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LiteCoinGuy (OP)
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September 17, 2015, 06:34:48 PM
 #1

What year did humankind acquired the capability to destroy itself? What is the Great Filter and Fermi paradox? Where is everybody in a Universe?

https://vimeo.com/129521121

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September 17, 2015, 06:35:49 PM
 #2

What year did humankind acquired the capability to destroy itself? What is the Great Filter and Fermi paradox? Where is everybody in a Universe?

https://vimeo.com/129521121

1938.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_fission

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September 17, 2015, 06:44:08 PM
 #3

What year did humankind acquired the capability to destroy itself? What is the Great Filter and Fermi paradox? Where is everybody in a Universe?

https://vimeo.com/129521121

1938.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_fission

that is the starting point yes. but we will invent much more stuff that could kill humankind.

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September 17, 2015, 08:10:47 PM
 #4

What year did humankind acquired the capability to destroy itself? What is the Great Filter and Fermi paradox? Where is everybody in a Universe?

https://vimeo.com/129521121

1938.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_fission

that is the starting point yes. but we will invent much more stuff that could kill humankind.


Like what. Bitcoin? The "thing" that kills most of living things on this planet is Nature itself. The One and Only Great Filter Since Day 1. Millions vanish everyday. Filtered by Nature.

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September 17, 2015, 11:22:48 PM
 #5

What year did humankind acquired the capability to destroy itself? What is the Great Filter and Fermi paradox? Where is everybody in a Universe?

https://vimeo.com/129521121

1938.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_fission

Took some time until they made a nuke bomb, and even more time until they managed to make enough of them to destroy world.

I would say not before 1949
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September 30, 2015, 08:41:44 AM
 #6

What year did humankind acquired the capability to destroy itself? What is the Great Filter and Fermi paradox? Where is everybody in a Universe?

https://vimeo.com/129521121

In your first question you need to specify the time-frame constraint. Humanity has evolved around a pre-existing capacity for self destruction, it's only a matter of "how long will it take for the consequences of X harmful action to result in the destruction of humanity?" Since knowledge is power, the degree of knowledge directly correlates with the destructive capacity of humanity, but it's a double edged sword so to speak...

The great filter is no more than a theory based on the assertion that intelligence is the result of an evolutionary "self defense mechanism" which first requires ferocious competition to justify its natural existence. Thus, for the evolutionary root of intelligence to exist there must also exist a prior disposition of an intelligent species towards violence; aka "natural selection". Intelligence will naturally lead to knowledge, which leads to enhanced power (ability), which results in increasing potential for greater calamity, and ultimately complete destruction. However, in my opinion it neglects the effects of a single trait of higher intelligence which is self-serving, which is the ability to foresee the outcomes of events before they materialize. For this reason, should an intelligent culture destroy itself, it will come as the consequence of a "lack of sufficient intelligence" where the outcome wasn't predicted due to the ignorance of certain participants, as a result of defective intelligence (mental illness), or just very bad luck due to unintended discovery.

Something that should be considered is that the Universe is constantly changing as a whole (I'll use the term "Universe" loosely to describe the area of quantum space which is currently being affected by the big bang). Imagine a quantum space which cannot be measured by observation, but only in the potential that energy may possibly occupy this space at some point under some circumstance; the very principle of infinity. The observable Universe is the result of a cyclical event which begins with an inception, followed by an aging term of existence, a death and dissolution phase, and then a rebirth. When the big bang happens as a result of the combined effects of random quantum tunneling with superposition, it "squeezes" energy potential out of quantum space, condensing it into observable energy (matter). It helps to visualize that matter "precipitates" like rain from a cloud of stored potential energy (subatomic particles) and thanks to the property called quantum tunneling, the available potential energy in any spot is always equal to the total of all quantum energy minus the total of all relative (kinetic) energy. So, with this in mind, life could not exist in a Universe of only light elements, it took many star cycles to fuse the elemental diversity that life requires. Some of the essential heavy elements can only be formed during the implosion shock of a Supernova, casting them out into space. Life evolved as quickly as it possibly could within our Universe, and because the speed of light is upwardly limited, so too is our rate of visual observation. The Fermi paradox becomes less of a paradox when you consider the potential rate of technological advancement for an intelligent species and our own limited searching ability. Perhaps we just don't communicate the same way, I find it most likely that communication transmission will eventually take advantage of the effects of quantum tunneling-directing and interpreting the various electron spins of coupled particles. The only delay in this form of communication will come as a result of processing time to simply interpret the message, there will be no transmission distance delay since there is no actual transmission. The message will be received as it is being created in real time across any distance with nothing for a third party to intercept.

You can't see them zooming around space because-lets face it, we've only recently been able to observe other planets outside of our own solar system. Why would we think we could detect any signs of an advanced society with such a narrow scope, and with such poor resolution, and such a large area to search, and considering that by the time they discover radio technology, they'll only be using it for a short time before advancing to better more useful technologies? Especially for a space-faring society. Radio transmission just doesn't cut it...

