Moved

[armadilo]

Moved!

[dothebeats]

Not very much familiar with cryptography, as I'm just starting to get my grasp of it, but I think that it is not randomly generated and some algorithms are required to produce such a hash. See this page for more info. If hashes are randomly calculated in bitcoin, then algorithms would be pretty much useless in this case.

[armadilo]

Not very much familiar with cryptography, as I'm just starting to get my grasp of it, but I think that it is not randomly generated and some algorithms are required to produce such a hash. See this page for more info. If hashes are randomly calculated in bitcoin, then algorithms would be pretty much useless in this case.

Thank brother & i'm waiting for a clear answer , i wonder if we really are able to calculate all the hash or just the first part of its ?

[odolvlobo]

I'm asking if the Bitcoin's transaction hashes are random or can be calculated ?.

A transaction hash is a hash of the transaction. A "hash" is a computation that is done on data and results in a value that has useful properties, including relative uniqueness, the appearance of randomness, and an inability to recreate the original data. A transaction hash is also known as a transaction ID, or txid.

In Bitcoin, transaction hash = SHA256(SHA256(transaction))

[armadilo]

I'm asking if the Bitcoin's transaction hashes are random or can be calculated ?.

A transaction hash is the hash of the transaction. A "hash" is a computation that is done on data and results in a value that has useful properties, including relative uniqueness, the appearance of randomness, and an inability to recreate the original data.

In Bitcoin, transaction hash = SHA256(SHA256(transaction))

So ? can it be calculated OR NOT    Like if you give me your btc address and i wanted to send you 5$ But i want to know AND CALCULATE the tx hash before sending the payment to you is it possible ?

[achow101]

Hashes of the same data are always the same. However, the data inside a transaction is not always the same. A transaction includes a signature, which includes random numbers thus the data is not always known so the hash cannot be calculated without actually creating and signing a transaction.

[dothebeats]

Just found this one out, turns out you can calculate a transaction hash as explained by the former lead dev Gavin Andresen, though I don't know whether it is applicable on your query. Link --> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=54451.msg649253#msg649253

[DannyHamilton]

So ? can it be calculated OR NOT  

That depends on what information you have.

If you have the exact transaction, then you will always be able to calculate the hash.  If you do not have enough information to build the exact transaction, then you will not be able to calculate the hash.

Like if you give me your btc address and i wanted to send you 5$ But i want to know AND CALCULATE the tx hash before sendind the payment to you is it possible ?

Yes.  First you would build the transaction.  Then you could hash it and find out what its hash will be.  Then, if you want to, you can send the transaction.

If I ask you to do a simple addition problem for me, can you tell me the answer before I tell you the problem?

No?

Ok, then if I tell you the two numbers that I want you to add together can you tell me what their sum is?

Yes?

A hash is simply a math problem.  It's a bit more complex than basic addition, but if you know the inputs you can calculate the outputs.  If you don't know the inputs it is impossible to calculate the outputs.

[armadilo]

So ? can it be calculated OR NOT  

That depends on what information you have.

If you have the exact transaction, then you will always be able to calculate the hash.  If you do not have enough information to build the exact transaction, then you will not be able to calculate the hash.

Like if you give me your btc address and i wanted to send you 5$ But i want to know AND CALCULATE the tx hash before sendind the payment to you is it possible ?

Yes.  First you would build the transaction.  Then you could hash it and find out what its hash will be.  Then, if you want to, you can send the transaction.

If I ask you to do a simple addition problem for me, can you tell me the answer before I tell you the problem?

No?

Ok, then if I tell you the two numbers that I want you to add together can you tell me what their sum is?

Yes?

A hash is simply a math problem.  It's a bit more complex than basic addition, but if you know the inputs, you can calculate the outputs, but if you don't know the inputs it is impossible to calculate the outputs.

So its possible to know the transaction hash (if i'm sending) but its impossible to know the tx hash if i'm recieving the payment :p ok thank you guys awesome!


Edit: is there anything that i cant know the results of it only after i send the payment ?

[odolvlobo]

I'm asking if the Bitcoin's transaction hashes are random or can be calculated ?.

A transaction hash is the hash of the transaction. A "hash" is a computation that is done on data and results in a value that has useful properties, including relative uniqueness, the appearance of randomness, and an inability to recreate the original data.

In Bitcoin, transaction hash = SHA256(SHA256(transaction))

So ? can it be calculated OR NOT    Like if you give me your btc address and i wanted to send you 5$ But i want to know AND CALCULATE the tx hash before sending the payment to you is it possible ?

If you are sending the bitcoins, then you are creating the transaction, so you can know the hash after you create the transaction, but before it is published. But if you are the only one that knows the details of the transaction, then you are the only one that can know the transaction hash before the transaction is published.

[armadilo]

I'm asking if the Bitcoin's transaction hashes are random or can be calculated ?.

A transaction hash is the hash of the transaction. A "hash" is a computation that is done on data and results in a value that has useful properties, including relative uniqueness, the appearance of randomness, and an inability to recreate the original data.

