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Author Topic: Does anyone have direct Satoshi quotes on the usage of Bitcoin?  (Read 562 times)
BillyBobZorton (OP)
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September 24, 2015, 04:33:45 PM
 #1

Namely, did Satoshi predict the need of something like Blockstream to deal with high transaction volume micropayments?
I mean, did Satoshi envision Bitcoin to be used to buy coffees on-chain, or did he already saw some problems with it? (blocksize, etc)
Did Satoshi design Bitcoin to be used as a safe haven, as gold 2.0, or has an actual high transaction volume used all over the world currency that can buy you a cup of coffee or a house?

Show me direct quotes related to all of this.
biggus dickus
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September 24, 2015, 05:08:58 PM
Last edit: September 24, 2015, 05:27:50 PM by biggus dickus
 #2

There is a section of the Bitcoi wiki devoted to micropayments. It gives a method of using them that requires the use of nLockTime. However, nLockTime was made non standard in 2013 and the methods described cannot be used until it is made standard again. The wiki says the original design by Satoshi supports nLockTime as standard, although things have moved forward and Satoshi might have changed his view on it now.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Contract#Example_7:_Rapidly-adjusted_.28micro.29payments_to_a_pre-determined_party

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Example 7: Rapidly-adjusted (micro)payments to a pre-determined party

For example, consider an untrusted internet access point, like a WiFi hotspot in a cafe you never visited before. You'd like to pay 0.001 BTC per 10 kilobytes of usage, without opening an account with the cafe. A zero-trust solution means it could be fully automatic, so you could just pre-allocate a budget on your phone's mobile wallet at the start of the month, and then your device automatically negotiates and pays for internet access on demand. The cafe also wants to allow anyone to pay them without the fear of being ripped off.

To do this, the following protocol can be used. This protocol relies upon a different behavior of nLockTime to the original design. Starting around 2013 time-locked transactions were made non standard and no longer enter the memory pool, thus cannot be broadcast before the timelock expires. When the behaviour of nLockTime is restored to the original design from Satoshi, a variant of this protocol is required which is discussed below.
LiteCoinGuy
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September 24, 2015, 05:22:02 PM
 #3

Namely, did Satoshi predict the need of something like Blockstream to deal with high transaction volume micropayments?
I mean, did Satoshi envision Bitcoin to be used to buy coffees on-chain, or did he already saw some problems with it? (blocksize, etc)
Did Satoshi design Bitcoin to be used as a safe haven, as gold 2.0, or has an actual high transaction volume used all over the world currency that can buy you a cup of coffee or a house?

Show me direct quotes related to all of this.

take a look:

http://crypt.la/2014/01/06/satoshi-nakamoto-quotes/

CIYAM
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September 24, 2015, 05:26:39 PM
 #4

I think idolising everything that Satoshi said or did is a bit silly really (he/they wrote code very poorly from any serious software engineers perspective).

Bitcoin should be able to take over the remittance market (worth billions) right now - yet it has basically failed to make any inroads there.

It should also be able to replace SWIFT (but we don't see that happening yet either).

People are worrying about buying coffees for BTC when to do so would actually cost them more (you'd have to change your dollars to BTC which would cost you a percentage and then the retailer will just use BitPay or the like so they won't offer any discount).

This whole idea of thinking that Bitcoin needs to be used for trivial purchases when virtually no-one is even paid in BTC seems to be a very silly one.

You don't get people to want to use a new currency just by making it acceptable to be used somewhere.

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GPG Public Key | 1ciyam3htJit1feGa26p2wQ4aw6KFTejU
Harry Hood
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September 24, 2015, 05:30:42 PM
 #5

"A purely peer-to-peer version of electronic cash would allow online
payments to be sent directly from one party to another without going through a
financial institution"

"We have proposed a system for electronic transactions without relying on trust."

I think idolising everything that Satoshi said or did is a bit silly really (he/they wrote code very poorly from any serious software engineers perspective).

Bitcoin should be able to take over the remittance market (worth billions) right now - yet it has basically failed to make any inroads there.

It should also be able to replace SWIFT (but we don't see that happening yet either).

People are worrying about buying coffees for BTC when to do so would actually cost them more (you'd have to change your dollars to BTC which would cost you a percentage and then the retailer will just use BitPay or the like so they won't offer any discount).

You don't get people to want to use a new currency just by making it acceptable to be used somewhere.

CIYAM, you're bearish on Bitcoin's entire future? You think it will fail? I'd love to hear more from you on this. For those that aren't bearish on Bitcoin, it would certainly not be foolish to idolize its creator.

