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Author Topic: NAMG - North American Miner Group - New Concept, NEED INPUT from YOU!  (Read 1578 times)
chicagoleo
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October 13, 2015, 09:58:38 AM
 #1

Greetings, I currently I run a small farm of 70Th, I was thinking about an idea of a consortium, or group, or club with members, that Combine their equipment in one managed facility, the electric bill is paid without markup by the members, the members all pay a monthly mandatory donation to the club of 20% of what their miners made that month or flat membership dues.  This btc or dues goe into an operating budget for the club.  The club has a board that makes decisions.  Cost of the club are covered by the members..   I have lots of idea's, but lets hear yours, and yes I would be willing to build and or manage the facility, and yes I already have a facility I own and operate but with this club Idea i'm thinking a new facility, I can build it no problem as Ive built 3 datacenters before.  Each members would be an owner who could sell their share to someone else later if they choose, and we have max membership of 100 members. Who own minimum hashing power of 10TH

Lets have an open discussion with lots of input from miners and what everyone thinks of this idea?

Some specs, in chicago .06 cents per kwh, warehouse rent at about $6-8 sq ft.  power would be at least 800 amp 480v 3/phase $.06 per kwh, and maybe less on volume.  Off the top of my head without doin the math, I'd aim for about 500Th - 5 Ph facility.

What would you be willing to do, or specs you's like to see.


ok, go..
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October 13, 2015, 06:35:24 PM
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Greetings, I currently I run a small farm of 70Th, I was thinking about an idea of a consortium, or group, or club with members, that Combine their equipment in one managed facility, the electric bill is paid without markup by the members, the members all pay a monthly mandatory donation to the club of 20% of what their miners made that month or flat membership dues.  This btc or dues goe into an operating budget for the club.  The club has a board that makes decisions.  Cost of the club are covered by the members..   I have lots of idea's, but lets hear yours, and yes I would be willing to build and or manage the facility, and yes I already have a facility I own and operate but with this club Idea i'm thinking a new facility, I can build it no problem as Ive built 3 datacenters before.  Each members would be an owner who could sell their share to someone else later if they choose, and we have max membership of 100 members. Who own minimum hashing power of 10TH

Lets have an open discussion with lots of input from miners and what everyone thinks of this idea?

Some specs, in chicago .06 cents per kwh, warehouse rent at about $6-8 sq ft.  power would be at least 800 amp 480v 3/phase $.06 per kwh, and maybe less on volume.  Off the top of my head without doin the math, I'd aim for about 500Th - 5 Ph facility.

What would you be willing to do, or specs you's like to see.


ok, go..


I like the price but I think you need to refine the buisness plan.  There is a HUGE difference your range "500Th - 5 Ph facility.".   The electricity requirements just are not close, or same on gear.

You need to start lower and work up.    I dont see jumping into a 5 PH facility you have lots of cooling to ad and many other things.  I would start on low end and see how it goes and upgrade higher if you max capacity.
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October 13, 2015, 07:20:27 PM
 #3

Greetings, I currently I run a small farm of 70Th, I was thinking about an idea of a consortium, or group, or club with members, that Combine their equipment in one managed facility, the electric bill is paid without markup by the members, the members all pay a monthly mandatory donation to the club of 20% of what their miners made that month or flat membership dues.  This btc or dues goe into an operating budget for the club.  The club has a board that makes decisions.  Cost of the club are covered by the members..   I have lots of idea's, but lets hear yours, and yes I would be willing to build and or manage the facility, and yes I already have a facility I own and operate but with this club Idea i'm thinking a new facility, I can build it no problem as Ive built 3 datacenters before.  Each members would be an owner who could sell their share to someone else later if they choose, and we have max membership of 100 members. Who own minimum hashing power of 10TH

Lets have an open discussion with lots of input from miners and what everyone thinks of this idea?

Some specs, in chicago .06 cents per kwh, warehouse rent at about $6-8 sq ft.  power would be at least 800 amp 480v 3/phase $.06 per kwh, and maybe less on volume.  Off the top of my head without doin the math, I'd aim for about 500Th - 5 Ph facility.

What would you be willing to do, or specs you's like to see.


ok, go..


I like the price but I think you need to refine the buisness plan.  There is a HUGE difference your range "500Th - 5 Ph facility.".   The electricity requirements just are not close, or same on gear.

You need to start lower and work up.    I dont see jumping into a 5 PH facility you have lots of cooling to ad and many other things.  I would start on low end and see how it goes and upgrade higher if you max capacity.

