The Real Problem isn't XT...

[BTC_ISTANBUL]

Why don't they leave it as it is?Or they can ask members to vote for or against.

"Bitcoin XT" vs "1MB for ever"

[BrianM]

Satoshi almost certainly died a few years ago.

This is blasphemy 

I don't belive hour great leader is dead... no I WON'T belive our great leader is dead
He is still there watching us. I think he will step in if bitcoin will get in real danger.

For now is everthing ok. We have nothing to worry about the XT will slowly fade away and die.

[RawDog]

Sorry to hurt your beliefs, but I don't think Satoshi is THE expert anymore on Bitcoin.

Bitcoin has grown since he left, being it the code base or the adoption. I am also sure, that is what he wanted, when he left.

Sorry to hurt your beliefs, but I don't believe that.

Who holds the belief that Satoshi is THE expert?  Not me.  I am just saying I'd trust his tie break vote more than a coin toss.  ...or Mike's hard fork.  

Look, here is the deal.  We don't have a conflict resolution scheme.  When we set down the path to resolve an impasse - we are forced to do a hard fork.  Oh fuck.  That is not good.  For now, I'd let a signed message from Satoshi decide.  Then, start working on a new voting system which would let impasses get settled without walking near the cliff that hard forks are.  

If you want Satoshi to decide, means you hold his word over every other. In my book, that means you think, that he is THE expert, regardless of if you want it just for this conflict.
It also seems to me, that you don't know, what a hardfork is. There already where hard forks. There even was a hard fork about a month ago: BIP 66, which let to some problems

I know what a hard fork is you plonker - and I am about to stick one in your fucking eye.  This XT thing very likely could lead to a hard fork.  Some hard forks just happen no big deal.  This one is a big deal because it is intentional and done with the purpose of shutting out the guys on the other side of the argument.  That is a big fucking deal. 

[NorrisK]

Satoshi almost certainly died a few years ago.

This is blasphemy 

I don't belive hour great leader is dead... no I WON'T belive our great leader is dead
He is still there watching us. I think he will step in if bitcoin will get in real danger.

For now is everthing ok. We have nothing to worry about the XT will slowly fade away and die.

How can you call him our great leader? He has stepped down and it is time you accept that truth.. His voice is now like yours or mine..

[meono]

...
Regardless, I really don't understand why people care what he would think anyhow.

He is the only person that when voicing his opinion in this matter, could actually be considered unbiased,
since he was the creator and in theory would make the best choice for Bitcoin/bitcoin, and not for himself.

His decision in this matter, if 100% verified to be him, would end the debate immediately, IMO.

But, as I have said many times, I believe he is no longer living as well.

Stupid, Satoshi does not give bitcoin value. Ppl utilize it gives it value . in other words if the economic majority of bitcoin has to take words of an authoritive figure they should drop bitcoin and go back to fiat.

Shocking that so less ppl on this forum actilually understand the fundamental bitcoin.

[AgentofCoin]

...
Regardless, I really don't understand why people care what he would think anyhow.

He is the only person that when voicing his opinion in this matter, could actually be considered unbiased,
since he was the creator and in theory would make the best choice for Bitcoin/bitcoin, and not for himself.

His decision in this matter, if 100% verified to be him, would end the debate immediately, IMO.

But, as I have said many times, I believe he is no longer living as well.

Stupid, Satoshi does not give bitcoin value. Ppl utilize it gives it value . in other words if the economic majority of bitcoin has to take words of an authoritive figure they should drop bitcoin and go back to fiat.

Shocking that so less ppl on this forum actilually understand the fundamental bitcoin.

Stupid, did I say Satoshi gave bitcoin its value? I didn't say anything, that you are saying I said.
Are you drunk or just a troll? Maybe you are a bot.
Shocking that so many people talk in txt speak or spell incorrectly as common practice, on this forum.

[Envrin]

XT already lost.  The three largest mining pools in China, who own 30% of the hash rate, have already publicly said they're not willing to switch to XT.

Good.  Thank F that's over.

Average block is only around 500kb right now, so there's still loads of time to come to a solution and consensus regarding blocksize before we reach the 1MB limit.

[DGulari]

XT already lost.  The three largest mining pools in China, who own 30% of the hash rate, have already publicly said they're not willing to switch to XT.

Good.  Thank F that's over.