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October 01, 2015, 11:49:44 AM
 #7

"Where is everybody"?

They're all right here on Earth. If there's anything else, then it's unknown.

If we measure ourselves relative to the size of the universe and the Planck length, we might find that we're actually bigger than we are small. If that's the case, then that would make extraterrestrial life intuitively a bit less likely.

In addition, the requirement for extraterrestrial life to be extraterrestrial seems completely arbitrary. If we had been born in a world where a multitude of intelligent species fly around in spaceships and trade baking recipes at the centre of the Milky Way, most likely we'd still be bitching that we're all alone and that the other galaxies are unreachable.

The idea of a pass-fail test for civilisations seems a bit clunky to me. It touches on the same philosophical problem as that of "witnessing one's own demise". If we're too dead to see it, does it really happen? The ability to observe the universe seems to be a fundamental property of its own existence. Schrödinger's cat probably gets really bored after a while.
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October 01, 2015, 01:39:28 PM
 #8

There's a much better video about this. It's actually quite a interesting paradox. However, does anyone really believe that IF we have made contact (e.g. yesterday), that the government would just publicly announce it? It would be pretty unreasonable to think that we're the only and/or first planet with intelligent life. Humanity, as far as development goes,has still not achieved much. We are not even a Type 1 civilization! If we were a Type 2 civilization then we might be able to actually really look for aliens somewhere. Maybe there is intelligent life somewhere, but not just developed as we are (think 16-17th century) and they can not receive/answer our messages. There are just so many options. If humanity was actually spending money in R&D instead of wasting it building more and more weapons, we could speed up our development.

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October 01, 2015, 06:05:48 PM
 #9

https://youtu.be/sNhhvQGsMEc?t=57s


They always make the same mistake when talking about high-speed travel.
Really fast spaceships would appear to take billions of years to reach another galaxy, for observers stuck on Earth. However, the occupants in a relativistic spaceship could experience something completely different: their destination arrives at the blink of an eye, and it (the galaxy) undergoes accelerated ageing, while the passengers stay young.

It seems like a pretty bad side-effect of interstellar travel when everything else gets old around you. And every journey is a one-way trip into the unknown.
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October 01, 2015, 06:15:02 PM
 #10

https://youtu.be/sNhhvQGsMEc?t=57s


They always make the same mistake when talking about high-speed travel.
Really fast spaceships would appear to take billions of years to reach another galaxy, for observers stuck on Earth. However, the occupants in a relativistic spaceship could experience something completely different: their destination arrives at the blink of an eye, and it (the galaxy) undergoes accelerated ageing, while the passengers stay young.

It seems like a pretty bad side-effect of interstellar travel when everything else gets old around you. And every journey is a one-way trip into the unknown.

Maybe one day we can produce enough exotic matter to open our own wormholes Wink


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October 01, 2015, 07:30:53 PM
 #11

Would love to jump threw a wormhole.  Just hope you don't end up somewhere you cant stand to be.  Could be fun

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October 02, 2015, 03:23:48 AM
 #12

https://youtu.be/sNhhvQGsMEc?t=57s


They always make the same mistake when talking about high-speed travel.
Really fast spaceships would appear to take billions of years to reach another galaxy, for observers stuck on Earth. However, the occupants in a relativistic spaceship could experience something completely different: their destination arrives at the blink of an eye, and it (the galaxy) undergoes accelerated ageing, while the passengers stay young.

It seems like a pretty bad side-effect of interstellar travel when everything else gets old around you. And every journey is a one-way trip into the unknown.

Every trip is always a trip into the unknown...

I think the idea that a space faring civilization would be zooming around interstellar space in spacecraft is sort of absurd. Until you can precisely deconstruct and reconstruct matter all the way down to the subatomic level, interstellar flight is a one-way ticket with no hope of return...

In my opinion, it's possible to be at all places at once, but not while living... Teleportation is the scientific equivalent of conjuration.

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October 03, 2015, 02:23:11 AM
 #13

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
All you can say is that we have no concrete evidence for the existence of extraterrestrial life

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October 03, 2015, 03:01:07 AM
 #14

if we assume that aliens exist, there's no reason to assume that they've just got here, as we have. the galaxy is billions of years old. interstellar travel may be very difficult, but even so a civilisation not much more advanced than our own should be able to colonise the entire galaxy within a few million years - a small fraction of the age of the galaxy
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October 03, 2015, 04:45:46 AM
 #15

if we assume that aliens exist, there's no reason to assume that they've just got here, as we have. the galaxy is billions of years old. interstellar travel may be very difficult, but even so a civilisation not much more advanced than our own should be able to colonise the entire galaxy within a few million years - a small fraction of the age of the galaxy

Absolutely true, but they would more likely be "seeding" the Galaxy rather than "colonizing" it, since there would be a complete technical disconnect from the root of the original civilization. Who knows, it may have happened here on Earth...

I also believe life can be "seeded" via cosmic collisions... It seems to me like DNA replication is similar to crystal growth... Some leftover bacteria on an asteroid could plant the seed for new life on a dead planet somewhere...

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