ANN: Announcing code availability of the bitsofproof supernode

[justusranvier]

I was frequently attacked for being irresponsible

I hope you're not proving them right, but it's hard to be optimistic about that.

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[grau]

I was frequently attacked for being irresponsible

I hope you're not proving them right, but it's hard to be optimistic about that.

I worked very hard, and your above note is a great example of the thankfulness I received. To you too.

[solracx]

In contrary I was frequently attacked for being irresponsible releasing an alternative implementation, or rushing out features too early.

I think the dirty little truth about Bitcoin development and developers is that the code is deliberately made difficult to understand but for only the few.   An alternative cleaner implementation like bitsofproof or conformal is actually internally frowned upon because it reveals the 'secrets' of Bitcoin. 

In typical open source projects developers will be rushing enmass into the better structured version of the code.  But not with this community.

The Bitcoin community is not based on 'sharing' and 'community' that one finds in other open source groups.  Rather is is based on entirely the opposite 'hoarding' and 'exclusivity'.  Where any alternative idea is shot down with the most violent of arguments.

It is the worse community I have ever been associatated with.     

[grau]

In typical open source projects developers will be rushing enmass into the better structured version of the code.  But not with this community.

The Bitcoin community is not based on 'sharing' and 'community' that one finds in other open source groups.  Rather is is based on entirely the opposite 'hoarding' and 'exclusivity'.  Where any alternative idea is shot down with the most violent of arguments.

It is the worse community I have ever been associatated with.      

There are bright minds here and I learned a lot.

Bitcoin is special as mastering the code is becoming money and power without much indirection. Refactoring and alternate implementations are considered more of risk than a chance at community level.

At the project level BOP software is used to build services that would have been more difficult to build with satoshi.
I want to provide a good service to those customer and create more higher level products that convince others of the BOP platform.

Competing at the server level is at the moment an altruistic uphill battle. The open source code only attracted free rider and hater.

[solracx]

At the project level BOP software is used to build services that would have been more difficult to build with satoshi.I want to provide a good service to those customer and create more higher level products that convince others of the BOP platform.

Could you explain this a bit further?

What sort of services were created using BOP that you have done that would have been very difficult with the Satoshi client?

[grau]

At the project level BOP software is used to build services that would have been more difficult to build with satoshi.I want to provide a good service to those customer and create more higher level products that convince others of the BOP platform.

Could you explain this a bit further?

What sort of services were created using BOP that you have done that would have been very difficult with the Satoshi client?

An example that is known in the community is http://btc1k.com that deploys BopShop a payment processor built on top of BOP and a multi-signature P2SH vault and accompanying wallet used by the organizer. The entry to the event will also be validated by a BOP app.

BopShop is used by several web sites and the BeBop wallet also built on BOP servers in a few restaurants. I am in final testing of an exchange with truly unique technical proposition and back an other community wide known project. I will let them talk the right time.

Added: Each of above products have features you will not find in, and would be difficult to emulate with satoshi.

[grau]

Substantiating some claims, more to come...

myTREZOR Web Wallet to use BOP Bitcoin Server

http://www.bitcointrezor.com/news/2014-02-10-mytrezor-bop-bitcoin-server

[Dusty]

Hat off

[grau]

Substantiating some claims ...

https://bullionbitcoin.com

The first real-time audit able exchange, utilizing a  2-of-3 keyed P2SH vault.

[Amitabh S]

grau, can you also please release a precompiled version of bop?

[grau]

grau, can you also please release a precompiled version of bop?

Yes, I think that could become a good evaluation option. I will create a signed build with setup instructions within the next weeks.

I am very busy at the moment with launching AUREALS.

http://www.iconcapitalsa.com/posts/8-icon-capital-reserve-s-a-acquires-leading-digital-currency-developer-bits-of-proof-zrt

[jedunnigan]

You've done a lot of great and hard work on this, thank you.

The Server is available to customer.

Too bad is, that the community did not submit any substantial pulls and valued BOPs work to 0.3 BTC in 2013.

Just so you know, you're not doing your product any favours in the thread.

Complaining about not receiving much in the way of tips makes it look like you don't actually have any customers at all (otherwise you wouldn't care about your tip address), and regardless acting like this in public is going to turn off potential customers.

Overall I get the impression that you consider the community defective for not adopting your software instead of taking the weak response as an indication that your marketing outreach requires improvement.

I tried for one year, but the open source did not deliver any benefit to me. No substantial code contribution, no donation no offers from those who claim supporting the open source development of Bitcoin.

In contrary I was frequently attacked for being irresponsible releasing an alternative implementation, or rushing out features too early.

The same time I have paying customer and venture capitalists who wonder why I give away IP for free. I run out of arguments.

I respect and appreciate where your VCs are coming from, but look at it this way: I am a potential customer. I, as the operator of xyz company, am fully aware of the risks involved in searching for implementations outside the core code. One small mistake can lead to disastrous effects (see: gox).

