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Author Topic: is Greg Maxwell wrong about the block increase?  (Read 4079 times)
hdbuck
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August 31, 2015, 08:41:23 PM
 #41

Being proactive > being reactive IMO.

Waiting for people's transactions being jeopardize before taking action is pretty irresponsible.





maxwell makes perfect sense.

anyway, go on to your infinite bloatchain... the sooner the better Tongue

Another post with no substance?


hey dont delete my pic, in it lies all the substance you'd ever make anyway.

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August 31, 2015, 08:42:52 PM
 #42


Because big boys are asking so and won't wait any longer for obvious reasons. The limit also limit these companies to mass marketeer their products.

http://blog.blockchain.com/2015/08/24/industry-endorses-bigger-blocks-and-bip101/

The right thing to do would be to not cave into their selfish demands.

They clearly have only their own pockets in mind.

Well, bitcoin is money. What do you expect? You expect these companies that have invested millions to run at a loss without making profits forever? You expect them to loose their investment without doing anything because bitcoin doesn't scale ?

These companies were sold by Gavin & Mike the idea that "bitcoin doesn't scale" and that their business will suffer because of it. They are somehow under the impression that current block size impedes their growth and is a danger to the future growth they themselves sold to their investors.

Growth projection is a very tricky thing but if we are to believe the current trend we are still quite below the current limit and should stay so for awhile. There was no reasonable basis for those so-called industry "leaders" to precipitate the issue and stand behind one "solution" when it was clear the model had considerable opposition from various actors in the ecosystem. Especially seeing as the Scaling Bitcoin workshops had shown encouraging signs that a legitimate resolution process was starting to take place that could hopefully reconcile everyone and re-establish consensus.

This is simply a hack job of lobbying by the XT developers to force the issue by pulling strings using their industry influence.



Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

hdbuck
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August 31, 2015, 08:45:00 PM
 #43


Because big boys are asking so and won't wait any longer for obvious reasons. The limit also limit these companies to mass marketeer their products.

http://blog.blockchain.com/2015/08/24/industry-endorses-bigger-blocks-and-bip101/

The right thing to do would be to not cave into their selfish demands.

They clearly have only their own pockets in mind.

Well, bitcoin is money. What do you expect? You expect these companies that have invested millions to run at a loss without making profits forever? You expect them to loose their investment without doing anything because bitcoin doesn't scale ?

These companies were sold by Gavin & Mike the idea that "bitcoin doesn't scale" and that their business will suffer because of it. They are somehow under the impression that current block size impedes their growth and is a danger to the future growth they themselves sold to their investors.

Growth projection is a very tricky thing but if we are to believe the current trend we are still quite below the current limit and should stay so for awhile. There was no reasonable basis for those so-called industry "leaders" to precipitate the issue and stand behind one "solution" when it was clear the model had considerable opposition from various actors in the ecosystem. Especially seeing as the Scaling Bitcoin workshops had shown encouraging signs that a legitimate resolution process was starting to take place that could hopefully reconcile everyone and re-establish consensus.

This is simply a hack job of lobbying by the XT developers to force the issue by pulling strings using their industry influence.



Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

yea, our money. not them parasites VCs straight from the printers BS money.

decentralized consensus: not gonna happen. Cheesy

knight22
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August 31, 2015, 08:47:35 PM
 #44


Because big boys are asking so and won't wait any longer for obvious reasons. The limit also limit these companies to mass marketeer their products.

http://blog.blockchain.com/2015/08/24/industry-endorses-bigger-blocks-and-bip101/

The right thing to do would be to not cave into their selfish demands.

They clearly have only their own pockets in mind.

Well, bitcoin is money. What do you expect? You expect these companies that have invested millions to run at a loss without making profits forever? You expect them to loose their investment without doing anything because bitcoin doesn't scale ?

These companies were sold by Gavin & Mike the idea that "bitcoin doesn't scale" and that their business will suffer because of it. They are somehow under the impression that current block size impedes their growth and is a danger to the future growth they themselves sold to their investors.

