.

[kazuki49]

It won't work sorry, we can still see through you, it would have been more effective with a sockpuppet account but you could only fool the very newbies.

[GingerAle]

indeed, i don't view this as reverse trolling. These are the facts.

and regarding my other post, i used the wrongs word... it should definitely be here, but it should also be recorded somewhere else, thats all. But yeah I guess google cache and archive will hold it for a bit.

[chennan]

No you and your band of merry men have seven threads up right now. Seems you all spread yourselves a little thin :/

Actually make that eight threads. Finding which is the 8th is left as an exercise for you.

There is a difference between those threads and this one.

In this thread we are talking about the state of Monero.

Trying to stick with facts like current price, market cap rating, node count, and other factual stats.

Why isn't this the same topic as the Monero speculation thread? Everything that you have noted in here is something that would be of use in that thread that has already been created...

[kazuki49]

It won't work sorry, we can still see through you, it would have been more effective with a sockpuppet account but you could only fool the very newbies.

What won't work?

Could you step back and ask yourself why I didn't use a sock?

I am but a speck in the world and on top of that I am posting a thread that next to no one in the world is going to read.

Please tell me what I have posted so far that is false about Monero or biased in such a way that would harm Monero?

Well, I think like saddam said the sockpuppet option was pretty much exhausted already, it doesnt work anymore but if you are the guy who shorted you are desperate enough to not care about it and post with your own account thinking this forum has any perceived reputation associated with accounts left so you try concerned posting that in my short time reading this forum was too already exhaustively tried against Monero (someone even made a music video about it), so you first posted pictures of the XMR market highlighting how it is still mainly traded on poloniex (good exchange but I see the point) and has an inflationary emission (which is a plus in my humble opinion), how the youtube and facebook/twitter has few likes because he community couldn't care to buy some hundreds or thousands fake and such. So I would say you are pretty much in contained desperation that nothing can take down Monero anymore not even a bear market with heavy shorts. I'm waiting one of you guys wear a Monero t-shirt and behead someone in public square next but I'm afraid this too will have the opposite effect.

Of course I could be just seeing things and being paranoid (99% sure I'm not) but I woud not be part of this if wasn't remotely fun

carry on.

[AdamWhite]

Nothing personal Alpha goy, i just call it how i see it.

This post of yours quoted below shows the obvious bias.. a few obligatory sentences about LTC before you move on to shilling hard for Dash. Seems you've gone from promoting the known shitcoin scam Dash to spamming.. what exactly? Yet another Monero thread with screenshots of the Poloniex exchange rate and node counts?

So your intention with this thread is to try and make Monero, a coin that never had its block reward or total supply tampered with, look bad?

LTC

After the last straggling speculators realized that the halving party was over price has seen some downward pressure.

August 27th marked the time of the slide.

Currently sitting at around .0125 the price is getting dangerously close to 1:1 with DASH.

Hashrate averages as of yesterday = 957.05 Ghash/s

It will be interesting to see just how low it goes.

What will be on the LTC short term horizon now that halving is history?


DASH

The Bitfinex trading shutdown is right around the corner.

Tommorow all trading is to cease there.

They are still facilitating about 10% of the DASH/BTC trading volume.

Here is how the rest of the spread looks according to CMC (http://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/dash/#markets)

1    Bittrex           DASH/BTC    $ 6,548   $ 2.56    20.71 %    
2    useCryptos   DASH/BTC    $ 6,462   $ 2.56    20.44 %    
3    Poloniex           DASH/BTC    $ 5,568   $ 2.57    17.62 %    
4    Cryptsy           DASH/BTC    $ 3,831   $ 2.56    12.12 %    
5    Bitfinex           DASH/BTC    $ 3,271   $ 2.56    10.35 %    
6    Bitfinex           DASH/USD    $ 2,581   $ 2.58    8.17 %    
7    CEX.IO           DASH/BTC    $ 1,422   $ 2.58    4.50 %    
8    CEX.IO           DASH/LTC    $ 1,133   $ 2.54    3.58 %    

Things have changed a bit since the last time I checked this.

Cryptsy does not appear to be handling so much of the trading load anymore.

Starting to see a more even spread.

Nonetheless, price has been hovering around the .0112 range for the past few days.

The door is still open for LTC holders to switch investments.

If the DASH/LTC ratio flips in favor of DASH in the coming days LTC holders will only have moments before a wave starts picking up steam.

Speaking of waves let's analyze the drawback and compare it to the pump that took place in March.

March's drawback followed by Tsunami:



August's potential drawback with an unknown future:

[GingerAle]

i like whats going on here, besides the weird accusations etc.