In Bitcoin, transaction hash = SHA256(SHA256(transaction))

So ? can it be calculated OR NOT    Like if you give me your btc address and i wanted to send you 5$ But i want to know AND CALCULATE the tx hash before sending the payment to you is it possible ?

If you are sending the bitcoins, then you are creating the transaction, so you can know the hash after you create the transaction, but before it is published. But if you are the only one that knows the details of the transaction, then you are the only one that can know the transaction hash before the transaction is published.

Edit: is there anything that i cant know the results of it only after i send the Bitcoin payment ?

[achow101]

I'm asking if the Bitcoin's transaction hashes are random or can be calculated ?.

A transaction hash is the hash of the transaction. A "hash" is a computation that is done on data and results in a value that has useful properties, including relative uniqueness, the appearance of randomness, and an inability to recreate the original data.

In Bitcoin, transaction hash = SHA256(SHA256(transaction))

So ? can it be calculated OR NOT    Like if you give me your btc address and i wanted to send you 5$ But i want to know AND CALCULATE the tx hash before sending the payment to you is it possible ?

If you are sending the bitcoins, then you are creating the transaction, so you can know the hash after you create the transaction, but before it is published. But if you are the only one that knows the details of the transaction, then you are the only one that can know the transaction hash before the transaction is published.

Edit: is there anything that i cant know the results of it only after i send the Bitcoin payment ?

No once you create and sign the transaction, you know everything about it and can calculate the hash nothing else is learned street broadcasting it.

[armadilo]

I'm asking if the Bitcoin's transaction hashes are random or can be calculated ?.

A transaction hash is the hash of the transaction. A "hash" is a computation that is done on data and results in a value that has useful properties, including relative uniqueness, the appearance of randomness, and an inability to recreate the original data.

In Bitcoin, transaction hash = SHA256(SHA256(transaction))

So ? can it be calculated OR NOT    Like if you give me your btc address and i wanted to send you 5$ But i want to know AND CALCULATE the tx hash before sending the payment to you is it possible ?

If you are sending the bitcoins, then you are creating the transaction, so you can know the hash after you create the transaction, but before it is published. But if you are the only one that knows the details of the transaction, then you are the only one that can know the transaction hash before the transaction is published.

Edit: is there anything that i cant know the results of it only after i send the Bitcoin payment ?

No once you create and sign the transaction, you know everything about it and can calculate the hash nothing else is learned street broadcasting it.

I think you are wrong , cause you cant know the confirmation time of the transaction or could you ? thats just an example and i want more anything else ?

Thank you.

[DannyHamilton]

This is starting to sound a LOT like an XY problem.

http://mywiki.wooledge.org/XyProblem


Perhaps if you tell us what you are actually trying to accomplish, you can get some much more useful help.

My first guess is that you are trying to create a "game" where someone sends a transaction, and something about their transaction determines if they "won".  You don't want them to know if they "won" before they send the transaction.

There are plenty of games like this, and solutions for that sort of problem have been around for a long time.  There is no need to re-invent something more complex when the existing solutions work fine.

If you aren't trying to create a "game", then what exactly is it that you are trying to accomplish?  Why do you care if the sender knows their hash?  Why do you care when a receiver knows the hash?

[CrazyJoker]

My first guess is that you are trying to create a "game" where someone sends a transaction, and something about their transaction determines if they "won".  You don't want them to know if they "won" before they send the transaction.

There are plenty of games like this, and solutions for that sort of problem have been around for a long time.  There is no need to re-invent something more complex when the existing solutions work fine.

May I know the solution you are indicating here ?

[armadilo]

This is starting to sound a LOT like an XY problem.

http://mywiki.wooledge.org/XyProblem


Perhaps if you tell us what you are actually trying to accomplish, you can get some much more useful help.

My first guess is that you are trying to create a "game" where someone sends a transaction, and something about their transaction determines if they "won".  You don't want them to know if they "won" before they send the transaction.

There are plenty of games like this, and solutions for that sort of problem have been around for a long time.  There is no need to re-invent something more complex when the existing solutions work fine.

If you aren't trying to create a "game", then what exactly is it that you are trying to accomplish?  Why do you care if the sender knows their hash?  Why do you care when a receiver knows the hash?

I'm not trying to make a game cause i'm not crazy to make a pure betting game where i might lose all my money.

But First you Said there are  plenty of games like this  i'm ready to offer you right now 1000$ and  i will send it to enscrow if you can give me just one site offering a pure game based on blockchain . if you cant than i ask you kindly to never user the internet again (if you are a man). read about the online games business stratigies . (You feel too smart ? anyways

i'm trying to learn about bitcoin payments and how they work for something out of your fast mind thank you .

[GermanGiant]

This is starting to sound a LOT like an XY problem.

http://mywiki.wooledge.org/XyProblem


Perhaps if you tell us what you are actually trying to accomplish, you can get some much more useful help.

My first guess is that you are trying to create a "game" where someone sends a transaction, and something about their transaction determines if they "won".  You don't want them to know if they "won" before they send the transaction.

There are plenty of games like this, and solutions for that sort of problem have been around for a long time.  There is no need to re-invent something more complex when the existing solutions work fine.