Growth projection is a very tricky thing but if we are to believe the current trend we are still quite below the current limit and should stay so for awhile. There was no reasonable basis for those so-called industry "leaders" to precipitate the issue and stand behind one "solution" when it was clear the model had considerable opposition from various actors in the ecosystem. Especially seeing as the Scaling Bitcoin workshops had shown encouraging signs that a legitimate resolution process was starting to take place that could hopefully reconcile everyone and re-establish consensus.

This is simply a hack job of lobbying by the XT developers to force the issue by pulling strings using their industry influence.



Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

yea, our money. not them parasites VCs straight from the printers BS money.

decentralized consensus: not gonna happen. Cheesy

You can laugh all you want but it won't change the fact that these company with their BS money have more influence than you and me. You'd better accept this sooner than later.  Bitcoin is not more your money than their money. 

hdbuck
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August 31, 2015, 08:48:09 PM
 #45


Because big boys are asking so and won't wait any longer for obvious reasons. The limit also limit these companies to mass marketeer their products.

http://blog.blockchain.com/2015/08/24/industry-endorses-bigger-blocks-and-bip101/

The right thing to do would be to not cave into their selfish demands.

They clearly have only their own pockets in mind.

Well, bitcoin is money. What do you expect? You expect these companies that have invested millions to run at a loss without making profits forever? You expect them to loose their investment without doing anything because bitcoin doesn't scale ?

These companies were sold by Gavin & Mike the idea that "bitcoin doesn't scale" and that their business will suffer because of it. They are somehow under the impression that current block size impedes their growth and is a danger to the future growth they themselves sold to their investors.

Growth projection is a very tricky thing but if we are to believe the current trend we are still quite below the current limit and should stay so for awhile. There was no reasonable basis for those so-called industry "leaders" to precipitate the issue and stand behind one "solution" when it was clear the model had considerable opposition from various actors in the ecosystem. Especially seeing as the Scaling Bitcoin workshops had shown encouraging signs that a legitimate resolution process was starting to take place that could hopefully reconcile everyone and re-establish consensus.

This is simply a hack job of lobbying by the XT developers to force the issue by pulling strings using their industry influence.



Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

yea, our money. not them parasites VCs straight from the printers BS money.

decentralized consensus: not gonna happen. Cheesy

You can laugh all you want but it won't change the fact that these company with their BS money have more influence than you and me. You'd better accept this sooner than later.

lol never..

nutildah
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August 31, 2015, 08:48:35 PM
 #46


Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

Because money talks far too much is the reason why bitcoin has any value today.

knight22
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August 31, 2015, 08:51:48 PM
 #47


Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

Because money talks far too much is the reason why bitcoin has any value today.

Money will always talk because of human nature, bitcoin will be no different in this aspect. Bitcoin has value today because it is sound money.

hdbuck
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August 31, 2015, 08:54:35 PM
 #48


Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

Because money talks far too much is the reason why bitcoin has any value today.

Money will always talk because of human nature, bitcoin will be no different in this aspect. Bitcoin has value today because it is sound money.

bitcoin has value today because no business, dev or whatever government has its hands on it. and they never will.
you're too late, train is gone.

Bitcoin is ours. Cool



nutildah
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August 31, 2015, 08:55:48 PM
 #49


Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

Because money talks far too much is the reason why bitcoin has any value today.

Money will always talk because of human nature, bitcoin will be no different in this aspect. Bitcoin has value today because it is sound money.

Wrong. Bitcoin has value today because useless, greed-driven middlemen haven't figured out a way to corrupt it and get their cut from it yet.

knight22
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August 31, 2015, 08:59:53 PM
 #50


Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

Because money talks far too much is the reason why bitcoin has any value today.

Money will always talk because of human nature, bitcoin will be no different in this aspect. Bitcoin has value today because it is sound money.

Wrong. Bitcoin has value today because useless, greed-driven middlemen haven't figured out a way to corrupt it and get their cut from it yet.

I agree but bitcoin can't be corrupted the way fiat as been corrupted. These companies want to make a profit using this sound money and bringing it to the mainstream. There is nothing wrong with that.

brg444
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Bitcoin replaces central, not commercial, banks


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August 31, 2015, 09:01:24 PM
 #51


Because big boys are asking so and won't wait any longer for obvious reasons. The limit also limit these companies to mass marketeer their products.

http://blog.blockchain.com/2015/08/24/industry-endorses-bigger-blocks-and-bip101/

The right thing to do would be to not cave into their selfish demands.