The fact that OP was able to find that node count website indicates that they actually know some stuff and know where to look, so right on.

And I view this thread in a good light - it serves as record that monero was cheap at one point. Well, for a long time.

But I am kinda an eternal optimist

[rangedriver]

I'm waiting one of you guys wear a Monero t-shirt and behead someone in public square next but I'm afraid this too will have the opposite effect.

LOL

So true. This is the great irony of these types of posts. Aside from being painfully transparent and making the OP look like a dick, ultimately it ends up doing the complete opposite of what the OP had intended.

[GingerAle]

It won't work sorry, we can still see through you, it would have been more effective with a sockpuppet account but you could only fool the very newbies.

What won't work?

Could you step back and ask yourself why I didn't use a sock?

I am but a speck in the world and on top of that I am posting a thread that next to no one in the world is going to read.

Please tell me what I have posted so far that is false about Monero or biased in such a way that would harm Monero?

and has an inflationary emission (which is a plus in my humble opinion)

carry on.

Perhaps after thread participants do a bitcointalk.org backround check on me this thread can continue.


As mentioned in an earlier post I am interested in the tail emission.

From what I read it states "perpetual" but at a low rate.

This concept is foreign to me because I'm so use to hearing a definitive coin count.

Does Monero have transaction fees?

Yes. If you're next question is why a tail emission is necessary with transaction fees, the reason is that monero has an adaptive blocksize. So without a fixed limit on blocksize, there's no "market" for transaction fees. Therefore, monero can never rely soly on transaction fees to incentivize block validation.

[GingerAle]

It won't work sorry, we can still see through you, it would have been more effective with a sockpuppet account but you could only fool the very newbies.

What won't work?

Could you step back and ask yourself why I didn't use a sock?

I am but a speck in the world and on top of that I am posting a thread that next to no one in the world is going to read.

Please tell me what I have posted so far that is false about Monero or biased in such a way that would harm Monero?

and has an inflationary emission (which is a plus in my humble opinion)

carry on.

Perhaps after thread participants do a bitcointalk.org backround check on me this thread can continue.


As mentioned in an earlier post I am interested in the tail emission.

From what I read it states "perpetual" but at a low rate.

This concept is foreign to me because I'm so use to hearing a definitive coin count.

Does Monero have transaction fees?

Yes. If you're next question is why a tail emission is necessary with transaction fees, the reason is that monero has an adaptive blocksize. So without a fixed limit on blocksize, there's no "market" for transaction fees. Therefore, monero can never rely soly on transaction fees to incentivize block validation.

Got it.

When it says <1% is that fixed or can it fluctuate?

its fixed, currently, at 0.3 XMR per block (but it may soon change to 0.6 XMR per block, because there is talk of increasing blocktimes to 2 minutes to reduce reorgs).

The way I understand monero history, at some point the tail emission was proposed and <1% was agreed upon. When it came time to implement, the core devs decided on 0.3 XMR. the max they could have done would be ~0.34 (1% of 18 million).

i might see what you're asking kinda. I don't have the exact wording handy, but the tail emission is <1% of the primary emission. So, it will be 0.3 XMR forever, which is what is known as disinflationary https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disinflation

of course, it *could* change - this is all consensus. If in 40 years , the core dev team decides to change it to 0.1 XMR per block, then we'll have ourselves a good fork battle.

[illodin]

I guess this must be the thread for passive-aggressive Dash holders.

Pretty much this, Alpha goy is a known Dash shill and bagholder.. he feels the need to blame his heavy losses on other coins

Talking about heavy losses..

Also, here is AdamWhite defending botnets, and going all-in in Monero when it was $2.20 a piece (the price is $0.38 now).

I'm afraid the people (well respected contributors no less) saying it makes no sense for botnet owners to mine Monero are mistaken. Sure, other coins might be more profitable in small volumes, but there's no way a botnet will be able to exchange out of a thinly traded premined shitnote and into BTC without bringing the price to zero. Same for VTC

Don't get me wrong, im in this coin for the long haul. I've exchanged all my alts for XMR. I expect botnets securing the network. As the network grow to include more efficient hardware, this will be less and less of an issue. It's a little disheartening to see this kind of misinformation here. Understand that there is no better coin for botnet operators to mine right now, and this is to be expected. Not sure if there are ulterior motives at play or if you're simply not taking volumes into consideration when claiming otherwise

[Spoetnik]

So tell me, why are you actually posting this? What's relevant here?

All of this information is relevant to the state of Monero.

Do you not agree?

But why make a seperate and new topic for it while we got an ANN topic?

Because I choose to.

There are other Monero threads that are not the ANN topic.