If you aren't trying to create a "game", then what exactly is it that you are trying to accomplish?  Why do you care if the sender knows their hash?  Why do you care when a receiver knows the hash?

I'm not trying to make a game cause i'm not crazy to make a pure betting game where i might lose all my money.

But First you Said there are  plenty of games like this  i'm ready to offer you right now 1000$ and  i will send it to enscrow if you can give me just one site offering a pure game based on blockchain . if you cant than i ask you kindly to never user the internet again (if you are a man). read about the online games business stratigies . (You feel too smart ? anyways

i'm trying to learn about bitcoin payments and how they work thank you .

Damn... You hit the wrong man. There are not many in this forum, who can help you like DannyHamilton.

[armadilo]

This is starting to sound a LOT like an XY problem.

http://mywiki.wooledge.org/XyProblem


Perhaps if you tell us what you are actually trying to accomplish, you can get some much more useful help.

My first guess is that you are trying to create a "game" where someone sends a transaction, and something about their transaction determines if they "won".  You don't want them to know if they "won" before they send the transaction.

There are plenty of games like this, and solutions for that sort of problem have been around for a long time.  There is no need to re-invent something more complex when the existing solutions work fine.

If you aren't trying to create a "game", then what exactly is it that you are trying to accomplish?  Why do you care if the sender knows their hash?  Why do you care when a receiver knows the hash?

I'm not trying to make a game cause i'm not crazy to make a pure betting game where i might lose all my money.

But First you Said there are  plenty of games like this  i'm ready to offer you right now 1000$ and  i will send it to enscrow if you can give me just one site offering a pure game based on blockchain . if you cant than i ask you kindly to never user the internet again (if you are a man). read about the online games business stratigies . (You feel too smart ? anyways

i'm trying to learn about bitcoin payments and how they work thank you .

Damn... You hit the wrong man. There are not many in this forum, who can help you like DannyHamilton.

He is trying to be smart in a crypted dick way   

[GermanGiant]

This is starting to sound a LOT like an XY problem.

http://mywiki.wooledge.org/XyProblem


Perhaps if you tell us what you are actually trying to accomplish, you can get some much more useful help.

My first guess is that you are trying to create a "game" where someone sends a transaction, and something about their transaction determines if they "won".  You don't want them to know if they "won" before they send the transaction.

There are plenty of games like this, and solutions for that sort of problem have been around for a long time.  There is no need to re-invent something more complex when the existing solutions work fine.

If you aren't trying to create a "game", then what exactly is it that you are trying to accomplish?  Why do you care if the sender knows their hash?  Why do you care when a receiver knows the hash?

I'm not trying to make a game cause i'm not crazy to make a pure betting game where i might lose all my money.

But First you Said there are  plenty of games like this  i'm ready to offer you right now 1000$ and  i will send it to enscrow if you can give me just one site offering a pure game based on blockchain . if you cant than i ask you kindly to never user the internet again (if you are a man). read about the online games business stratigies . (You feel too smart ? anyways

i'm trying to learn about bitcoin payments and how they work thank you .

Damn... You hit the wrong man. There are not many in this forum, who can help you like DannyHamilton.

He is trying to be smart in a crypted dick way   

I dont know you. May be you are smart too. But, being spent more than a year in this forum, I can tell you, there are many smart guys in this forum and DannyHamilton is obviously one of them. Sometimes a bit harsh... I dunno why. But, he is known for his helpful nature across the board. So, you could just be polite to learn... anyways. It is your choice.

[armadilo]

This is starting to sound a LOT like an XY problem.

http://mywiki.wooledge.org/XyProblem


Perhaps if you tell us what you are actually trying to accomplish, you can get some much more useful help.

My first guess is that you are trying to create a "game" where someone sends a transaction, and something about their transaction determines if they "won".  You don't want them to know if they "won" before they send the transaction.

There are plenty of games like this, and solutions for that sort of problem have been around for a long time.  There is no need to re-invent something more complex when the existing solutions work fine.

If you aren't trying to create a "game", then what exactly is it that you are trying to accomplish?  Why do you care if the sender knows their hash?  Why do you care when a receiver knows the hash?

I'm not trying to make a game cause i'm not crazy to make a pure betting game where i might lose all my money.

But First you Said there are  plenty of games like this  i'm ready to offer you right now 1000$ and  i will send it to enscrow if you can give me just one site offering a pure game based on blockchain . if you cant than i ask you kindly to never user the internet again (if you are a man). read about the online games business stratigies . (You feel too smart ? anyways

i'm trying to learn about bitcoin payments and how they work thank you .

Damn... You hit the wrong man. There are not many in this forum, who can help you like DannyHamilton.

He is trying to be smart in a crypted dick way   

I dont know you. May be you are smart too. But, being spent more than a year in this forum, I can tell you, there are many smart guys in this forum and DannyHamilton is obviously one of them. Sometimes a bit harsh... I dunno why. But, he is known for his helpful nature across the board. So, you could just be polite to learn... anyways. It is your choice.

Yea i geuss you are right i'm closing this thread , and i apologize to him . But 1000$ is still On and anytime he can PM mE .

Thank you.