Brainstorming Mining room cooling - Need advice

[coinbeast]

Did you even read my post?

I am not going to keep wasting my time defending myself. I apologize for bringing up such a touchy subject and would now like to bring this thread to a close.

I have thought about the advice about a server rack type setup and think I might either go the dog kennel type box or a vertical type cabinet setup.

I thank everyone for their positive advice and apologize again for the way this thread has gone down. I wish I could explain my circumstances better because I am not "stealing" power, I just don't want to advertise that I am mining bitcoin with it in case someone tells me to stop doing it. The workforce is a bitchy place and people get jealous.

Thanks again all.

[QuintLeo]

The S5 fans specs are: external dimension: 120*120*38mm Weight: 128.5g Qty Bearing: Electrical characteristics Rated voltage: DC12V Rated current: 1.8±10%A Rated input power: 21.6Watt Operating voltage: 7 - 13．8V Efficiency Rated speed (range) 4450±10%RPM Maximum air flow 186.2 CFM Characteristics Operating temperature: -10℃～+70℃ Life expectance: continuous operation 40,000Hrs

 Doesn't quite match up with the observed appx. 4000 RPM on the S5 fans (I run mine with PWM disabled but RPM monitoring enabled, commonly 3960 RPM observed).

 I'm also curious which Delta fan model you're quoting specs from, the fans are definitely Delta as that flow-director design is patented.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

Folks.... Using conventional A/C is right out unless you have free power.
The math:
BTU/hr=Watts x 3.4129
1 Tonne=12,000 BTU/hr

So if your power load is 1kw you are pumping out 3412.9 BTU. That is how much cooling is needed just to balance out the heat from the miners! Throw in bringing the temps to below outside air temp and it gets worse... For most farms you're are talking insane amount of cooling needed.

Plug in your own load for the amount of cooling you need just to break even on the miners heat output.

[Dalkore]

Folks.... Using conventional A/C is right out unless you have free power.
The math:
BTU/hr=Watts x 3.4129
1 Tonne=12,000 BTU/hr

So if your power load is 1kw you are pumping out 3412.9 BTU. That is just to balance out the heat from the miners! Throw in bringing the temps to below outside air temp and it gets worse... For most farms your are talking insane amount of cooling needed.

Plug in your own load for the amount of cooling you need just to break even on the miners heat output.

This is correct, for every Megawatt of power consumption you are looking at about 285 tons of cooling to offset the heat generated.   or 28.5 tons for every 100 Kilowatts.  Not only do you need that much cooling, but you will need serious air movement to get that cool to where it needs to be and the hot away from where it shouldn't be.  This is why we install lots of actual HVAC and not rely on fans, also when you are talking about these massive loads, you can't cut corners here or you will damage miners, make them run slow or create a fire hazard. 

[QuintLeo]

Depends on HOW cheap your electric is, but at a common EER (SEER or CEER) of appx. 13 you would have to spend about 26% of your miner power load on cooling if you use mechanical air conditioning (some central units are well over 20 CEER, but those tend to be expen$ive in their own right).
This cost might be "make or break" on attaining RoI on mining hardware, much less profit.
Do factor in that if you can keep your miners cool enough, you can probably clock them higher and make back a LITTLE of the "lost profits" to A/C power cost, but not likely more than 20-25% of your AC power cost.

 If evaporative cooling aka "swamp cooling" is viable in your area, THAT is a lot less power hungry and you might be able to pay for it with the increase in mining hashrate vs. no cooling.


 Personally, I hate the "tons" rating on AC units. Dunno why we're still stuck with a rating from back when actual ICE was used in cooling stuff instead of using BTU across the board.

[coinbeast]

Since people seem to not want to let this thread die I might post some updates on my mining cabinet soon. I have gone with a all steel, non-flammable (albeit noisy) build. In part to stick it to people who claim I am stealing power, but more so that it's a more suitable and practical idea.

To the last few comments, I do have free power, but not unlimited power, and I can't just run 100 miners with a/c... I am provided free electricity as part of my salary package so within reason I can do what I want with it. But it only takes one jealous tool to potentially change that. Such is the workforce.

[notlist3d]

Since people seem to not want to let this thread die I might post some updates on my mining cabinet soon. I have gone with a all steel, non-flammable (albeit noisy) build. In part to stick it to people who claim I am stealing power, but more so that it's a more suitable and practical idea.

To the last few comments, I do have free power, but not unlimited power, and I can't just run 100 miners with a/c... I am provided free electricity as part of my salary package so within reason I can do what I want with it. But it only takes one jealous tool to potentially change that. Such is the workforce.