Examples:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=753252.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1190988.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1140006.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=652305.0

Is something wrong?

maybe a double standard with the rules ?
i have had topics deleted because i made too many on the same coin or i was accused of advertising..
but as always Monero guys are allowed to hammer this place forever while mods look the other way.

[AdamWhite]

ROFL illodin.. defending botnets?  that post is me calling out someone claiming XMR wasn't botnet mined since it wasn't profitable when it obviously was

There's also a reason that other post is deleted, i'm no longer "in for the long haul". Believe it or not i did make a small profit on XMR. Now that the price is a lot lower i may begin accumulating again.

[illodin]

ROFL illodin.. defending botnets?  that post is me calling out someone claiming XMR wasn't botnet mined since it wasn't profitable when it obviously was

There's also a reason that other post is deleted, i'm no longer "in for the long haul". Believe it or not i did make a small profit on XMR. Now that the price is a lot lower i may begin accumulating again.

You're just fine with criminals hacking into innocent peoples' computers running botnets as long as they "protect" your investment. In fact, you "expect botnets to secure the network" of your chosen coin. Anything goes as long as it's for your benefit.

[AdamWhite]

Of course i'm not fine with it. botnets are a fact regardless of my feelings are you really this naive?

Speaking of criminal acts and "anything goes", apparently you're not only "fine with" but actually advocate murder for hire if it potentially interferes with your investment. How's that hit fund coming along? It really does take a special kind of stupid to threaten someone on the open internet.

[kazuki49]

It won't work sorry, we can still see through you, it would have been more effective with a sockpuppet account but you could only fool the very newbies.

What won't work?

Could you step back and ask yourself why I didn't use a sock?

I am but a speck in the world and on top of that I am posting a thread that next to no one in the world is going to read.

Please tell me what I have posted so far that is false about Monero or biased in such a way that would harm Monero?

and has an inflationary emission (which is a plus in my humble opinion)

carry on.

Perhaps after thread participants do a bitcointalk.org backround check on me this thread can continue.


As mentioned in an earlier post I am interested in the tail emission.

From what I read it states "perpetual" but at a low rate.

This concept is foreign to me because I'm so use to hearing a definitive coin count.

Does Monero have transaction fees?

The advantage that Monero currently has over virtually every POW coin and this includes Bitcoin, is that Monero has a current working solution to the scaling of blocksize question. One needs two things 1) Adaptive limits 2) A tail emission. Solving this problem without a tail emission is far from obvious, In fact I am not even convinced one can even create a viable fee market in the absence of an emission. There is a reason why there is so little progress with the blocksize debate in Bitcoin.

It sounds like you're saying that it's impossible to solve the blocksize limit without having a tail emission.  If that is what you're saying, will you elaborate please?  
  
I do understand that both of those are advantages that Monero has to bitcoin and I think they will play more of a factor going forward.  
  
Also, do you think that Satoshi believed bitcoin could work with transaction-fee only mining and as a deflationary asset... or was it intentionally crippled from the beginning?

I will elaborate on this.

The first question one needs to ask before even considering adaptive blocksize limits is: Can a fee market actually work in the absence of a base emission?

1) We first consider a blocksize large enough (or effectively infinite). In this scenario competition among miners will drive fees towards zero since there is no scarcity. This will in turn cause the difficulty and consequently the security of the crypto currency to collapse. We must keep in mind that orphan block based arguments will also fail since these are based on the presence of a base emission. This is in fact the very legitimate fear of the small block proponents.

2) In the second case we consider a fixed blocksize, where the blocksize is small enough to impact fees. In this scenario we have a potentially infinite demand with a fixed supply. In theory fees therefore would go to infinity. We must keep in mind that as the legitimate demand rises towards the fixed limit, It becomes economically attractive for miners with a even small percentage of the hash rate to spam the network in order to profit by raising the overall fees.  At this point only external competitive factors can stop the fees from rising to infinity. These take the form of fiat payment methods and other crypto currencies with the latter being not affected by a fixed blocksize limit. The impact of these external competitive factors is to reduce demand by devaluing the entire crypto currency. This will be delayed by miner spam, as miners will increase the spam in order to preserve the dwindling purchasing power of their fees until the system collapses to little or no transaction demand leading the first case above.

The problem as I see it is that the system is inherently unstable. Either the mining revenue collapses first or the purchasing power of the mining revenue collapses first. We now come to the next question. Can one create an adaptive blocksize limit formula that does not converge as time increases towards (1) or (2) above? My instinct tells me no, particularly since the network has no way to measure the key parameter namely the amount of fees collected per block due to out of bound payments to miners. Furthermore there have been many brilliant minds looking at this issue and they have not come up with a solution. Proving this negative, in a rigorous mathematical sense, is of course another matter entirely.