I would have to agree that the main missed point here is the cooling situation.  500 TH/s is a lot to cool, and 5 PH/s needs pretty much a dedicated facility built from scratch to maintain that.

Also, you are quite a new member, and no offense, but in the past new members who come right out and say send me miner gear/money usually don't end up doing to well.


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jonnybravo0311
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October 13, 2015, 08:39:42 PM
 #4

I'm not sure you'd have enough power with your 800A 480V setup to drive the 5PH of gear.  If my math isn't failing me (it probably is, so I apologize in advance if I screwed up my calculations), that setup would give you total available power of 664.32kVA.  If you could covert that completely to 208V power, it would give you 1846A at 208V.  Even if you could get that at a 0.99 power factor, that would give you an absolute total of about 658kW.  5PH of S7s would require about 1.25MW for the gear alone.

Just food for thought...

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October 14, 2015, 12:58:11 AM
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I'm not sure you'd have enough power with your 800A 480V setup to drive the 5PH of gear.  If my math isn't failing me (it probably is, so I apologize in advance if I screwed up my calculations), that setup would give you total available power of 664.32kVA.  If you could covert that completely to 208V power, it would give you 1846A at 208V.  Even if you could get that at a 0.99 power factor, that would give you an absolute total of about 658kW.  5PH of S7s would require about 1.25MW for the gear alone.

Just food for thought...

No I think this project really was a idea that came out to early.  Really you need to find cheap electricity first.  From there build the data center and make sure you have proper cooling and steady electricity.

The range of power though is not possible.  No electricity company really will be able to provide this range.  You would have to do upgrades to get more.  Really set a plan out OP.  Even then if you set a goal of this big it's going to be hard to get initial funding.
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October 14, 2015, 02:07:26 PM
 #6

I agree it's not a fully fleshed out business plan.  The OP even acknowledges this and gives some very rough ballpark estimates: $0.06 per kWh, $6 to $8 per sq ft.  I was just commenting that his proposed power of 800A 480V service wouldn't be enough to drive his top end estimate of a 5PH facility.  Definitely enough juice to deal with 1PH of S7s and the necessary cooling to drive it, though.

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October 17, 2015, 05:12:56 AM
 #7

...the members all pay a monthly mandatory donation to the club of 20% of what their miners made that month or flat membership dues...


Good luck with that.  Miners already get uppity over fees of 1-3%.  Adding an extra 0 is sure to go over just fine with them.

RIP BTC Guild, April 2011 - June 2015
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October 17, 2015, 05:55:55 AM
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...the members all pay a monthly mandatory donation to the club of 20% of what their miners made that month or flat membership dues...


Good luck with that.  Miners already get uppity over fees of 1-3%.  Adding an extra 0 is sure to go over just fine with them.

I would agree on 20 I highly doubt many will get interested.  Fact is like eleuthria said miners are known to move pools over much less fee. 

Now if you go co-op where everyone paid based on what they have there not percentage makes more sense.   My ISP being a small town is a CO-OP.   Our pay really is not high considering price of 1 gigabit internet.   And at end of their financial year I believe profits are split to it's "owners" which is everyone who uses it.  But considering you paid the money in the first place you don't really make anyting.
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October 26, 2015, 06:02:28 AM
 #9

Your idea sounds a lot like NastyFans, only NastyFans gets revenue from other sources than mining and all electrical costs are voluntarily paid by members through donations.  Check it out: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=86854.0

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October 26, 2015, 05:45:11 PM
 #10

Such negativity, let's review what I said,  

Let's start with a target in 500th. Not 5ph, obviously growth changes upgrades and perhaps multiple sites would get to us to the larger goal.  The datacebter facility power and client base is already there, running, I own it, I built it in 2004, I've been providing colocation since 1995.  I am a Cisco engineer.

Next I didn't ask anyone to send equipment I asked for a discussion on a group to mine together.  Maybe someone w a 2 cent per kWh rate on Wa. can go hunt down a building for us.
Lease.

Next I have the experience already to build the datacebter, install the power, ventellation, and network.  I've done it all many times over.

Lastly I've been mining bitcoin very successfully for about a year, everything is running great at 70th, there is definitely a learning curve so if you don't already mine over 10 or 20 th you probably won't understand do feel free not to chime in unless you have this much needed experience.

