Corporal Punishment (Re: Our response to Dmytri Kleiner's misunderstanding of money

[cunicula]

Don't worry, he's got two very young daughters.  He'll get his due in another 12 years or so.

Alternately, you'll get your due when the world changes and starts treating all  parents who didn't renounce the use of force against children when they had the chance as social pariahs, to live out their twilight years isolated and alone.

It's possible you could be safe though. It might not happen this generation.

Maybe.

Ah, libertarianism shows its true colors. What you propose is not to remove the law, but to make the law unpredictable. i.e. replace moderate repression with repression of the most extreme kind.

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[justusranvier]

What you propose is not to remove the law, but to make the law unpredictable. i.e. replace moderate repression with repression of the most extreme kind.

I can see how you'd interpret it that way, if you are a sociopath.

For the rest of us who do have a conscience it's a a very predictable way to respond to evil.

[Crypt_Current]

Don't worry, he's got two very young daughters.  He'll get his due in another 12 years or so.

Alternately, you'll get your due when the world changes and starts treating all  parents who didn't renounce the use of force against children when they had the chance as social pariahs, to live out their twilight years isolated and alone.

As a third alternative, I could set up some sort of reminder to tell me to let MoonShadow know how they turned out. But a dozen years seems rather long to wait just for a "Ha! Told you so!"

If they're that young, yeah dude that's as good as not having any.
You'll learn, probably the hard way.  Are you even taking astrology or any sort of personality tests at the very least into consideration??
If not, you are going to end up with extremely unpredictable outcomes, guaranteed.
Human creatures are the most technologically complex machines in existench.  No matter how hard you try (control -- what you deplore?!?) you will end up with the opposite of what you expected, unless you successfully trick yourself.
Magick -- the Art and Science of causing Change to occur in accordance with Will
Take note.  What you see as shades of grey now will bloom into a bright spectrum of a rainbow.
Infrablack is still a color even if not perceived by any organism known.
Good luck and godspeed, sir.
Lol christianity,... lol islam, judaism...
Rationality...
IO CHORONZON.

[myrkul]

Don't worry, he's got two very young daughters.  He'll get his due in another 12 years or so.

Alternately, you'll get your due when the world changes and starts treating all  parents who didn't renounce the use of force against children when they had the chance as social pariahs, to live out their twilight years isolated and alone.

As a third alternative, I could set up some sort of reminder to tell me to let MoonShadow know how they turned out. But a dozen years seems rather long to wait just for a "Ha! Told you so!"

If they're that young, yeah dude that's as good as not having any.
You'll learn, probably the hard way.  Are you even taking astrology or any sort of personality tests at the very least into consideration??
<snip rambling that makes Dank look sane & sober>

Dude, either put the pipe down, or stop posting. It will save on regrets in the morning.

[cunicula]

I can see how you'd interpret it that way, if you are a sociopath.

For the rest of us who do have a conscience it's a a very predictable way to respond to evil.

Ah, anarchy:

Learn to emulate the transient characteristics of 'the rest of us' or be outed as an evil element / sociopath.

This has been tried before. See the Cultural Revolution.

That makes me think. Your principles are strikingly similar to Mao's ideas of perpetual revolution. The principle is that any petty tyrant should be overthrown by voluntary community movements. Therefore there can be no petty tyrants. Usually this was non-violent and just involved public humiliation. Sometimes excesses occurred.

[justusranvier]

Learn to emulate the transient characteristics of 'the rest of us' or be outed as an evil element / sociopath.

This has been tried before. See the Cultural Revolution.

Actually it's more a matter of just teaching their prey the skill of recognizing a sociopath's intellectual pollution for what it is.

Using the power of language to make a peaceful exercise of voluntary association appear equal to murder is a great example. Thanks for the demonstration.

[Crypt_Current]

Don't worry, he's got two very young daughters.  He'll get his due in another 12 years or so.

Alternately, you'll get your due when the world changes and starts treating all  parents who didn't renounce the use of force against children when they had the chance as social pariahs, to live out their twilight years isolated and alone.

As a third alternative, I could set up some sort of reminder to tell me to let MoonShadow know how they turned out. But a dozen years seems rather long to wait just for a "Ha! Told you so!"

If they're that young, yeah dude that's as good as not having any.
You'll learn, probably the hard way.  Are you even taking astrology or any sort of personality tests at the very least into consideration??
<snip rambling that makes Dank look sane & sober>

Dude, either put the pipe down, or stop posting. It will save on regrets in the morning.

No regrets.  Not even a pipe this time.  So... No?

[stochastic]

When I deal with kids I don't worry about what political philosophy I have.  Some kids need kindness, others need independence, and others just need a strong role model.  There is no one correct way.  It is different for each kid and the mood that they are in at the moment.

[Crypt_Current]

When I deal with kids I don't worry about what political philosophy I have.  Some kids need kindness, others need independence, and others just need a strong role model.  There is no one correct way.  It is different for each kid and the mood that they are in at the moment.

Exactly.  And some kids are born masochists.  XD

hey man i don't make up these cosmic rules.

