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Author Topic: GOOD NEWS! GLBSE is sending out shareholders data  (Read 6247 times)
fellowtraveler
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December 07, 2012, 10:22:38 AM
 #41

I discussed the open transactions server stuff a bit with several members here on the forums.  I didn't really like how it worked.  It's not how you'd think it would work, all decentralized like bitcoin itself.  It was more like a network of exchanges (each server = it's own exchange) that could trade assets around.  Even the trading of the assets was not what I thought, as a single issue could not leave a single server.  (if you have sheep on server A, and goats on server B, sheep could not move A to B.  You have to trade sheep for goats, -or- the issuer has to issue sheep on both servers.)  I could accomplish nearly the same thing if I added a secure cross-site trading plugin to LTC-GLOBAL, then open sourced the code.

If an issuer issues sheep onto servers A, B and C, then the "sheep" currency is now available on three servers.

If you redeem a cheque that was drawn from an account on server A, then your wallet will naturally redeem it at server A,
just the same as a web browser trying to display an image from webserver A, would download that image from webserver A.
(In both cases, the client software just accesses the appropriate server based on what's in the URL.)

There are several ways to move your "sheep" from Server A to Server B:

1. Anyone who has a "sheep" account on both servers, can perform this transfer for you.

2. Including, obviously, the issuer himself. He can take sheep from you on Server A, and give you sheep on Server B.
   (In fact, anyone with accounts on both servers can do this.)

3. You could sell the Sheep on the exchange in return for Bitcoins. Then withdraw the Bitcoins from the server directly, and move them onto server B, where you use the BTC to purchase Sheep again.

4. A protocol could be devised between servers that allows them to open accounts with each other, and thus perform "wire transfers" on behalf of their users.


Quote
There are single point of failure issues with OT because all the assets go poof if the server they are on goes offline.

This is not correct. The whole idea with OT is that the user stores his last signed receipt, and is thus able to prove his balance, as well as which instruments are valid, simply via that last signed receipt. In other words, the receipt is the account, and both parties have a copy of it.

Quote
Problem also emerges that you might have 100 people all running their own "exchange", making it all that much harder for the trustworthy operators to rise above the noise.

Remember that the OT server cannot change balances or forge receipts. (Your signed request appears on every server-signed receipt. So the server cannot forge a receipt because it cannot forge your signature, because it does not have your private key.)

And as long as the issuer has an auditing protocol in place that meets his standards, then the server cannot commit inflation either.

Therefore, whether there are 100 servers, or 1000 servers, they cannot defraud the issuers or users.

Quote
(OT guys feel free to correct me if I'm wrong!)

I don't want to start a flame war or anything.  I admire the work the OT guys are doing.  Just saying that based on what was described to me, it's not yet ready for prime-time.  It has some design flaws that need worked out so that it works more like bitcoin itself, totally distributed and independent of any single point of control or failure.
Cheers.

Thanks for the opportunity  :-)



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December 07, 2012, 10:14:05 PM
 #42

Thank you for taking the time to explain all that.  Definitely helped me understand it better.

The signed receipts as a record sound really helpful.  If the OT server goes offline, then the asset holders can send their receipts to the asset issuer and the asset issuer can use them to determine amounts held?  How does it prevent double spend?  Eg:

- I buy 50 sheep
- I sell 50 sheep
- I buy 50 sheep

I now hold two receipts, representing purchases of 50 sheep.  Is there something the asset issuer can use to tell that the first 50 sheep were sold off?

Cheers.

fellowtraveler
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December 08, 2012, 01:25:18 PM
 #43

Thank you for taking the time to explain all that.  Definitely helped me understand it better.

The signed receipts as a record sound really helpful.  If the OT server goes offline, then the asset holders can send their receipts to the asset issuer and the asset issuer can use them to determine amounts held?  How does it prevent double spend?  Eg:

- I buy 50 sheep
- I sell 50 sheep
- I buy 50 sheep

I now hold two receipts, representing purchases of 50 sheep.  Is there something the asset issuer can use to tell that the first 50 sheep were sold off?

Cheers.

Each new receipt, you must sign the new balance.

So if you have a 0 balance, and then you receive 50 sheep, you sign a receipt that says, "My balance is 0. I'm receiving 50 sheep. My new balance will be 50."

Then let's say you receive another 50 sheep: "My balance is 50 sheep. I'm receiving 50 more sheep. My new balance will be 100."

Then let's say you send 50 sheep to Bob:  "My balance is 100 sheep. Please send 50 sheep to Bob. My new balance will be 50."


See? You must sign the balance on each new request. Therefore the most recent receipt shows the current balance, with your signature on it (and the server's signature.)

Therefore in any dispute, the winner is the one with the newest receipt.

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December 09, 2012, 05:33:34 AM
 #44

Thank you for taking the time to explain all that.  Definitely helped me understand it better.

The signed receipts as a record sound really helpful.  If the OT server goes offline, then the asset holders can send their receipts to the asset issuer and the asset issuer can use them to determine amounts held?  How does it prevent double spend?  Eg:

- I buy 50 sheep
- I sell 50 sheep
- I buy 50 sheep

I now hold two receipts, representing purchases of 50 sheep.  Is there something the asset issuer can use to tell that the first 50 sheep were sold off?

Cheers.

Each new receipt, you must sign the new balance.

So if you have a 0 balance, and then you receive 50 sheep, you sign a receipt that says, "My balance is 0. I'm receiving 50 sheep. My new balance will be 50."

Then let's say you receive another 50 sheep: "My balance is 50 sheep. I'm receiving 50 more sheep. My new balance will be 100."

Then let's say you send 50 sheep to Bob:  "My balance is 100 sheep. Please send 50 sheep to Bob. My new balance will be 50."


See? You must sign the balance on each new request. Therefore the most recent receipt shows the current balance, with your signature on it (and the server's signature.)

Therefore in any dispute, the winner is the one with the newest receipt.


Sounds pretty solid.  I like it.

I'm gonna have to start building a web frontend for it or something.  Smiley

minimalB
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August 08, 2013, 07:22:59 AM
 #45

What happened with "sending out shareholders data"?
Did you guys received anything?

It's almost a year and I haven't received a single email and (as expected) i was never sent BTCs that i had on GLBSE account.

So, it's game over i guess?

Any input is appreciated. Thanks.
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August 08, 2013, 12:33:02 PM
 #46

What happened with "sending out shareholders data"?
Did you guys received anything?

It's almost a year and I haven't received a single email and (as expected) i was never sent BTCs that i had on GLBSE account.

So, it's game over i guess?

Any input is appreciated. Thanks.

Some people like to pretend like the data was sent.

The fact of the matter is Nefario with a few friends doctored the listings and stole most of the BTC/more valuable assets.

Hopefully the UK's equivalent of the SEC catches up and we see some filings.

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PsychoticBoy
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August 14, 2013, 04:20:59 PM
 #47

What happened with "sending out shareholders data"?
Did you guys received anything?

It's almost a year and I haven't received a single email and (as expected) i was never sent BTCs that i had on GLBSE account.

So, it's game over i guess?

Any input is appreciated. Thanks.

Some people like to pretend like the data was sent.

The fact of the matter is Nefario with a few friends doctored the listings and stole most of the BTC/more valuable assets.

Hopefully the UK's equivalent of the SEC catches up and we see some filings.

LMFAO, I think the SEC will visit the Gypsy trader aka Mircea Popescu first to shut down his Once in a lifetime Wonder Bazar aka MPex.
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