What type of job are you in? (I'm not calling you a lier) just curious.  I have never seen a job that has a bonus of power.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

heh heh... I too up to a point have 'free power' at work. 15kW of it to be exact. Then again, I'm also a partner in our industrial laser business I set that limit to keep miner electric usage to just a very small part of our total energy usage so it is slushed into the general operating expenses Any more than that and yes I'd start reimbursing the company just to keep the accounting straight and IRS happy.

[notlist3d]

heh heh... I too up to a point have 'free power' at work. 15kW of it to be exact. Then again, I'm also a partner in our industrial laser business I set that limit to keep miner electric usage to just a very small part of our total energy usage so it is slushed into the general operating expenses Any more than that and yes I'd start reimbursing the company just to keep the accounting straight and IRS happy.

And what do these industrial lasers do?  With professional I think of all kinds of cool possible government work.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

Systems we build are mainly for micro-machining ceramic substrates that circuits are built on. eg. scribing/cutting to size and drilling 10's of thousands of holes in them for vias. Single biggest use is for high -power LED manufacturing where the ceramic chips are heat spreaders/connections for the actual LED die. Around 75% of all the LED's you see for lighting were born on our systems In-house we do metal cutting, welding and selective hardening. http://www.synchronlaser.com http://www.industrial-lasers.com/articles/2007/11/processing-ceramic-substrates.html

[notlist3d]

Systems we build are mainly for micro-machining ceramic substrates that circuits are built on. eg. scribing/cutting to size and drilling 10's of thousands of holes in them for vias. Single biggest use is for high -power LED manufacturing where the ceramic chips are heat spreaders for the actual LED die. Around 75% of all the LED's you see for lighting were born on our systems In-house we do metal cutting, welding and selective hardening. http://www.synchronlaser.com http://www.industrial-lasers.com/articles/2007/11/processing-ceramic-substrates.html

Thanks for sharing!  Very interesting indeed.   And those are some heavy duty lasers.   

You might look into goods sections.  People always seem to be buying coins or things to store cold storage print in.  You might be able to make one with one of your lasers.

[NotFuzzyWarm]

If you mean storing the cold wallets as 2D barcodes, we do have a laser-marker in-house that does them. Hmmm...
But now we're way OT.

[johnyj]

Noiseless cooling 

[Sweminer777]

Noiseless cooling 

giant watercooling system ?

[QuintLeo]

Looks more like a "solar chimney" type setup. Bit expen$ive to build those for something as small as a bitcoin farm though, unless you're a really really BIG bitcoin farm.

[BlockC-Yan]

You should simply get an evaporative cooling system.  They are relatively cheap and based on your high heat I'm assuming you have relatively low humidity.  Just get something like this and duct it into the intake and exhaust outside.  Don't recycle the air in an evaporative cooling system as the humidity will slowly climb and you'll have problems.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ESSICK-AIR-N28W-Ducted-Evaporative-Cooler-2800-cfm-1-8-HP-/381023962944?hash=item58b6cc4740

Regards,
yan

[coinbeast]

Since people seem to not want to let this thread die I might post some updates on my mining cabinet soon. I have gone with a all steel, non-flammable (albeit noisy) build. In part to stick it to people who claim I am stealing power, but more so that it's a more suitable and practical idea.

To the last few comments, I do have free power, but not unlimited power, and I can't just run 100 miners with a/c... I am provided free electricity as part of my salary package so within reason I can do what I want with it. But it only takes one jealous tool to potentially change that. Such is the workforce.

What type of job are you in? (I'm not calling you a lier) just curious.  I have never seen a job that has a bonus of power.

[coinbeast]

You should simply get an evaporative cooling system.  They are relatively cheap and based on your high heat I'm assuming you have relatively low humidity.  Just get something like this and duct it into the intake and exhaust outside.  Don't recycle the air in an evaporative cooling system as the humidity will slowly climb and you'll have problems.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ESSICK-AIR-N28W-Ducted-Evaporative-Cooler-2800-cfm-1-8-HP-/381023962944?hash=item58b6cc4740

Regards,
yan

Most of the summer is very low humidity. But there is the odd stint where it will be over 35C and 80% humidity. That combination of heat and humidity will render any evaporative cooling useless and if I am off site at the time my miners could die very quickly.

[coinbeast]

This is a small update but sorry no pics yet. I have built the sheet metal cabinet and am have to do a little more grinding and then I will be ready to add the a/c.

This will not be for everybody but I plan to hard wire everything except the a/c, the plugs for the psu's and the pcie cables to the miners.
When I need to turn miners off for maintenance they will be wired to light switches on a control box. This build will have a heavy focus on fire protection so I am avoiding plug type connections and blackened wires that tend to come with them.

Pics soon.