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Author Topic: "Unfold" button in poker. Would that work?  (Read 1715 times)
pawel7777
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November 10, 2015, 10:43:21 AM
 #1


If you play poker often, you've probably heard someone joking 'how do I unfold?' or 'where's the unfold button?' after the flop.

What if there actually was one?

Would it be an interesting idea to create variation of i.e. standard no-limit Hold'em including 1 extra option: the 'Unfold button'?.
For example, it would only be active after the flop (but not after the turn or the river), there would be say 5 seconds pause after the flop to give time to 'folded' players to make decision whether they want to go back in the game or not.

To use that option, player would have to throw in 2x current pot on the table (but not as 'raise'), possibly there could also be additional fee payable directly to the house (say 0.2 of the current pot, non-refundable).

Would that work at all? Would it make the game more interesting, or on the contrary - too complex and unplayable?

Thoughts?


Disclaimer: The 'unfold button' implementation idea is an intellectual property of pawel7777, if you planning to use it on your poker site, the author would like to get paid Wink
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hopenotlate
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November 10, 2015, 11:08:29 AM
 #2

Not sure if I will like it, maybe not.
Am curious anyway to have a try at it.

Anyway following your line there could be an unbet/unraise option after flop drop down then.

pawel7777
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November 10, 2015, 11:30:29 AM
 #3

Not sure if I will like it, maybe not.
Am curious anyway to have a try at it.

Anyway following your line there could be an unbet/unraise option after flop drop down then.

That's not really feasible. Unraising would mean you have to reverse other players actions if they already reacted (called/folded). And why would you raise in the first place if you want to unraise.


The purpose of 'unfold' would be just to add additional tool, which doesn't change the principle of the game. Adding 1 extra factor could make it more interesting, currently playing holdem can often be a bit stale, especially if players are familiar with each other.

Also, 1 extra factor could make it much harder for the poker bots, and it could increase the revenue of the pokers site (if the fee is included, as per my original post).
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November 10, 2015, 11:54:59 AM
 #4

Lol.. I don't think Unfold button will be in Poker site. I think people will cheating if there is any Unfold button after the flop

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pawel7777
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November 10, 2015, 11:59:57 AM
 #5

Lol.. I don't think Unfold button will be in Poker site. I think people will cheating if there is any Unfold button after the flop

Cheating how?

This is not an idea to replace the current, popular variations (Holdem, Omaha), just an idea for another fun/experimental variation, just to spice the game up.
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November 10, 2015, 12:08:52 PM
 #6

i believe that can be exploitable and someone can just use that method to win easily.

pawel7777
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November 10, 2015, 12:11:41 PM
 #7

i believe that can be exploitable and someone can just use that method to win easily.

Care to describe the possible exploit you have in mind?
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November 10, 2015, 12:52:59 PM
 #8

I don't think this would in any way ever be a good idea. It removes a lot of skill and decision making that differentiates good poker players from good poker players. Even if you 'punish' the person unfolding by doubling the bet or pot. Also it's very easy to exploit or cheat using this especially if you have a group of friends or people you know that you'll play with and organise with. If you fold you fold, it should stay that way.
pawel7777
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November 10, 2015, 01:19:58 PM
 #9

I don't think this would in any way ever be a good idea. It removes a lot of skill and decision making that differentiates good poker players from good poker players.
...

Wouldn't it be the opposite? The more options/factors you have in the game, the more skills it takes to analyse and to make a move. Something like chess Vs. checkers.

Also it's very easy to exploit or cheat using this especially if you have a group of friends or people you know that you'll play with and organise with. If you fold you fold, it should stay that way.

Same as above. More factors should make it harder for organised group to operate.
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November 10, 2015, 02:29:17 PM
 #10

I don't think this would in any way ever be a good idea. It removes a lot of skill and decision making that differentiates good poker players from good poker players.
...

Wouldn't it be the opposite? The more options/factors you have in the game, the more skills it takes to analyse and to make a move. Something like chess Vs. checkers.

Also it's very easy to exploit or cheat using this especially if you have a group of friends or people you know that you'll play with and organise with. If you fold you fold, it should stay that way.

Same as above. More factors should make it harder for organised group to operate.

IMO a very good idea but it would give the more skilled poker players even more advantage over the
average player.

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November 10, 2015, 02:33:26 PM
 #11


If you play poker often, you've probably heard someone joking 'how do I unfold?' or 'where's the unfold button?' after the flop.

What if there actually was one?

Would it be an interesting idea to create variation of i.e. standard no-limit Hold'em including 1 extra option: the 'Unfold button'?.
For example, it would only be active after the flop (but not after the turn or the river), there would be say 5 seconds pause after the flop to give time to 'folded' players to make decision whether they want to go back in the game or not.

To use that option, player would have to throw in 2x current pot on the table (but not as 'raise'), possibly there could also be additional fee payable directly to the house (say 0.2 of the current pot, non-refundable).

Would that work at all? Would it make the game more interesting, or on the contrary - too complex and unplayable?

Thoughts?


Disclaimer: The 'unfold button' implementation idea is an intellectual property of pawel7777, if you planning to use it on your poker site, the author would like to get paid Wink

Interesting idea, there are no fold button after flop  Cheesy
Don't know if it will implement on some poker sites or not.
Not all players want to play this "funny game" but sometimes they will..!
pawel7777
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November 10, 2015, 04:32:51 PM
 #12


IMO a very good idea but it would give the more skilled poker players even more advantage over the
average player.