Average block is only around 500kb right now, so there's still loads of time to come to a solution and consensus regarding blocksize before we reach the 1MB limit.

XT will take 75% in about two weeks.  You'll see.

[Hazir]

XT already lost.  The three largest mining pools in China, who own 30% of the hash rate, have already publicly said they're not willing to switch to XT.

Good.  Thank F that's over.

Average block is only around 500kb right now, so there's still loads of time to come to a solution and consensus regarding blocksize before we reach the 1MB limit.

XT will take 75% in about two weeks.  You'll see.

I doubt it. They don't have significant number of notes to force it, they may be in control of 10% notes or something like that. And I think miners won't join XT. In the future maybe, not now.

[Envrin]

XT already lost.  The three largest mining pools in China, who own 30% of the hash rate, have already publicly said they're not willing to switch to XT.

Good.  Thank F that's over.

Average block is only around 500kb right now, so there's still loads of time to come to a solution and consensus regarding blocksize before we reach the 1MB limit.

XT will take 75% in about two weeks.  You'll see.

So I'm back to fiat then?  Get F'd if you think I'm using HearnCoin.  He can take his blacklists, and shove them.

[johnyj]

Satoshi almost certainly died a few years ago.

This is blasphemy 

I don't belive hour great leader is dead... no I WON'T belive our great leader is dead
He is still there watching us. I think he will step in if bitcoin will get in real danger.

For now is everthing ok. We have nothing to worry about the XT will slowly fade away and die.

It does not matter who invented fire, as soon as the technology is found, it is irrelevant what the inventor want for its future. Nobel invented dynamite but he can't stop people from using his technology to kill each other 

[Amph]

XT already lost.  The three largest mining pools in China, who own 30% of the hash rate, have already publicly said they're not willing to switch to XT.

Good.  Thank F that's over.

Average block is only around 500kb right now, so there's still loads of time to come to a solution and consensus regarding blocksize before we reach the 1MB limit.

i remember that they said they are not against the 8mb change, so they are waiting that the change is incorporated in core or something?

or like everyone else they are waiting for this magical alternative...

[BTC_ISTANBUL]

Bitmain has announced a new product, a new router, R1.I think it is related with BitcoinXT.What do you think?
I also wonder how do we know the three big BTC mine farms attitude.Do they have an announcement or any thread in any forum?Is there any proof that they do not support.If there is no proof members must write I believe/think otherwise there will be infollution.

[Kprawn]

This is the kicker... We have two guys, who had some influence and it was given away to the new lead developer. Now they want it back... It's nice to have a little power.

The only way for them to have that power again, would be to take it from the people with a hostile take over. {Hard fork - BitcoinXT} Then they will have their own little kingdom to run as they see fit.

The controversial answer to this problem :
Create a global Bitcoin developer group, represented by the most talented Bitcoin engineers and get them together to vote on these issues. {Yes it is a centralized group, but it's better than the chaotic situation we

have now... where nobody makes a discision and others wants to make the decisions, and when they get frustrated, they want to go on their own crusade against Bitcoin.

It's not the ideal solution, but it's much better than what we have now. {consensus my ass}

[iCEBREAKER]

The real problem isn't XT.  The real problem is that there is no good means to break a serious impasse. 

There is no "serious impasse."  Bitcoin has just started working more like it was designed to, with RBF and (fledgling) fee pressure/markets.

If there were a "serious impasse" (such that competitive fees no longer properly prioritized their tx, thus endangering the present and future value of BTC), the economic consensus would quickly coalesce around a solution.

If you want to know what Satoshi thinks, look here: https://twitter.com/NickSzabo4.

[monsanto]

Why don't they leave it as it is?Or they can ask members to vote for or against.

"Bitcoin XT" vs "1MB for ever"

Don't worry, soon it will be easy to make Ethereum contracts to vote on this sort of thing 

[Envrin]

XT already lost.  The three largest mining pools in China, who own 30% of the hash rate, have already publicly said they're not willing to switch to XT.

Good.  Thank F that's over.

Average block is only around 500kb right now, so there's still loads of time to come to a solution and consensus regarding blocksize before we reach the 1MB limit.

i remember that they said they are not against the 8mb change, so they are waiting that the change is incorporated in core or something?

or like everyone else they are waiting for this magical alternative...