They clearly have only their own pockets in mind.

Well, bitcoin is money. What do you expect? You expect these companies that have invested millions to run at a loss without making profits forever? You expect them to loose their investment without doing anything because bitcoin doesn't scale ?

These companies were sold by Gavin & Mike the idea that "bitcoin doesn't scale" and that their business will suffer because of it. They are somehow under the impression that current block size impedes their growth and is a danger to the future growth they themselves sold to their investors.

Growth projection is a very tricky thing but if we are to believe the current trend we are still quite below the current limit and should stay so for awhile. There was no reasonable basis for those so-called industry "leaders" to precipitate the issue and stand behind one "solution" when it was clear the model had considerable opposition from various actors in the ecosystem. Especially seeing as the Scaling Bitcoin workshops had shown encouraging signs that a legitimate resolution process was starting to take place that could hopefully reconcile everyone and re-establish consensus.

This is simply a hack job of lobbying by the XT developers to force the issue by pulling strings using their industry influence.



Yup but the cold reality is that at the end of the day, money talks.

yea, our money. not them parasites VCs straight from the printers BS money.

decentralized consensus: not gonna happen. Cheesy

You can laugh all you want but it won't change the fact that these company with their BS money have more influence than you and me. You'd better accept this sooner than later.  Bitcoin is not more your money than their money. 

How can you be so oblivious in the face of reality?

BIP101 as implemented and supported by these companies is never going to see the light of the day. Miners are openly against such an increase. These company have been ridiculed in the span of only a week for supporting an openly dismissed proposal all because of Gavin.

It's a sad sad sight that all these "entrepreneurs" and VC can't think for themselves.

"I believe this will be the ultimate fate of Bitcoin, to be the "high-powered money" that serves as a reserve currency for banks that issue their own digital cash." Hal Finney, Dec. 2010
knight22
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August 31, 2015, 09:04:08 PM
 #52

You can laugh all you want but it won't change the fact that these company with their BS money have more influence than you and me. You'd better accept this sooner than later.  Bitcoin is not more your money than their money. 

How can you be so oblivious in the face of reality?

BIP101 as implemented and supported by these companies is never going to see the light of the day. Miners are openly against such an increase. These company have been ridiculed in the span of only a week for supporting an openly dismissed proposal all because of Gavin.

It's a sad sad sight that all these "entrepreneurs" and VC can't think for themselves.

Miners have no choice to follow the market makers unless they want to mine a worthless coin. You are delusional if you think otherwise.

jonald_fyookball
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Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political


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August 31, 2015, 09:04:40 PM
 #53

We have at least 2 more years before the block size limit actually starts mattering on a significant scale:

https://blockchain.info/charts/avg-block-size?timespan=all&showDataPoints=false&daysAverageString=1

The moving average for this years block size has been about 0.4 - 0.44 MBs.

So Gavin couldn't negotiate with the core devs any longer and had to get his coin out ASAP because... why?

The fact that he is backed by a throng of finance industry CEOs diminishes merit from his arguments. We don't care what the already-rich think. Bitcoin isn't for them.

Because a year ago, the  average was about half of what it is today and therefore we will be out of space in a other year, never mind spikes, never mind unforeseen factors, never mind the time it takes to get consensus and do a rollout.

nutildah
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August 31, 2015, 09:05:11 PM
 #54



I agree but bitcoin can't be corrupted the way fiat as been corrupted.

Sure it can. If you live in New York state, it has already been corrupted.

These companies want to make a profit using this sound money and bringing it to the mainstream. There is nothing wrong with that.

We don't need them. Nobody does. We need more altruists and evangelists leading the charge -- people who don't lead profit-driven lives. We already have waaaaay too many of those, which is what allows things like the stock market crash of 2008 to happen. Nobody except for you, Mike & Gavin wants them in bitcoin.

hdbuck
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August 31, 2015, 09:05:50 PM
 #55

You can laugh all you want but it won't change the fact that these company with their BS money have more influence than you and me. You'd better accept this sooner than later.  Bitcoin is not more your money than their money.  