[justusranvier]

This psychologist debunks the myth of human nature:

Parenting for a Peaceful World - A Conversation with Robin Grille

Robin Grille is a father, a psychologist in private practice with twenty years' experience, and a parenting educator. His articles on parenting and child development have been widely published in Australia and overseas. Robin's first book: 'Parenting for a Peaceful World' (2005) has received international acclaim and led to speaking engagements around Australia, USA and New Zealand. 'Heart to Heart Parenting' (ABC Books) is Robin's second book.

A passionate speaker and social change activist, Robin's extensive research has led him to feel that improved attention to babies' and children's emotional needs is the most powerful way to move societies toward sustainability and peace.

[augustocroppo]

This psychologist debunks the myth of human nature:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPKo7XbUZ-8

The human nature is not a myth. Your statement is false. The Youtube video is rather irrelevant.

[Rudd-O]

I had a feeling that you would gravitate to certain portions of that article.  I won't bother doing the same to you, although I easily could. 

Feel free. I doubt you could find anything so telling against my strategy as I found against yours. After all, I will be consistent in applying any restrictions, treat my children as people, with their own motivations, and encourage independence, to a much greater degree, in fact, than yourself.

In short, Bring it.

You're an inexperienced fool.  I can't believe this thread is still happening.
There are myriad ways to "encourage independence" and many of them are found through hands-on experience / trial-and-error, which you obviously have none of.
Armchair childrearing is probably the worst branch of armchair philosophy.
Have lots of kids and have "fun", jackass.

Crypt_Current attacks other people because he hates the ideas they introduce.  He has no arguments and nothing constructive to say -- only insults.  I think we know what kind of parenting produces a damaged individual like that.  I bet his parents or other authority figures dealt with his "troublesome thoughts" by shaming and insulting him.

[Rudd-O]

Don't worry, he's got two very young daughters.  He'll get his due in another 12 years or so.

Alternately, you'll get your due when the world changes and starts treating all  parents who didn't renounce the use of force against children when they had the chance as social pariahs, to live out their twilight years isolated and alone.

It's possible you could be safe though. It might not happen this generation.

Maybe.

Don't worry -- he'll get lots of uncomfortable Thanksgivings with the kids he abused.  I know what he won't get: a meaningful and deep relationship with the victims of his abuse.

[MoonShadow]

I had a feeling that you would gravitate to certain portions of that article.  I won't bother doing the same to you, although I easily could. 

Feel free. I doubt you could find anything so telling against my strategy as I found against yours. After all, I will be consistent in applying any restrictions, treat my children as people, with their own motivations, and encourage independence, to a much greater degree, in fact, than yourself.

In short, Bring it.

You're an inexperienced fool.  I can't believe this thread is still happening.
There are myriad ways to "encourage independence" and many of them are found through hands-on experience / trial-and-error, which you obviously have none of.
Armchair childrearing is probably the worst branch of armchair philosophy.
Have lots of kids and have "fun", jackass.

Crypt_Current attacks other people because he hates the ideas they introduce.  He has no arguments and nothing constructive to say -- only insults.  I think we know what kind of parenting produces a damaged individual like that.  I bet his parents or other authority figures dealt with his "troublesome thoughts" by shaming and insulting him.

That's enough of this crap, guys.  Keep it civil, even when you don't desrve it.

[stochastic]

To All Parents:

Your teenagers hate you no matter what you do.

[myrkul]

Relevant video/podcast from Stefan Molyneux:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vehigjflGHA

[justusranvier]

This is a clarification of an earlier post I made:

Children fully own themselves, yet by nature are not competent to manage their own affairs. Thus they require resources from someone else in order to survive. Some people interpret this situation to mean parents own their children and the care they provide incurs an debt which the children are obligated to repay but logically the opposite is true.

Children exist in a state of infirmary, not due their own actions and choices, but due to the actions and choices of their parents. The consequences of their state of dependency, then are the responsibility of their parents. The care and nurturing that a child needs in order to reach a state of being a competent adult is not a gift from the parents, but rather a debt the parents owe their children as compensation for bringing them into existence in a helpless state. Once this debt is satisfied the children owe their parents nothing.

If parents want to earn some kind of consideration from their children they have to go above and beyond merely supporting their children while they grow up. They need to earn consideration with virtuous behavior.

[Rudd-O]

This is a clarification of an earlier post I made:

Children fully own themselves, yet by nature are not competent to manage their own affairs. Thus they require resources from someone else in order to survive. Some people interpret this situation to mean parents own their children and the care they provide incurs an debt which the children are obligated to repay but logically the opposite is true.

Children exist in a state of infirmary, not due their own actions and choices, but due to the actions and choices of their parents. The consequences of their state of dependency, then are the responsibility of their parents. The care and nurturing that a child needs in order to reach a state of being a competent adult is not a gift from the parents, but rather a debt the parents owe their children as compensation for bringing them into existence in a helpless state. Once this debt is satisfied the children owe their parents nothing.

If parents want to earn some kind of consideration from their children they have to go above and beyond merely supporting their children while they grow up. They need to earn consideration with virtuous behavior.

Brilliantly put.

[myrkul]

Spanking as a pre-emptive conditioning measure:

[Rudd-O]

Spanking as a pre-emptive conditioning measure:

http://mimiandeunice.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/ME_407_Self-Defense-640x199.png

That's all that governments ever do when they punish nonviolent people.