better created with relatively cheap machine tools.

Of course, the assumption is that 3D printing will become ubiquitous.

[Richy_T]

I'm sure there are plenty of regulations to nail them on.

Or they could just turn up and shoot em dead. Then a year later botch a raid on a church to distract media attention.

[casascius]

Another thing from a different angle:

I remember at 13 years old being able to put together a contraption that could shoot popcorn seed bullets.  It would fire the popcorn seed fast enough to penetrate a row of aluminum cans (with entrance and exit holes in each can), and used small firecrackers as propellant, so clearly the concept was functional.  This was nothing more than a simple capped pipe with a tiny hole where the firecracker fuse could exit so it could be lit and the cap unscrewable so it could be reloaded.  Other than clearly being more dangerous, firing metal bullets out of it wouldn't have been much of a stretch, especially if the ignition system were reduced to something electrical instead of mechanical as in a gun. (example: black powder with a spark gap or heating element).

Why go to the hassle of designing a one-shot gun that requires investment in a 3d-printer when it's possible to just as easily design a similar gun with probably less than $100 in home improvement supplies?

[kokojie]

Another thing from a different angle:

I remember at 13 years old being able to put together a contraption that could shoot popcorn seed bullets.  It would fire the popcorn seed fast enough to penetrate a row of aluminum cans (with entrance and exit holes in each can), and used small firecrackers as propellant, so clearly the concept was functional.  This was nothing more than a simple capped pipe with a tiny hole where the firecracker fuse could exit so it could be lit and the cap unscrewable so it could be reloaded.  Other than clearly being more dangerous, firing metal bullets out of it wouldn't have been much of a stretch, especially if the ignition system were reduced to something electrical instead of mechanical as in a gun. (example: black powder with a spark gap or heating element).

Why go to the hassle of designing a one-shot gun that requires investment in a 3d-printer when it's possible to just as easily design a similar gun with probably less than $100 in home improvement supplies?

Yep, one shot gun can easily be created without special equipment, might even survive multiple uses too, but it still require certain amount of skill. 3D printing is definitely easier if you already have the equipment.