How can you be so oblivious in the face of reality?

BIP101 as implemented and supported by these companies is never going to see the light of the day. Miners are openly against such an increase. These company have been ridiculed in the span of only a week for supporting an openly dismissed proposal all because of Gavin.

It's a sad sad sight that all these "entrepreneurs" and VC can't think for themselves.

Miners have no choice to follow the market makers unless they want to mine a worthless coin. You are delusional if you think otherwise.

Bitcoin holders are the market makers. not the miners, not the companies, not the devs, and certainly not the masses.
nutildah
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August 31, 2015, 09:06:09 PM
 #56


Because a year ago, the  average was about half of what it is today and therefore we will be out of space in a other year, never mind spikes, never mind unforeseen factors, never mind the time it takes to get consensus and do a rollout.

Okay. The average block size is still less than half of the limit. So why couldn't Gavin and Mike continue to work within the core community again?

knight22
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August 31, 2015, 09:07:02 PM
 #57

You can laugh all you want but it won't change the fact that these company with their BS money have more influence than you and me. You'd better accept this sooner than later.  Bitcoin is not more your money than their money.  

How can you be so oblivious in the face of reality?

BIP101 as implemented and supported by these companies is never going to see the light of the day. Miners are openly against such an increase. These company have been ridiculed in the span of only a week for supporting an openly dismissed proposal all because of Gavin.

It's a sad sad sight that all these "entrepreneurs" and VC can't think for themselves.

Miners have no choice to follow the market makers unless they want to mine a worthless coin. You are delusional if you think otherwise.

Bitcoin holders are the market makers. not the miners, not the companies, not the devs, and certainly not the masses.

Speculators will go where the market makers are too.

hdbuck
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August 31, 2015, 09:07:44 PM
 #58

You can laugh all you want but it won't change the fact that these company with their BS money have more influence than you and me. You'd better accept this sooner than later.  Bitcoin is not more your money than their money.  

How can you be so oblivious in the face of reality?

BIP101 as implemented and supported by these companies is never going to see the light of the day. Miners are openly against such an increase. These company have been ridiculed in the span of only a week for supporting an openly dismissed proposal all because of Gavin.

It's a sad sad sight that all these "entrepreneurs" and VC can't think for themselves.

Miners have no choice to follow the market makers unless they want to mine a worthless coin. You are delusional if you think otherwise.

Bitcoin holders are the market makers. not the miners, not the companies, not the devs, and certainly not the masses.

Speculators will go where the market makers are too.

speculators are the market's friggin nervous system!!
knight22
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August 31, 2015, 09:08:01 PM
 #59



I agree but bitcoin can't be corrupted the way fiat as been corrupted.

Sure it can. If you live in New York state, it has already been corrupted.

These companies want to make a profit using this sound money and bringing it to the mainstream. There is nothing wrong with that.

We don't need them. Nobody does. We need more altruists and evangelists leading the charge -- people who don't lead profit-driven lives. We already have waaaaay too many of those, which is what allows things like the stock market crash of 2008 to happen. Nobody except for you, Mike & Gavin wants them in bitcoin.

Bitcoin will never change human nature. I will just bring to area of freedom to escape the fiat system.

knight22
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August 31, 2015, 09:08:32 PM
 #60

You can laugh all you want but it won't change the fact that these company with their BS money have more influence than you and me. You'd better accept this sooner than later.  Bitcoin is not more your money than their money.  

How can you be so oblivious in the face of reality?

BIP101 as implemented and supported by these companies is never going to see the light of the day. Miners are openly against such an increase. These company have been ridiculed in the span of only a week for supporting an openly dismissed proposal all because of Gavin.

It's a sad sad sight that all these "entrepreneurs" and VC can't think for themselves.

Miners have no choice to follow the market makers unless they want to mine a worthless coin. You are delusional if you think otherwise.

Bitcoin holders are the market makers. not the miners, not the companies, not the devs, and certainly not the masses.

Speculators will go where the market makers are too.


speculators are the market's friggin nervous system!!

And speculators will follow the big money, to make money...

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