P.S. I realize you likely won't see this because I have a paid signature and you've probably blocked my posts.

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September 24, 2015, 05:31:38 PM
 #6

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Feb. 14, 2010: I’m sure that in 20 years there will either be very large (bitcoin) transaction volume or no volume.

small blocks = death of bitcoin.

large volume of TX, or none, take your pick.

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September 24, 2015, 06:10:58 PM
 #7


People are worrying about buying coffees for BTC when to do so would actually cost them more (you'd have to change your dollars to BTC which would cost you a percentage and then the retailer will just use BitPay or the like so they won't offer any discount).

This whole idea of thinking that Bitcoin needs to be used for trivial purchases when virtually no-one is even paid in BTC seems to be a very silly one.



I cannot agree on that. Micropayments are one of the beauties of Bitcoin. It would be great if people could easily microtip in blog posts, buy coffes earned with the satoshis collected on faucets, buy movie tickets with the posts in forums, and so on.

But the fees do not allow for it.

I agree that it is hard to earn in Bitcoin. But I think that it is precisely that what needs to change. Methods to reward bloggers for their posts, more ad networks, more microjobs websites, etc.

dothebeats
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September 24, 2015, 06:26:10 PM
 #8

I think idolising everything that Satoshi said or did is a bit silly really (he/they wrote code very poorly from any serious software engineers perspective).

Bitcoin should be able to take over the remittance market (worth billions) right now - yet it has basically failed to make any inroads there.

It should also be able to replace SWIFT (but we don't see that happening yet either).

People are worrying about buying coffees for BTC when to do so would actually cost them more (you'd have to change your dollars to BTC which would cost you a percentage and then the retailer will just use BitPay or the like so they won't offer any discount).

This whole idea of thinking that Bitcoin needs to be used for trivial purchases when virtually no-one is even paid in BTC seems to be a very silly one.

You don't get people to want to use a new currency just by making it acceptable to be used somewhere.


Just this one hit me. Bitcoin should be anywhere near on taking over the remittance scene and doing some significant changes from there, but even if the market in bitcoin is already worth billions, still we haven't really applied using bitcoins in a much more larger sense--we still tend to use it as an investment vehicle towards moon.

If bitcoin was made for micropayments and remittances, then why is it used as an investment opportunity rather than the latter?
JeromeL
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September 24, 2015, 09:08:31 PM
 #9

Quote from: Harry Hood
CIYAM, you're bearish on Bitcoin's entire future? You think it will fail? I'd love to hear more from you on this. For those that aren't bearish on Bitcoin, it would certainly not be foolish to idolize its creator.

Bitcoin is computer science, not a religion. What you are saying is incredibly foolish.

People idolizing Satoshi, seeking guidance from 5 year old writings (at a time where we had very little knowledge about Bitcoin), are people who can't think for themselves and who need a leader to make decisions for them.

BillyBobZorton (OP)
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September 25, 2015, 03:13:22 PM
 #10

I think idolising everything that Satoshi said or did is a bit silly really (he/they wrote code very poorly from any serious software engineers perspective).

Bitcoin should be able to take over the remittance market (worth billions) right now - yet it has basically failed to make any inroads there.

It should also be able to replace SWIFT (but we don't see that happening yet either).

People are worrying about buying coffees for BTC when to do so would actually cost them more (you'd have to change your dollars to BTC which would cost you a percentage and then the retailer will just use BitPay or the like so they won't offer any discount).

This whole idea of thinking that Bitcoin needs to be used for trivial purchases when virtually no-one is even paid in BTC seems to be a very silly one.

You don't get people to want to use a new currency just by making it acceptable to be used somewhere.


I don't understand why they would use Bitpay. For me Bitpay is an abomination of what Bitcoin means, that's p2p money. Why in hell do I need some company named Bitpay to deal with my transactions? Why would you trust some company to know all of your details of the sales you did on your business? I don't get it.

And thats that, no one gets paid in BTC, thats the problem. We need a real economy in BTC so paying for everyday stuff on it makes sense. For example, people here use the money they get here from sig campaigns all the time to buy stuff because it's just more accessible (sure, it's just a couple dollars a month basically) than having to buy Bitcoin. Once you get your Bitcoin paid directly in your phone and you know some local stores that will sell you stuff in Bitcoin, it becomes cool to use it and not a hassle. So the key is indeed getting paid in BTC a normal thing.
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