But Thanks though for all the great input!
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October 26, 2015, 07:44:15 PM
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Such negativity, let's review what I said,  

Let's start with a target in 500th. Not 5ph, obviously growth changes upgrades and perhaps multiple sites would get to us to the larger goal.  The datacebter facility power and client base is already there, running, I own it, I built it in 2004, I've been providing colocation since 1995.  I am a Cisco engineer.

Next I didn't ask anyone to send equipment I asked for a discussion on a group to mine together.  Maybe someone w a 2 cent per kWh rate on Wa. can go hunt down a building for us.
Lease.

Next I have the experience already to build the datacebter, install the power, ventellation, and network.  I've done it all many times over.

Lastly I've been mining bitcoin very successfully for about a year, everything is running great at 70th, there is definitely a learning curve so if you don't already mine over 10 or 20 th you probably won't understand do feel free not to chime in unless you have this much needed experience.

But Thanks though for all the great input!

you opened the door by saying "ok, go..." and now you want to limit who can say what. You posted on a forum. Did you really think 100 people would band together online and say yes lets do this without any actual plan in place and tell you to manage a facility on the basis of you stating you are a Cisco engineer. With this kind of education I would assume the approach would have been better thought out.

Show pics of your current facility, so they have proof you have a datacenter. Or PM established members who have adequate knowledge and you would want to partner with.

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October 27, 2015, 05:03:35 AM
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Such negativity, let's review what I said,  

Let's start with a target in 500th. Not 5ph, obviously growth changes upgrades and perhaps multiple sites would get to us to the larger goal.  The datacebter facility power and client base is already there, running, I own it, I built it in 2004, I've been providing colocation since 1995.  I am a Cisco engineer.

Next I didn't ask anyone to send equipment I asked for a discussion on a group to mine together.  Maybe someone w a 2 cent per kWh rate on Wa. can go hunt down a building for us.
Lease.

Next I have the experience already to build the datacebter, install the power, ventellation, and network.  I've done it all many times over.

Lastly I've been mining bitcoin very successfully for about a year, everything is running great at 70th, there is definitely a learning curve so if you don't already mine over 10 or 20 th you probably won't understand do feel free not to chime in unless you have this much needed experience.

But Thanks though for all the great input!

As someone who has hobby mined 10TH +, and 20TH +, I can relate.   But going from even these amounts to 500TH is a massive undertaking.  You are likely to have growing pains unless you have someone who has done it before.     Your still talking about gong from hobby mining to a professional data center from 70T to 500T.  There are a LOT of things you need to plan out.

I like the idea.  The trust and capital to do it will be the hard things to get.  There just would have to be a pretty solid written out business plan.
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October 30, 2015, 05:41:43 AM
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I'm not sure you'd have enough power with your 800A 480V setup to drive the 5PH of gear.  If my math isn't failing me (it probably is, so I apologize in advance if I screwed up my calculations), that setup would give you total available power of 664.32kVA.  If you could covert that completely to 208V power, it would give you 1846A at 208V.  Even if you could get that at a 0.99 power factor, that would give you an absolute total of about 658kW.  5PH of S7s would require about 1.25MW for the gear alone.

Just food for thought..
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October 30, 2015, 07:09:04 AM
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I'm not sure you'd have enough power with your 800A 480V setup to drive the 5PH of gear.  If my math isn't failing me (it probably is, so I apologize in advance if I screwed up my calculations), that setup would give you total available power of 664.32kVA.  If you could covert that completely to 208V power, it would give you 1846A at 208V.  Even if you could get that at a 0.99 power factor, that would give you an absolute total of about 658kW.  5PH of S7s would require about 1.25MW for the gear alone.

Just food for thought...

Haven't checked your math on the miner power consumption, but just to add:  The power needed to COOL that amount of power sucking equipment is immense.  Cooling efficiency decreases when equipment is packed more densely.

RIP BTC Guild, April 2011 - June 2015
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October 30, 2015, 03:23:36 PM
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I'm not sure you'd have enough power with your 800A 480V setup to drive the 5PH of gear.  If my math isn't failing me (it probably is, so I apologize in advance if I screwed up my calculations), that setup would give you total available power of 664.32kVA.  If you could covert that completely to 208V power, it would give you 1846A at 208V.  Even if you could get that at a 0.99 power factor, that would give you an absolute total of about 658kW.  5PH of S7s would require about 1.25MW for the gear alone.

Just food for thought..
Umm... WTF?  You quoted my text verbatim from earlier in this post, but didn't put quotes around it and are trying to claim this is your own post?  Or, were you trying to reply to me and just screwed it up?

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