The pollution from bitcoin will make government forbid it

[Elwar]

Have you done any research at all or is all of your information from Al Gore?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1191177.msg12701555#msg12701555
Do read before being rude.
>100x transactions
Impossible. 7tps max, 'burst rate.'

 ~ManBearPig

Transactions != mining.

Added block size does nothing for energy cost.

[ahpku]

http://www.coindesk.com/microscope-conclusions-costs-bitcoin/
[stuff a bitcoin blog says]

Without checking your [dubious] data, how is gold mining/recycling related to banks, which, to our chagrin, deal exclusively with fiat money?
And how is it you've failed to read the link offered above, where the point of banks consuming more electricity than the Bitcoin network is already addressed?

Further, it's simply ludicrous to include the energy consumed by bank's offices, branches, ATM networks, etc., etc. Feel free to ask me why

Transactions != mining.

The Bitcoin network can not handle more than 7tps.

Added block size does nothing for energy cost.

That wouldn't be Bitcoin, but an altcoin. Mods of bitcointalk and /r/bitcoin agree.

[Hyena]

Even if the goverments forbade bitcoin due to the global warming hoax, peercoin would take its place over night. There is no going back from cryptocurrencies. This is the new asset class and I am going to be soooo rich, with or without carbon emission.

[RyanX]

http://www.coindesk.com/microscope-conclusions-costs-bitcoin/

Good proof that bitcoin uses less than others, much less than banking system.

[Shiver]

7tps is a bit of a moot point.  The protocol can adapt to that easily, what we need is consensus on where we want it to go.

Personally I'm thinking the 2Mb/4Mb/8Mb it a decent compromise for now while we work out where it's going to go.  We can change if it turns out different than expected.  It's not baked in by any stretch of the imagination.

[ahpku]

7tps is a bit of a moot point.  The protocol can adapt to that easily, what we need is consensus on where we want it to go.

Therein lies the rub. No one agrees on how we should go about it, or what 'consensus' even means. 'My way or the highway' attitudes, the whole XT spectacle, 'stress tests,' the recent core patch...

[Hyena]

Even if the goverments forbade bitcoin due to the global warming hoax, peercoin would take its place over night. There is no going back from cryptocurrencies. This is the new asset class and I am going to be soooo rich, with or without carbon emission.

Bitcoin can also change to a proper PoS.

That would be great. I would still call it the original bitcoin because the original bitcoin was meant to be further developed by the community. Chainging from PoW to PoS is a community development.

[talks_cheep]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^
This.

With proper PoS, we can have staking & minting and get rid of physical mining gears. When your wallet is mining (staking and minting), very few people need to run mining hardware. No more waste of energy for mining, let's save the earth, every little bit helps. Look at Diamond coin (DMD), HyperStake (HYP), and Mintcoin. We should totally go PoS.

[anthonycamp]

you saw the graphic the gold mining and reciclyng are 100 worst than computer mining or hardware mining but ok stick to the non polute energy spend its also to be used into buy food and stuff soo computers do cows no.

[gentlemand]

There are mines in Iceland where almost all power is from geothermal and hydro sources and that is likely to be the wave of the future.

I think it's a little dumb to compare Bitcoin's usage to bank usage. Bank users number in the billions. Bitcoin might be a couple of million. If it's power per user then Bitcoin is far worse. If the number of users goes up that'll fall nicely.

[onemorexmr]

Have you done any research at all or is all of your information from Al Gore?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1191177.msg12701555#msg12701555
Do read before being rude.
>100x transactions
Impossible. 7tps max, 'burst rate.'

 ~ManBearPig

Transactions != mining.

Added block size does nothing for energy cost.

not true.

every transaction needs to be verified by EVERY node out there. so more transactions certainly need more energy.
but its probably negligible compared to mining.

[ahpku]

Even if the goverments forbade bitcoin due to the global warming hoax, peercoin would take its place over night. There is no going back from cryptocurrencies. This is the new asset class and I am going to be soooo rich, with or without carbon emission.

Bitcoin can also change to a proper PoS.

That would be great. I would still call it the original bitcoin because the original bitcoin was meant to be further developed by the community. Chainging from PoW to PoS is a community development.

Let's just call USD Bitcoin and be done with this.

... the graphic the gold mining and reciclyng are 100 worst than computer mining or hardware mining ...

There are a few things that use up more electricity than Bitcoin (industrial aluminum smelters, power grids of major cities, etc.) and are more detrimental to life (Zyclon B, AIDS, Bubonic plague, etc.), but none of those things [gold included] are banks or money, which is what Bitcoin is being compared to.