Possibly, but from I've noticed most 'average' (or inexperienced) players can be classified as 'tight passive', meaning they rarely bluff and only call with good hand. Those players are likely to fold before the flop (especially when someone raises). 'Unfold' could give them a second chance, when shitty hand turns out to be not-so-shitty.

So this could work both ways. Better skilled players will still have advantage and will profit more in the long run, but the less-skilled could have potentially more winning chances in the short run.
katerniko1
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November 10, 2015, 04:41:03 PM
 #13

this looks interesting but it should be implented somewhere so we can all try it as i cant say for sure how will that work.
regards.
-Katerniko1

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November 10, 2015, 04:50:51 PM
 #14


IMO a very good idea but it would give the more skilled poker players even more advantage over the
average player.


Possibly, but from I've noticed most 'average' (or inexperienced) players can be classified as 'tight passive', meaning they rarely bluff and only call with good hand. Those players are likely to fold before the flop (especially when someone raises). 'Unfold' could give them a second chance, when shitty hand turns out to be not-so-shitty.

So this could work both ways. Better skilled players will still have advantage and will profit more in the long run, but the less-skilled could have potentially more winning chances in the short run.


I like the idea and would like to see it implemented to have some hands on this table Smiley

what I would do is (and I am sure many would do) to fold pocket AA KK QQ JJ if I am in a position that I know that there is a bet and a flop will be seen and unfold Smiley

good luck and lets hope some operator will give it a chance to test it

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November 10, 2015, 04:52:32 PM
 #15

this looks interesting but it should be implented somewhere so we can all try it as i cant say for sure how will that work.
regards.
-Katerniko1

Definitely. It works in theory (imho) but in practice it could be absolute crap. Would love to test it though.

Unlikely any site will implement it anytime soon, unless there are site owners out there who are looking for something brave and innovative that no one else has done before.
WhatTheGox
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November 10, 2015, 04:52:43 PM
 #16


If you play poker often, you've probably heard someone joking 'how do I unfold?' or 'where's the unfold button?' after the flop.

What if there actually was one?

Would it be an interesting idea to create variation of i.e. standard no-limit Hold'em including 1 extra option: the 'Unfold button'?.
For example, it would only be active after the flop (but not after the turn or the river), there would be say 5 seconds pause after the flop to give time to 'folded' players to make decision whether they want to go back in the game or not.

To use that option, player would have to throw in 2x current pot on the table (but not as 'raise'), possibly there could also be additional fee payable directly to the house (say 0.2 of the current pot, non-refundable).

Would that work at all? Would it make the game more interesting, or on the contrary - too complex and unplayable?

Thoughts?


Disclaimer: The 'unfold button' implementation idea is an intellectual property of pawel7777, if you planning to use it on your poker site, the author would like to get paid Wink

Very interesting idea actually ive never heard this before and been around poker for years.  Players would have to buy back in after folding but how do you judge how much they have to pay to buy back in.  It would have to be judged by the people who raised the pot in order to fold them out - or if there is no raiser they'd have to pay something like BB x2.

It makes for a very interesting game maybe as people could unfold and bluff very often.  I actually really like it OP great idea, it would need to be a separate game entirely, it would not fit into normal games like fold and show did for example.

I think this needs to be talked about more.
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November 10, 2015, 05:01:37 PM
 #17

this looks interesting but it should be implented somewhere so we can all try it as i cant say for sure how will that work.
regards.
-Katerniko1

Definitely. It works in theory (imho) but in practice it could be absolute crap. Would love to test it though.

Unlikely any site will implement it anytime soon, unless there are site owners out there who are looking for something brave and innovative that no one else has done before.
well they could add it on couple tables they dont need to make whole new code from scratch Smiley
you can try emailing luckyflop admin i think he could be for that
regards.
-Katerniko1

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November 10, 2015, 05:07:59 PM
 #18

I think it is at least worth a trial to see how it works in reality, if it is a 'flop' Smiley then at least you tried but definitely worth a shot.

pawel7777
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November 10, 2015, 05:21:51 PM
 #19


Very interesting idea actually ive never heard this before and been around poker for years.  Players would have to buy back in after folding but how do you judge how much they have to pay to buy back in.  It would have to be judged by the people who raised the pot in order to fold them out - or if there is no raiser they'd have to pay something like BB x2.
...

Thanks.

The optimal 'buy back' is yet to be decided. I used 2x pot (+possible house fee, but lets leave that for now). Example with 3 players (pre-flop) and BB of 100:

A (SB): calls
B (BB): checks
C: folds

So the total pot is 200. If, after the flop, player C wants to 'unfold' - he has to pay 2x pot so 400. But 'unfolding' doesn't mean raising, so all 3 players are now in the game, but the total pot increased to 600. And then the action continues (calling/checking/raising).


well they could add it on couple tables they dont need to make whole new code from scratch Smiley
you can try emailing luckyflop admin i think he could be for that
regards.
-Katerniko1

Doesn't LF use 3rd party software on their site? Are they able to significantly change the code just for one table?
Maybe I'll give them a shout.
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November 10, 2015, 05:34:37 PM
 #20

This could be a good or a bad idea .It would be a bad idea if the opposite person has good cards he can lose out on winnings and vica versa.Other way round it can give a nice chance for the unlucky one to save some cash.There should be a unfold button provided he has to pay some mbtc to use that service.

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