What the tail emission in Monero does is provide a stable anchor outside of the control of the miners on top of which an adaptive blocksize limit and a fee market can actually develop, by avoiding the instability above.

One final note. Why is this posted in the Monero speculation thread? The answer is very simple: Monero is the other crypto currency with the latter being not affected by a fixed blocksize limit above. In the collapsing valuation of (2) the valuation has to go somewhere and there a good possibility that Monero will capture some of this valuation.

[illodin]

Of course i'm not fine with it. botnets are a fact regardless of my feelings are you really this naive?

You declare you go all-in on a coin, and then say you expect botnets to protect its network. Seems like you're more than fine with it, in fact, you have an expectation of it.

Speaking of criminal acts and "anything goes", apparently you're not only "fine with" but actually advocate murder for hire if it potentially interferes with your investment. How's that hit fund coming along? It really does take a special kind of stupid to threaten someone on the open internet.

Murder? I don't know how much tissues you'd need for your issues, but apparently it's way more than we can crowdfund for you here.

Speaking of special kind of stupid, defaming people whose identities are publicly known without any proof takes an AdamWhite kind of stupid. Would be funny if some millionaire got bored with yachting and partying 24/7 and decided to hire an army of attorneys to sue and bankrupt your sorry ass just for lulz.

[smooth]

Can someone from the Monero team tell me what their relationship is with Poloniex?

I find it interesting that when I click on the "exchange" button on their main page that it takes me directly to XMR.

Is there some type of exclusive arrangement here between Poloniex and the Monero team?.

There is no relationship. None at all other than that we help them out if they have problems installing the wallet, etc. Nothing exclusive or non-exclusive. I'm not even aware that they have donated to coin development as some other ecosystem businesses have.

Why it defaults to XMR I don't know. Some guesses: 1) they have secondary coin pairs against it, 2) it has been a consistent high volume coin on the exchange over the past 18 months or so, with other coins displacing it as top volume for a time but usually falling back down after a while.

EDIT: saddam is right about it giving them big volume last year too. I think there was a news story about how last summer's high Monero volume was what allowed them to make enough money to fully pay back all the customers after an earlier hacking incident (not an outcome you see a lot when it comes to small exchanges in crypto land)

[smoothie]

ROFL illodin.. defending botnets?  that post is me calling out someone claiming XMR wasn't botnet mined since it wasn't profitable when it obviously was

There's also a reason that other post is deleted, i'm no longer "in for the long haul". Believe it or not i did make a small profit on XMR. Now that the price is a lot lower i may begin accumulating again.

You're just fine with criminals hacking into innocent peoples' computers running botnets as long as they "protect" your investment. In fact, you "expect botnets to secure the network" of your chosen coin. Anything goes as long as it's for your benefit.

Just because something bad happens let's say theft, doesn't mean that we support it.

Moreso it is calling it for what it is. You can keep assuming what people mean by their statements but it is a waste of your time unless you ask them what they mean.

No one can stop bot-nets short of turning off the internet entirely. It is what it is.

[smoothie]

Can someone from the Monero team tell me what their relationship is with Poloniex?

I find it interesting that when I click on the "exchange" button on their main page that it takes me directly to XMR.

Is there some type of exclusive arrangement here between Poloniex and the Monero team?.

There is no relationship. None at all other than that we help them out if they have problems installing the wallet, etc. Nothing exclusive or non-exclusive. I'm not even aware that they have donated to coin development as some other ecosystem businesses have.

Why it defaults to XMR I don't know. Some guesses: 1) they have secondary coin pairs against it, 2) it has been a consistent high volume coin on the exchange over the past 18 months or so, with other coins displacing it as top volume for a time but usually falling back down after a while.

EDIT: saddam is right about it giving them big volume last year too. I think there was a news story about how last summer's high Monero volume was what allowed them to make enough money to fully pay back all the customers after an earlier hacking incident (not an outcome you see a lot when it comes to small exchanges in crypto land)

So nothing on paper then.

Just a relationship that gives them more financial gain than other coins on their exchange.

Just to be clear I'm not knocking Monero here.

I'm more interested in what motivates the exchange.

Given the news with Cryptsy and other exchanges in the past I just like to stay vigilant on where I do my trading.

I wonder what they have to say about it?

Does Monero have any plans of trading more on other platforms besides Poloniex?

Its like the eggs are all in one basket when you look at the percentages.

Yes the idea is not to have trading only on one exchange.

Pretty much it isnt up to one person or a group of people.

An exchange has to choose to allow XMR trading on its platform.

Monero is still growing much like how bitcoin was when the only real exchange was EMPTYGOX.

[GingerAle]

nope