And you are correct, gold is ridiculous [as a store of value] in the 21st century, an anachronism. Gold's endless millennia of use (as opposed to Bitcoin's six) also gives it a bit of inertia, so phasing it out takes some time.

[!! pop]

http://www.coindesk.com/microscope-conclusions-costs-bitcoin/

http://media.coindesk.com/2014/07/Picture-23.png

Looks like government must close gold mining, fiat production & banking system before they close all bitcoin mining activity
Maybe we should make a slogan about it : "Use bitcoin to save earth", "Bitcoin for better air", or something like that

Gold mining is not great for environment.
Governments, being in the pocket of Big Business, are slow to regulate. It is happening tho.

But, i think we should compare bitcoin & bank when they same total active user or transaction to be fair

Not even then. We should only compare bank's servers (and only those dedicated to managing transactions) to Bitcoin. We don't include the energy consumed by BitPay/NeoBee/Mt.Gox offices in the bitcoin numbers, do we?  When projects need to be financed/risks assessed/loans made [that's what banks do], Bitcoin is no different from fiat -- got to have the same wetware and the associated brick and mortar.

[Elwar]

http://www.coindesk.com/microscope-conclusions-costs-bitcoin/
[stuff a bitcoin blog says]

Without checking your [dubious] data, how is gold mining/recycling related to banks, which, to our chagrin, deal exclusively with fiat money?
And how is it you've failed to read the link offered above, where the point of banks consuming more electricity than the Bitcoin network is already addressed?

Further, it's simply ludicrous to include the energy consumed by bank's offices, branches, ATM networks, etc., etc. Feel free to ask me why

Transactions != mining.

The Bitcoin network can not handle more than 7tps.

Added block size does nothing for energy cost.

That wouldn't be Bitcoin, but an altcoin. Mods of bitcointalk and /r/bitcoin agree.

Nevermind, was unaware of the trollness.

Mentioning the 7tps repeatedly should've clued me in.

[ahpku]

^^
Nothing trollish in what I said. I know that crying 'troll' once the untenability of your position becomes painfully clear is the norm 'round here, but consider addressing my points in lieu of flinging epithets.

Edit: A recent article adressing the scaling difficulties. Increasing the blocksize can hardly be called a technical triviality, some are calling it 'a civil war,' with accusations of 'commercial interests [] increasingly pulling bitcoin’s development into a particular vision.'

[Elwar]

^^
Nothing trollish in what I said. I know that crying 'troll' once the untenability of your position becomes painfully clear is the norm 'round here, but consider addressing my points in lieu of flinging epithets.

Edit: A recent article adressing the scaling difficulties. Increasing the blocksize can hardly be called a technical triviality, some are calling it 'a civil war,' with accusations of 'commercial interests [] increasingly pulling bitcoin’s development into a particular vision.'

Without checking your [dubious] data

Ya, I'll get right on that. 

[botany]

Most of the mining is done in countries like Iceland where electricity is cheap and clean (geo-thermal).
So the pollution angle doesn't come in at all.

[Supercrypt]

Most of the mining is done in countries like Iceland where electricity is cheap and clean (geo-thermal).
So the pollution angle doesn't come in at all.

I do not think even mining is done in some other countries that banning of mining is possible. Because people mine with their own cost of electricity. May be government push for new regulations for standard emission control rules for ASIC miners to reduce the heat generations.

[MasterYii]

Let's say some of you hope for mass adoption (do you ?)
The CO2 emissions would be way out of hand.
Gov have to make a new treaty to forbid bitcoin mining, or to allow only green energy mining.
Forget home mining since you would have to have your own solar plant.

I want to mention though that some of you in the forum have already invested in solar plant for their bitcoin miner. I would advise them to use that electricity for better use than to enable criminal transaction to occur under the radar.

 

I don't think bitcoins causing pollution, there are a lot of pollutants in the world that the government needs to pay attention with.

[Hyena]

Most of the mining is done in countries like Iceland where electricity is cheap and clean (geo-thermal).
So the pollution angle doesn't come in at all.

I do not think even mining is done in some other countries that banning of mining is possible. Because people mine with their own cost of electricity. May be government push for new regulations for standard emission control rules for ASIC miners to reduce the heat generations.

in the meanwhile we all know that carbon emission is not doing shit to the climate and the global warming is all a big scam to fill the pockets of big corporations.