I want to trust you and your platform, but I can't wholeheartedly. Without being able to audit your code I don't know if you haven't made a mistake in your implementation. And there is nothing you could really do to convince me otherwise without open sourcing it. You lost me as a customer, unfortunately.

[grau]

I respect and appreciate where your VCs are coming from, but look at it this way: I am a potential customer. I, as the operator of xyz company, am fully aware of the risks involved in searching for implementations outside the core code. One small mistake can lead to disastrous effects (see: gox).

I want to trust you and your platform, but I can't wholeheartedly. Without being able to audit your code I don't know if you haven't made a mistake in your implementation. And there is nothing you could really do to convince me otherwise without open sourcing it. You lost me as a customer, unfortunately.

The open source business model did not generate sufficient cash flow for expansion through support contracts.

We have some profitable projects like https://bullionbitcoin.com, http://bopshop.bitsofproof.com and http://www.bitcointrezor.com/news/2014-02-10-mytrezor-bop-bitcoin-server and a few undisclosed that proved the value of the software, that I could trade in for meaningful expansion See: http://www.iconcapitalsa.com/posts/8-icon-capital-reserve-s-a-acquires-leading-digital-currency-developer-bits-of-proof-zrt

I gave source code access to current customer and I evaluate every new piece of code we write if it is appropriate to open source it. Older versions and lots of useful functions are generally accessible open source even now.

BOPs development focus is now to create a software stack capable of issuing, trading, auditing digital assets. I am sure that we will open source huge portions of that and that others will be licensed with source code access.

[jedunnigan]

I respect and appreciate where your VCs are coming from, but look at it this way: I am a potential customer. I, as the operator of xyz company, am fully aware of the risks involved in searching for implementations outside the core code. One small mistake can lead to disastrous effects (see: gox).

I want to trust you and your platform, but I can't wholeheartedly. Without being able to audit your code I don't know if you haven't made a mistake in your implementation. And there is nothing you could really do to convince me otherwise without open sourcing it. You lost me as a customer, unfortunately.

The open source business model did not generate sufficient cash flow for expansion through support contracts.

We have some profitable projects like https://bullionbitcoin.com, http://bopshop.bitsofproof.com and http://www.bitcointrezor.com/news/2014-02-10-mytrezor-bop-bitcoin-server and a few undisclosed that proved the value of the software, that I could trade in for meaningful expansion See: http://www.iconcapitalsa.com/posts/8-icon-capital-reserve-s-a-acquires-leading-digital-currency-developer-bits-of-proof-zrt

I gave source code access to current customer and I evaluate every new piece of code we write if it is appropriate to open source it. Older versions and lots of useful functions are generally accessible open source even now.

BOPs development focus is now to create a software stack capable of issuing, trading, auditing digital assets. I am sure that we will open source huge portions of that and that others will be licensed with source code access.

Ah okay, so you share the source with your customers. That's good to know.

[Dusty]

Too bad a viable business model that included leaving the bop server open source (an apache project would be great) couldn't be found.

The Bitcoin economy is still in its infancy and many years shell pass before a community of contributors can form and evolve your project.

[arnuschky]

One problem I always had with BoP (I've been contemplating to use it several times, but never did): the site seems to severely undersell the product! I mean, I have no idea what BoP can do for me, how scalable it is, what the advantages are over using bitcoind etc.

In short: why should I use BoP rather than bitcoind?

This situation has gotten worse since it's not open source anymore. Unless I am missing something, there seems to be only a single page with very sparse info on it. Documentation? Code samples? Use cases? Anything?

I have the impression that you have more of a marketing problem rather than a community problem.

Just my 2 cents..

[Avicenna1]

Thanks for the warm welcome. Was nice to talk to you in London Mike.

I released the code since it reached the coverage needed to prove that it is for real. Not for production but to build on it as a platform.

Your points on testing are valid. They are clearly not sufficient. I plan to introduce an interface aimed for testing. That would enable
implementations to test each other.

The Wallet is not there but everything you need to stick it together in a couple hours or days depending on what you want.
I did not yet figured what I wanted. But the point is that this is a feature that does not have to be common.
Do your own at your own taste and stick it in.

+1 

[grau]

One problem I always had with BoP (I've been contemplating to use it several times, but never did): the site seems to severely undersell the product! I mean, I have no idea what BoP can do for me, how scalable it is, what the advantages are over using bitcoind etc.

In short: why should I use BoP rather than bitcoind?

This situation has gotten worse since it's not open source anymore. Unless I am missing something, there seems to be only a single page with very sparse info on it. Documentation? Code samples? Use cases? Anything?

I have the impression that you have more of a marketing problem rather than a community problem.

Just my 2 cents..

You are right.

The value is not visible from what is publicly available.
My current strategy is to create products that demonstrate that.

[judah]

Ah, I actually bought 2 months of Bits of Proof support late last year with the understanding the project would be open source.  Oh well, that sucks.

[Dusty]

I'm starting a bitcoin project and I was really looking to use bop for it, but I'm now forced to go with bitcoinj, too bad.