Yeah, to my understanding, absolutely everyone agrees that blocksize will need to increase in the future.  The mining pools in China have simply stated they want consensus amongst the core developers, not Mike and Gavin to try forcing a hard fork down everyone's throats, like they're doing.

Bitcoin is still a long ways off from having any type of issues due to the 1MB blocksize limit, so there's still loads of time to reach a consensus, and roll out a proper hard fork.  Mike and Gavin though and hyping this issue to make it seem like we're in panic times and need to act urgently, which just isn't true.  The bitcoin network will continue humming along just fine with the 1MB blocksize limit for a good while to come yet.

[turvarya]

Sorry to hurt your beliefs, but I don't think Satoshi is THE expert anymore on Bitcoin.

Bitcoin has grown since he left, being it the code base or the adoption. I am also sure, that is what he wanted, when he left.

Sorry to hurt your beliefs, but I don't believe that.

Who holds the belief that Satoshi is THE expert?  Not me.  I am just saying I'd trust his tie break vote more than a coin toss.  ...or Mike's hard fork.  

Look, here is the deal.  We don't have a conflict resolution scheme.  When we set down the path to resolve an impasse - we are forced to do a hard fork.  Oh fuck.  That is not good.  For now, I'd let a signed message from Satoshi decide.  Then, start working on a new voting system which would let impasses get settled without walking near the cliff that hard forks are.  

If you want Satoshi to decide, means you hold his word over every other. In my book, that means you think, that he is THE expert, regardless of if you want it just for this conflict.
It also seems to me, that you don't know, what a hardfork is. There already where hard forks. There even was a hard fork about a month ago: BIP 66, which let to some problems

I know what a hard fork is you plonker - and I am about to stick one in your fucking eye.  This XT thing very likely could lead to a hard fork.  Some hard forks just happen no big deal.  This one is a big deal because it is intentional and done with the purpose of shutting out the guys on the other side of the argument.  That is a big fucking deal. 

No, you don't know, what a hardfork is. The other hardforks, where also intentional. You should read up here: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Hardfork

XT already lost.  The three largest mining pools in China, who own 30% of the hash rate, have already publicly said they're not willing to switch to XT.

Good.  Thank F that's over.

Average block is only around 500kb right now, so there's still loads of time to come to a solution and consensus regarding blocksize before we reach the 1MB limit.

i remember that they said they are not against the 8mb change, so they are waiting that the change is incorporated in core or something?

or like everyone else they are waiting for this magical alternative...

Yeah, to my understanding, absolutely everyone agrees that blocksize will need to increase in the future.  The mining pools in China have simply stated they want consensus amongst the core developers, not Mike and Gavin to try forcing a hard fork down everyone's throats, like they're doing.

Bitcoin is still a long ways off from having any type of issues due to the 1MB blocksize limit, so there's still loads of time to reach a consensus, and roll out a proper hard fork.  Mike and Gavin though and hyping this issue to make it seem like we're in panic times and need to act urgently, which just isn't true.  The bitcoin network will continue humming along just fine with the 1MB blocksize limit for a good while to come yet.

That is not true.
There are people who think, that the blockchain is an exclusive club and the dirty peasants should use centralized solution(I read exactly that many times on this forum, ok, without the "dirty peasants")
Here is a survey that shows, that even two well-known Bitcoin developer are against any increase: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1144606.0

[irfan01]

what it XT ??
whether it be very influential in bitcoin ??

[S4VV4S]

...
Regardless, I really don't understand why people care what he would think anyhow.

He is the only person that when voicing his opinion in this matter, could actually be considered unbiased,
since he was the creator and in theory would make the best choice for Bitcoin/bitcoin, and not for himself.

His decision in this matter, if 100% verified to be him, would end the debate immediately, IMO.

But, as I have said many times, I believe he is no longer living as well.

One man should never have that much power.

Satoshi comes off as a brilliant man, women or group.  They will never return, their opinion is now regarded as gods opinion.. such power is bad.

Satoshi created bitcoin for the people, Satoshi can no longer be involved, Bitcoin cannot have one person/group that decides it's future.

Unfortunately, it seems that it does.

And this whole thing is just childish, and the attitude coming from the developers (both sides) is hurting Bitcoin.
If they cannot come to an agreement about something like this, what will happen when something truly serious comes up?

Well done, we have proven to all enemies of Bitcoin that Bitcoin will be destroyed from the inside.
No need for them to bother.